Born Thick, Settled Thin
Astronomy Daily: Latest Space NewsOctober 22, 2026x
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00:21:3719.84 MB

Born Thick, Settled Thin

Show notes The Milky Way's disc settled in two stages; metal-rich gas around Sgr A*; two mirror-image simulated universes; shadows in the Orion Bar; quick hits on Hera, Uzbekistan and Artemis; Orionid-night skywatch. Sources · IAC — Milky Way's disc formed in two very distinct stages — https://www.iac.es/en/outreach/news/research-iac-reveals-milky-ways-disc-formed-two-very-distinct-stages · Mirabal et al. — ApJL 1010 L38 — https://doi.org/10.3847/2041-8213/aeb0a3 · McGill — Gas around Milky Way's central black hole is rich in metals — https://www.mcgill.ca/newsroom/channels/news/gas-around-milky-ways-central-black-hole-rich-metals-study-finds-375101 · Ford et al. — AJ (DOI) — http://doi.org/10.3847/1538-3881/ae994d · Ford et al. — arXiv 2605.13995 — https://arxiv.org/abs/2605.13995 · Argonne — Aurora powers two of the largest cosmological simulations — https://www.anl.gov/article/argonnes-aurora-supercomputer-powers-two-of-the-largest-cosmological-simulations-to-date · UDE — New 3D model reveals hidden chemistry of stellar nurseries — https://www.uni-due.de/2026-10-16-publication-aa-brandt-gaches-3d-model-en · Gaches et al. — A&A 714 A295 — https://doi.org/10.1051/0004-6361/202660769 · ESA — Finding Hera's way: Flight Dynamics team in action — https://www.esa.int/Space_Safety/Hera/Finding_Hera_s_way_Flight_Dynamics_team_in_action · Kun.uz — Uzbekistan joins Artemis Accords — https://kun.uz/en/news/2026/10/19/uzbekistan-joins-artemis-accords-on-peaceful-space-exploration · NASA — To discuss Artemis acceleration, status of upcoming Moon missions — https://nasa.gov/news-release/nasa-to-discuss-artemis-acceleration-status-of-upcoming-moon-missions · The Planetary Society — Night sky, October 2026 — https://www.planetary.org/night-sky/night-sky-what-to-see-this-month

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This episode includes AI-generated content.


00:00:00 --> 00:00:02 Anna: Welcome back, everyone. Lovely to have you.

00:00:02 --> 00:00:05 Join us for today's episode. 12 billion

00:00:05 --> 00:00:08 years ago, the Milky Way was not the thin,

00:00:08 --> 00:00:10 elegant spiral we pictured. It was

00:00:10 --> 00:00:13 puffed up, turbulent and restless.

00:00:14 --> 00:00:16 Avery: And now, thanks to some extraordinarily

00:00:16 --> 00:00:19 precise stellar ages, astronomers can tell us

00:00:19 --> 00:00:22 when it calmed down and how fast.

00:00:23 --> 00:00:26 Anna: Welcome to Astronomy AstroDailyPod. I'm Anna.

00:00:26 --> 00:00:29 Avery: And I'm avery. It's Wednesday 21st

00:00:29 --> 00:00:31 October, 2026, and this is

00:00:31 --> 00:00:34 episode 210 of series five

00:00:34 --> 00:00:35 today,

00:00:35 --> 00:00:38 Anna: how our galaxy's disc settled in two very

00:00:38 --> 00:00:41 different stages. Then the gas around the

00:00:41 --> 00:00:43 black hole at the centre of the Milky Way

00:00:43 --> 00:00:45 turns out to be rich in metals.

00:00:45 --> 00:00:47 Avery: We'll meet two of the largest simulated

00:00:47 --> 00:00:50 universes ever built, find shadows

00:00:50 --> 00:00:53 shaping the chemistry of a stellar nursery in

00:00:53 --> 00:00:55 Orion. And it's Orionid Night, so

00:00:55 --> 00:00:56 we'll tell you when to look.

00:00:57 --> 00:00:58 Anna: Let's get into it.

00:00:58 --> 00:01:01 Avery: Okay, let's get stuck into our first story,

00:01:01 --> 00:01:01 then.

00:01:01 --> 00:01:04 Anna: Let's start with a picture of our own galaxy.

00:01:05 --> 00:01:07 If you could fly out of the Milky Way and

00:01:07 --> 00:01:10 look at it edge on, most of its stars would

00:01:10 --> 00:01:13 sit in a flat disc. But it's really

00:01:13 --> 00:01:15 two discs, one inside the other.

00:01:16 --> 00:01:19 Avery: A fin disc and a thick disc.

00:01:19 --> 00:01:22 Anna: Exactly. The thin disc holds the younger

00:01:22 --> 00:01:25 stars, including the sun, packed close to the

00:01:25 --> 00:01:28 galactic plane. The thick disc is older,

00:01:28 --> 00:01:30 puffier, and its stars wander much

00:01:30 --> 00:01:32 further above and below the plane.

00:01:33 --> 00:01:35 Jerry Gilmore and Neil Reed identified it

00:01:35 --> 00:01:38 from star counts back in 1983. And

00:01:38 --> 00:01:41 ever since, the question has been, how did

00:01:41 --> 00:01:43 the galaxy end up with two?

00:01:43 --> 00:01:45 Avery: And there are two main stories, aren't, uh,

00:01:45 --> 00:01:45 there.

00:01:46 --> 00:01:48 Anna: There are. Story one.

00:01:49 --> 00:01:51 Stars are always born in a thin,

00:01:51 --> 00:01:54 orderly disc. And over billions of years,

00:01:54 --> 00:01:55 they get shaken up.

00:01:55 --> 00:01:58 Encounters with giant gas clouds, spiral

00:01:58 --> 00:02:01 arms, the central bar. Each one

00:02:01 --> 00:02:03 kicks a star a little further from the plane.

00:02:04 --> 00:02:06 In that picture, the thick disc is just the

00:02:06 --> 00:02:08 old, well shaken part of

00:02:08 --> 00:02:11 Avery: the thin disc, like a stack of paper that

00:02:11 --> 00:02:13 gets messier the longer it sits on a busy

00:02:13 --> 00:02:14 desk.

00:02:14 --> 00:02:17 Anna: Nice. Story two is called the

00:02:17 --> 00:02:20 upside down model. Here, the disc

00:02:20 --> 00:02:23 is born thick because the gas that forms the

00:02:23 --> 00:02:25 first stars is wildly turbulent.

00:02:26 --> 00:02:28 As that gas calms and settles towards the

00:02:28 --> 00:02:31 plane, each new generation of stars forms in

00:02:31 --> 00:02:34 a thinner layer. So the galaxy builds

00:02:34 --> 00:02:37 itself from the top down, thick first,

00:02:37 --> 00:02:37 then later.

00:02:38 --> 00:02:40 Avery: And, um, simulations can produce both.

00:02:41 --> 00:02:43 Anna: That's been the frustrating part. Both

00:02:43 --> 00:02:46 scenarios work in computer models. To

00:02:46 --> 00:02:48 tell them apart. In the real Milky Way, you

00:02:48 --> 00:02:50 need to know how the thickness of the disc

00:02:50 --> 00:02:52 changed with time. And that means knowing the

00:02:52 --> 00:02:55 ages of a lot of stars very precisely,

00:02:55 --> 00:02:58 including the oldest Ones, which is famously

00:02:58 --> 00:02:58 hard.

00:02:59 --> 00:03:01 Avery: So how did this team do it?

00:03:01 --> 00:03:03 Anna: The study comes from David Mirabal, a, uh,

00:03:03 --> 00:03:06 pre doctoral researcher at the Instituto de

00:03:06 --> 00:03:08 Astrophysica de Canarias and and the

00:03:08 --> 00:03:11 University of La Laguna with Carme Gillart

00:03:11 --> 00:03:14 and colleagues in Spain, Italy and Canada.

00:03:14 --> 00:03:17 It was published online on 16 October in the

00:03:17 --> 00:03:20 Astrophysical journal Letters, with the

00:03:20 --> 00:03:21 Institute's release on Monday.

00:03:21 --> 00:03:22 Avery: And the data?

00:03:23 --> 00:03:26 Anna: Gaia, the European Space Agency's

00:03:26 --> 00:03:28 star mapping mission, which measured the

00:03:28 --> 00:03:30 positions, motions and brightness of more

00:03:30 --> 00:03:32 than a billion stars.

00:03:32 --> 00:03:35 But Gaia doesn't hand you ages directly.

00:03:35 --> 00:03:37 That's where a project called Chronogal comes

00:03:37 --> 00:03:40 in. Instead of dating stars one at a time,

00:03:40 --> 00:03:43 it fits the whole colour magnitude diagram

00:03:43 --> 00:03:45 of a, uh, complete sample of stars in the

00:03:45 --> 00:03:48 solar neighbourhood, essentially reading the

00:03:48 --> 00:03:51 population's history from how its stars are

00:03:51 --> 00:03:52 spread across that diagram.

00:03:53 --> 00:03:55 Avery: Give me an everyday version of that.

00:03:55 --> 00:03:58 Anna: Think of a national census. You can't

00:03:58 --> 00:04:00 interview everyone about their birthday, but

00:04:00 --> 00:04:02 if you know how many people of each age a

00:04:02 --> 00:04:04 population should have depends on, and how

00:04:04 --> 00:04:06 births and deaths shape the numbers, the

00:04:06 --> 00:04:09 overall age pyramid tells you a great deal

00:04:09 --> 00:04:11 about the country's history. Chronogal does

00:04:11 --> 00:04:14 something similar with stars, using models of

00:04:14 --> 00:04:16 how stars of different ages and compositions

00:04:16 --> 00:04:18 should be spread across the diagram and

00:04:18 --> 00:04:21 fitting the real distribution Gaia measured.

00:04:21 --> 00:04:23 Avery: And, um, how precise is that?

00:04:24 --> 00:04:27 Anna: Better than 5% for the oldest

00:04:27 --> 00:04:30 stars. That's an uncertainty of around half

00:04:30 --> 00:04:33 a billion years, but which at an age of

00:04:33 --> 00:04:35 11 or 12 billion years is

00:04:35 --> 00:04:36 remarkable.

00:04:36 --> 00:04:39 The team grouped stars into what they call

00:04:39 --> 00:04:42 quasi monoage populationsstars

00:04:42 --> 00:04:45 of nearly the same age and chemistry, and

00:04:45 --> 00:04:47 then measured how far each group spreads

00:04:47 --> 00:04:50 above and below the plane. Astronomers call

00:04:50 --> 00:04:51 that the scale height.

00:04:51 --> 00:04:53 Avery: So which story won?

00:04:53 --> 00:04:56 Anna: The data show a, uh, clear. The younger the

00:04:56 --> 00:04:59 stars, the closer they hug the plane. But the

00:04:59 --> 00:05:02 rate isn't steady. There's a turning point

00:05:02 --> 00:05:04 about 10.8 billion years ago.

00:05:05 --> 00:05:06 Avery: Before and after.

00:05:07 --> 00:05:09 Anna: Before it, the disc flattened very

00:05:09 --> 00:05:12 fast. In just 2 billion years, the scale

00:05:12 --> 00:05:15 height dropped from more than 4

00:05:15 --> 00:05:18 light years to about 1.

00:05:18 --> 00:05:21 After the turning point, the thinning became

00:05:21 --> 00:05:24 very gradual, down to around 400

00:05:24 --> 00:05:26 light years for the youngest stars today.

00:05:26 --> 00:05:29 Avery: And why does that point to upside down?

00:05:29 --> 00:05:32 Anna: Because slow, steady heating can't do

00:05:32 --> 00:05:35 that. If stars were all born thin

00:05:35 --> 00:05:38 and gradually kicked upward, you'd expect the

00:05:38 --> 00:05:40 disc's thickness to change slowly and

00:05:40 --> 00:05:43 smoothly with age. A, uh, collapse that

00:05:43 --> 00:05:46 steep, that early in a young galaxy that

00:05:46 --> 00:05:48 was regularly colliding with smaller ones

00:05:49 --> 00:05:51 fits gas that started turbulent and then

00:05:51 --> 00:05:53 settled in the Author's words.

00:05:53 --> 00:05:56 An initial highly turbulent epoch gave

00:05:56 --> 00:05:59 birth to the thick disc and a calmer

00:05:59 --> 00:06:02 period of gradual gas settling built the thin

00:06:02 --> 00:06:02 disc.

00:06:03 --> 00:06:04 Avery: Mirabal's pretty confident about it.

00:06:04 --> 00:06:07 Anna: He says the result resolves a classic

00:06:07 --> 00:06:10 problem in astrophysics and calls it the

00:06:10 --> 00:06:13 first clear observational evidence favouring

00:06:13 --> 00:06:15 one of the two models for the galaxy's early

00:06:15 --> 00:06:15 stages.

00:06:16 --> 00:06:18 Avery: This lines up with a few things we've

00:06:18 --> 00:06:18 covered.

00:06:19 --> 00:06:19 Anna: It does.

00:06:20 --> 00:06:23 Back in episode 199, we looked at Andromeda,

00:06:23 --> 00:06:25 where clustered supernovae turned out to be

00:06:25 --> 00:06:28 enough to keep a, ah, galaxy's gas turning.

00:06:28 --> 00:06:30 This is the other half of that story. What

00:06:30 --> 00:06:32 happens to a disc as that turbulence dies

00:06:32 --> 00:06:35 down? And in episode 205 we covered the

00:06:35 --> 00:06:38 Sagittarius dwarf galaxy and its own disc

00:06:38 --> 00:06:40 history. The Milky Way's neighbours are being

00:06:40 --> 00:06:41 dated the same way.

00:06:41 --> 00:06:44 Avery: 10.8 billion years ago. Isn't M that

00:06:44 --> 00:06:46 around when the Milky Way swallowed a big

00:06:46 --> 00:06:46 neighbour?

00:06:47 --> 00:06:50 Anna: It's in the right neighbourhood. Gaia data

00:06:50 --> 00:06:52 showed years ago that the young Milky Way

00:06:52 --> 00:06:54 merged with a sizable dwarf galaxy,

00:06:55 --> 00:06:58 usually called Gaia Enceladus, or the

00:06:58 --> 00:07:00 Gaia sausage, somewhere around 10

00:07:00 --> 00:07:03 billion years ago, or a bit earlier.

00:07:04 --> 00:07:06 It's tempting to say the merger ended the

00:07:06 --> 00:07:09 turbulent phase, but this paper doesn't make

00:07:09 --> 00:07:10 that claim.

00:07:10 --> 00:07:12 And the dating of the merger has its own

00:07:12 --> 00:07:15 error bars. So we'll leave it as an open

00:07:15 --> 00:07:18 question and a good one for the next study to

00:07:18 --> 00:07:18 test.

00:07:18 --> 00:07:20 Avery: And, um, the sovereign angle.

00:07:21 --> 00:07:23 Anna: Honestly, there's no Australian team on this

00:07:23 --> 00:07:26 one. But two things are worth knowing.

00:07:26 --> 00:07:28 Gaia's data came home partly through the

00:07:28 --> 00:07:31 European Space Agency's 35 metre

00:07:31 --> 00:07:34 antenna at New NORSHA in Western Australia.

00:07:35 --> 00:07:37 And the same question is being attacked from

00:07:37 --> 00:07:40 the chemical side by gala, the survey run on

00:07:40 --> 00:07:42 the Anglo Australian Telescope at Siding

00:07:42 --> 00:07:44 Spring, which measures the makeup of hundreds

00:07:44 --> 00:07:47 of thousands of stars. Ages and

00:07:47 --> 00:07:49 chemistry together are, um, how galactic

00:07:49 --> 00:07:50 archaeology gets done.

00:07:51 --> 00:07:52 Avery: What should we be careful about?

00:07:53 --> 00:07:56 Anna: Three things. First, this is the

00:07:56 --> 00:07:58 solar neighbourhood, a complete local sample,

00:07:58 --> 00:08:01 not the whole disc. Other parts of the galaxy

00:08:01 --> 00:08:04 may have settled differently. Second, the

00:08:04 --> 00:08:06 authors strongly support the upside down

00:08:06 --> 00:08:09 scenario. That's not the same as ruling

00:08:09 --> 00:08:11 heating out entirely. Later heating still

00:08:11 --> 00:08:13 happened. It just can't explain the steep

00:08:13 --> 00:08:16 early collapse. And third, everything

00:08:16 --> 00:08:19 rests on those ages. They're the best

00:08:19 --> 00:08:21 available, but they come from stellar models.

00:08:21 --> 00:08:23 And the next test is whether independent age

00:08:23 --> 00:08:26 methods like astroseismology find the same

00:08:26 --> 00:08:27 turning point.

00:08:27 --> 00:08:30 Avery: So, born thick, settled, thin.

00:08:31 --> 00:08:33 Anna: Born thick, settled, thin.

00:08:34 --> 00:08:37 Our galaxy's calm, flat disc is the

00:08:37 --> 00:08:39 end of a much messier beginning.

00:08:39 --> 00:08:42 Avery: From the whole disc to Its very centre.

00:08:43 --> 00:08:45 Sagittarius A, the 4 million

00:08:45 --> 00:08:48 solar mass black hole about 26

00:08:48 --> 00:08:51 light years away, is surrounded by streamers

00:08:51 --> 00:08:54 of hot gas called the telescope to work

00:08:54 --> 00:08:56 out what that gas is made of.

00:08:56 --> 00:08:58 Anna: And it's rich in metals.

00:08:58 --> 00:09:01 Avery: Metals in the astronomer's sense, anything

00:09:01 --> 00:09:03 heavier than hydrogen and helium.

00:09:03 --> 00:09:06 Nicole Ford, a PhD student in Daryl Haggard's

00:09:06 --> 00:09:08 group, led the study in the Astronomical

00:09:08 --> 00:09:10 Journal. Webb's mid infrared

00:09:10 --> 00:09:13 spectrograph picked out the separate gas

00:09:13 --> 00:09:15 structures, the bar, the northern arm

00:09:15 --> 00:09:18 and several compact blobs within about a

00:09:18 --> 00:09:20 tenth of a light year of the black hole, some

00:09:20 --> 00:09:23 racing towards us at more than 600 kilometres

00:09:23 --> 00:09:25 per second. And the composition

00:09:26 --> 00:09:28 measured from neon, argon, sulphur,

00:09:28 --> 00:09:31 nickel and iron. The gas comes out mildly

00:09:31 --> 00:09:34 super Solar, around 1.8 times the

00:09:34 --> 00:09:35 sun's metal content.

00:09:36 --> 00:09:39 The team says the enrichment probably comes

00:09:39 --> 00:09:41 from stars that exploded and seeded the

00:09:41 --> 00:09:43 region over time. And the gas looks a lot

00:09:43 --> 00:09:46 like the stars orbiting the black hole, so

00:09:46 --> 00:09:47 they may have formed together.

00:09:49 --> 00:09:51 They also found nickel and iron being freed

00:09:51 --> 00:09:54 from dust. And the compact blobs show signs

00:09:54 --> 00:09:55 of fast shocks.

00:09:56 --> 00:09:59 Anna: Why does metal content matter for a black

00:09:59 --> 00:09:59 hole?

00:10:00 --> 00:10:02 Avery: Because metals help gas cool. Cooler gas

00:10:02 --> 00:10:05 clumps and clumps can fall inward. And

00:10:05 --> 00:10:08 Sagittarius A is a strangely light

00:10:08 --> 00:10:11 eater. Ford puts it neatly. The black hole

00:10:11 --> 00:10:13 is eating a lot less material than other

00:10:13 --> 00:10:15 supermassive black holes and more slowly.

00:10:16 --> 00:10:18 Knowing what's on the menu is part of working

00:10:18 --> 00:10:21 out why. Caveats two,

00:10:21 --> 00:10:23 A companion paper led by Mayura

00:10:23 --> 00:10:26 Balakrishanan found these infrared lines are

00:10:26 --> 00:10:29 shaped by local conditions, so the gas

00:10:29 --> 00:10:32 can't serve as a reliable record of the black

00:10:32 --> 00:10:34 hole's past outbursts. And um, the

00:10:34 --> 00:10:36 preprint first appeared in May, so this is

00:10:36 --> 00:10:39 the journal version arriving rather than a

00:10:39 --> 00:10:42 brand new result. Next step, the team says,

00:10:42 --> 00:10:44 is matching the observations to long

00:10:44 --> 00:10:45 timescale simulations.

00:10:46 --> 00:10:48 Anna: And there is a southern angle you can see for

00:10:48 --> 00:10:48 yourself.

00:10:49 --> 00:10:52 Avery: There is. The galactic centre is a

00:10:52 --> 00:10:55 southern sky object. From Sydney it climbs to

00:10:55 --> 00:10:57 about 85 degrees nearly overhead.

00:10:58 --> 00:11:00 From Los Angeles it peaks, uh, at 27

00:11:00 --> 00:11:03 degrees, New York 20 and London

00:11:03 --> 00:11:06 under 10. Tonight at the end of civil

00:11:06 --> 00:11:08 twilight, it's 52 degrees up from Sydney.

00:11:09 --> 00:11:11 You won't see the black hole of course, but

00:11:11 --> 00:11:12 you can point at it

00:11:13 --> 00:11:16 Anna: now to a universe that doesn't exist. Or

00:11:16 --> 00:11:19 rather two of them. Researchers at the

00:11:19 --> 00:11:21 US Department of Energy's Argonne National

00:11:21 --> 00:11:24 Laboratory have completed two of the largest

00:11:24 --> 00:11:26 cosmological simulations ever run.

00:11:27 --> 00:11:27 Avery: How large?

00:11:28 --> 00:11:31 Anna: Each one follows 13.4 trillion

00:11:31 --> 00:11:33 dark matter particles across a region

00:11:33 --> 00:11:36 28.6 billion light years wide.

00:11:36 --> 00:11:38 They ran on Aurora, one of the world's

00:11:38 --> 00:11:41 largest supercomputers. Each run used about

00:11:42 --> 00:11:44 8 nodes and roughly

00:11:44 --> 00:11:47 50 graphics processors. And the

00:11:47 --> 00:11:50 simulations, plus much of the analysis took

00:11:50 --> 00:11:51 about four days.

00:11:51 --> 00:11:52 Avery: Um, and the data?

00:11:52 --> 00:11:55 Anna: The two runs wrote more than 85

00:11:55 --> 00:11:58 petabytes, mostly as restart

00:11:58 --> 00:12:01 checkpoints in case something crashed. About

00:12:01 --> 00:12:03 eight petabytes were kept for science.

00:12:03 --> 00:12:04 Avery: What's it for?

00:12:04 --> 00:12:07 Anna: Cosmic inflation. The brief burst

00:12:07 --> 00:12:10 of extreme expansion in the first instant of

00:12:10 --> 00:12:13 the universe. The standard picture says

00:12:13 --> 00:12:15 inflation left behind density ripples with a

00:12:15 --> 00:12:18 simple Gaussian kind of randomness. If

00:12:18 --> 00:12:20 the real ripples depart from that even

00:12:20 --> 00:12:22 slightly, what's called primordial non

00:12:22 --> 00:12:25 gaussianity, it could point to extra fields

00:12:25 --> 00:12:27 or physics at work during inflation.

00:12:28 --> 00:12:30 Avery: And the signal is tiny.

00:12:31 --> 00:12:33 Anna: Tiny and hidden on the largest

00:12:33 --> 00:12:36 scales, where cosmic variance,

00:12:36 --> 00:12:39 the fact that we only have one universe to

00:12:39 --> 00:12:41 samplemuddies everything. So you

00:12:41 --> 00:12:44 need enormous volume and enough

00:12:44 --> 00:12:47 resolution to see the dark matter halos that

00:12:47 --> 00:12:48 host galaxies.

00:12:48 --> 00:12:49 That's the hard bit.

00:12:50 --> 00:12:51 Avery: Here's the clever part, though.

00:12:52 --> 00:12:54 Anna: Two clever parts. The two runs are

00:12:54 --> 00:12:57 statistical mirror images. Same

00:12:57 --> 00:12:59 physics, but with their initial ripples

00:12:59 --> 00:13:02 flipped. Analyse them together and a lot

00:13:02 --> 00:13:05 of the random noise cancels out. And the

00:13:05 --> 00:13:07 strength of the non Gaussian signal planted

00:13:07 --> 00:13:10 inside is blinded. Teams working on

00:13:10 --> 00:13:12 DESI, the Dark Energy Spectroscopic

00:13:12 --> 00:13:15 Instrument and NASA's SPHERE X mission, can

00:13:15 --> 00:13:17 build mock skies from it and test whether

00:13:17 --> 00:13:19 their pipelines recover the hidden answer

00:13:20 --> 00:13:22 before they go anywhere near the real data.

00:13:22 --> 00:13:25 Avery: Like marking an exam where you don't know the

00:13:25 --> 00:13:27 answer key exactly.

00:13:28 --> 00:13:30 Anna: A quick note on what this is and isn't.

00:13:31 --> 00:13:33 It's a computing milestone announced by

00:13:33 --> 00:13:36 Argonne on 19 October. Not a

00:13:36 --> 00:13:38 published scientific result. The science

00:13:38 --> 00:13:40 comes when survey teams use it, but it fits a

00:13:40 --> 00:13:43 theme on this show. In episode 193, we

00:13:43 --> 00:13:46 covered the dark energy supernova compilation

00:13:46 --> 00:13:49 and how much of modern cosmology is about not

00:13:49 --> 00:13:52 fooling yourself. Line tests are how you do

00:13:52 --> 00:13:52 that.

00:13:52 --> 00:13:54 Avery: Since it's Orionid night, let's stay in

00:13:54 --> 00:13:57 Orion. About 1350

00:13:57 --> 00:14:00 light years away, inside the Orion Nebula

00:14:00 --> 00:14:03 sits a ridge of gas called the Orion Bar.

00:14:03 --> 00:14:05 It's where ultraviolet light from young

00:14:05 --> 00:14:07 massive stars is eating into the molecular

00:14:07 --> 00:14:08 cloud.

00:14:08 --> 00:14:10 Anna: They were born from a, uh, photo

00:14:10 --> 00:14:12 dissociation region, right?

00:14:12 --> 00:14:15 Avery: A zone where starlight breaks molecules

00:14:15 --> 00:14:18 apart. And we see the Orion Bar almost

00:14:18 --> 00:14:21 edge on, so its layers line up like a cross

00:14:21 --> 00:14:24 section. That makes it the textbook

00:14:24 --> 00:14:26 test case. The trouble is that Alma and

00:14:26 --> 00:14:29 Webb images show the layers don't behave Like

00:14:29 --> 00:14:32 a textbook. The front where hydrogen

00:14:32 --> 00:14:34 molecules are destroyed overlaps the front

00:14:34 --> 00:14:37 where ionised carbon recombines and the

00:14:37 --> 00:14:39 emission comes in arcs and filaments.

00:14:40 --> 00:14:42 Anna: And the models were one dimensional?

00:14:42 --> 00:14:45 Avery: Mostly, yes. Tidy layers in a row.

00:14:45 --> 00:14:48 M A team led by brank gaetjes@ uh, the

00:14:48 --> 00:14:50 University of Duisburg Essen with colleagues

00:14:50 --> 00:14:53 at Zhejiang Lab in China has now built what

00:14:53 --> 00:14:55 they describe as the first fully three

00:14:55 --> 00:14:58 dimensional high resolution model of an Orion

00:14:58 --> 00:15:01 bar like region. It's in Astronomy and

00:15:01 --> 00:15:03 Astrophysics, published online on 16 October.

00:15:04 --> 00:15:06 Anna: What does 3D change?

00:15:07 --> 00:15:10 Avery: Shadows. Real clouds are clumpy. Dense

00:15:10 --> 00:15:12 knots block the incoming radiation and leave

00:15:12 --> 00:15:15 shielded pockets behind them where molecules

00:15:15 --> 00:15:18 survive and the chemistry runs differently in

00:15:18 --> 00:15:20 the Model A uh, box about a tenth of a light

00:15:20 --> 00:15:23 year across with cells around 160 times

00:15:23 --> 00:15:26 the Earth's sun distance. Those shadows

00:15:26 --> 00:15:28 naturally produce the overlapping fronts and

00:15:28 --> 00:15:30 the arc like hydrogen emission Webb Cs

00:15:32 --> 00:15:34 it's an analogue, not a reconstruction.

00:15:35 --> 00:15:37 The team uses statistically realistic

00:15:37 --> 00:15:40 fractal clouds rather than the actual Orion

00:15:40 --> 00:15:41 bar's shape.

00:15:41 --> 00:15:44 So it shows the mechanism works, not that

00:15:44 --> 00:15:47 every filament is explained. And Orion

00:15:47 --> 00:15:49 is one of the few deep sky targets both

00:15:49 --> 00:15:51 hemispheres share up after midnight from

00:15:51 --> 00:15:53 everywhere this month. Upside down from

00:15:53 --> 00:15:55 Sydney Quick hits.

00:15:56 --> 00:15:58 Anna: ESA's Hira spacecraft fires its second

00:15:58 --> 00:16:01 braking burn, BRM M2 on Thursday.

00:16:02 --> 00:16:04 It's a shorter follow up to last week's 93

00:16:04 --> 00:16:05 minute BRM1.

00:16:06 --> 00:16:08 Fine tuning Hira's approach to Didymos and

00:16:08 --> 00:16:10 Dimorphos. The asteroid's dart hit in

00:16:10 --> 00:16:13 2022. Close in characterization

00:16:13 --> 00:16:16 from about 25 to 30 kilometres follows in

00:16:16 --> 00:16:18 November and December with tracking through

00:16:18 --> 00:16:20 ESA's new Norsha Station in Western

00:16:20 --> 00:16:20 Australia.

00:16:21 --> 00:16:24 Avery: Uzbekistan has signed the Artemis Accords,

00:16:24 --> 00:16:27 the 77th nation to do so at a ceremony

00:16:27 --> 00:16:28 in Samarkand on Monday.

00:16:29 --> 00:16:31 Anna: And NASA will give an update on Artemis on

00:16:31 --> 00:16:33 Thursday at 2pm Eastern.

00:16:33 --> 00:16:36 That's 5am Friday in Sydney. Including

00:16:36 --> 00:16:39 Artemis 3, which NASA now plans as a

00:16:39 --> 00:16:42 2027 crewed test in Earth orbit of

00:16:42 --> 00:16:44 rendezvous with its commercial lunar landers

00:16:44 --> 00:16:47 ahead of a landing attempt targeted for 2028.

00:16:47 --> 00:16:49 We'll bring you what said Skywatch.

00:16:50 --> 00:16:52 Avery: And tonight is the peak of the Orionid meteor

00:16:52 --> 00:16:55 shower. Dust from Hallie's Comet.

00:16:55 --> 00:16:58 Under dark skies it typically gives up to

00:16:58 --> 00:17:00 about 20 metres an hour. The catch this year

00:17:00 --> 00:17:03 is the moon. It's waxing gibbous, around

00:17:03 --> 00:17:05 3/4 lit, so you'll want to wait until it

00:17:05 --> 00:17:06 sets.

00:17:06 --> 00:17:09 Anna: Remind us why Hallie's dust makes good

00:17:09 --> 00:17:11 Avery: meteors speed

00:17:12 --> 00:17:14 Orionids hit the atmosphere at around 66

00:17:14 --> 00:17:17 kilometres per second, among the fastest of

00:17:17 --> 00:17:18 any annual shower.

00:17:18 --> 00:17:21 So the brighter ones often leave glowing

00:17:21 --> 00:17:24 trains that linger for a second or two. And

00:17:24 --> 00:17:26 Earth crosses Hallie's debris twice a year.

00:17:26 --> 00:17:29 In May we get the Eta Aquarids, which

00:17:29 --> 00:17:31 favour the southern hemisphere. And in

00:17:31 --> 00:17:34 October the Orionids, which this year favour

00:17:34 --> 00:17:35 the north.

00:17:35 --> 00:17:37 Anna: And when do they set?

00:17:37 --> 00:17:40 Avery: On Thursday morning, 3:38am in

00:17:40 --> 00:17:43 Sydney, 3:22 in Los Angeles,

00:17:43 --> 00:17:46 3:12 in New York and 2:49 in

00:17:46 --> 00:17:48 London. After that you've got dark sky until

00:17:48 --> 00:17:49 dawn.

00:17:49 --> 00:17:51 Anna: And this one favours the north?

00:17:52 --> 00:17:54 Avery: It does. And it's worth being straight about

00:17:54 --> 00:17:54 it.

00:17:55 --> 00:17:57 From Los Angeles you get more than two hours

00:17:57 --> 00:18:00 of dark sky after moonset with the radiant

00:18:00 --> 00:18:03 near orion's raised club, 59 to 70

00:18:03 --> 00:18:05 degrees up. New York is similar.

00:18:05 --> 00:18:08 London gets nearly three hours with the

00:18:08 --> 00:18:10 radiant 43 to 54 degrees up

00:18:11 --> 00:18:13 from Sydney. There's only about an hour

00:18:13 --> 00:18:15 between moonset and astronomical dawn at

00:18:15 --> 00:18:18 4:37 and the radiant sits 35

00:18:18 --> 00:18:21 to 40 degrees up in the northeast. Still

00:18:21 --> 00:18:23 worthwhile, just shorter.

00:18:23 --> 00:18:26 Lie back, look about 45 degrees away

00:18:26 --> 00:18:29 from the radiant and give your eyes 20

00:18:29 --> 00:18:29 minutes.

00:18:30 --> 00:18:31 Anna: What does the south get?

00:18:31 --> 00:18:34 Avery: The evening Mercury is about 16 and a half

00:18:34 --> 00:18:37 degrees up at the end of civil twilight from

00:18:37 --> 00:18:40 Sydney around 7:39 and sets

00:18:40 --> 00:18:42 just after 9. From Los Angeles it's 4

00:18:42 --> 00:18:45 degrees up, New York too. And from London

00:18:45 --> 00:18:46 it's already gone.

00:18:47 --> 00:18:49 And as we said earlier, the centre of The

00:18:49 --> 00:18:51 Galaxy is 52 degrees up from Sydney at uh,

00:18:51 --> 00:18:54 dusk. Sagittarius and Scorpius high in the

00:18:54 --> 00:18:57 west against 21 from Los Angeles and

00:18:57 --> 00:18:58 16 from New York.

00:18:58 --> 00:18:59 Anna: And Venus.

00:19:00 --> 00:19:02 Avery: Venus reaches inferior conjunction on

00:19:02 --> 00:19:05 Saturday the 24th, passing between us

00:19:05 --> 00:19:08 and the sun only about 6.5

00:19:08 --> 00:19:11 degrees from the Sun's direction. So not one

00:19:11 --> 00:19:12 to hunt for.

00:19:12 --> 00:19:14 And never um, look anywhere near the sun with

00:19:14 --> 00:19:17 your eyes or any optics unless you're using a

00:19:17 --> 00:19:19 certified solar filter that meets the ISO

00:19:19 --> 00:19:22 123122 standard.

00:19:22 --> 00:19:24 Anna: Anything for the weekend?

00:19:24 --> 00:19:27 Avery: On Saturday evening the nearly full moon sits

00:19:27 --> 00:19:30 close to Saturn, about 6 degrees apart from

00:19:30 --> 00:19:32 Sydney and London. Eight from New York,

00:19:32 --> 00:19:34 nearly 10 from Los Angeles.

00:19:35 --> 00:19:38 Full moon follows on Monday the 26th at

00:19:38 --> 00:19:39 4:11am, UM Universal Time.

00:19:40 --> 00:19:43 That's 3:11 in the afternoon in Sydney. So

00:19:43 --> 00:19:45 it'll look full on both Sunday and Monday

00:19:45 --> 00:19:48 nights. And in the pre dawn east,

00:19:48 --> 00:19:51 Mars and Jupiter keep closing in 10 degrees

00:19:51 --> 00:19:53 apart now about 7 by the 28th and 4 by

00:19:53 --> 00:19:54 the 5th of November.

00:19:55 --> 00:19:56 Anna: And a uh, practical note for our

00:19:56 --> 00:19:59 Avery: northern listeners clocks,

00:19:59 --> 00:20:02 the UK moves back to Greenwich Mean Time

00:20:02 --> 00:20:04 early on Sunday the 25th, and the United

00:20:04 --> 00:20:07 States follows on Sunday the 1st of November.

00:20:08 --> 00:20:10 So for a week, the gap between London and New

00:20:10 --> 00:20:13 York shrinks by an hour. If you're planning a

00:20:13 --> 00:20:15 pre dawn session next week, check which time

00:20:15 --> 00:20:18 your app is showing. Here in Australia, we're

00:20:18 --> 00:20:20 already on daylight time, so nothing changes.

00:20:21 --> 00:20:23 Plenty to see, which is

00:20:23 --> 00:20:24 always a good thing.

00:20:25 --> 00:20:27 Anna: That's Astronomy daily for Wednesday,

00:20:27 --> 00:20:28 21 October.

00:20:29 --> 00:20:32 Today, the Milky Way's disc was born thick

00:20:32 --> 00:20:35 and settled thin. The gas around our central

00:20:35 --> 00:20:38 black hole is rich in metals. Two

00:20:38 --> 00:20:40 mirror image universes are ready to test the

00:20:40 --> 00:20:43 next generation of surveys and shadows are

00:20:43 --> 00:20:45 shaping the chemistry of the Orion Bar.

00:20:46 --> 00:20:48 Avery: Find show notes, sources and the Fullback

00:20:48 --> 00:20:51 Catalogue at astronomydaily IO and

00:20:51 --> 00:20:53 you can reach us through the contact form

00:20:53 --> 00:20:55 there. Your questions really do shape what we

00:20:55 --> 00:20:56 cover.

00:20:56 --> 00:20:58 We're astrodaily pod on social media.

00:20:59 --> 00:21:01 Anna: Tomorrow we'll check in on Hera's second

00:21:01 --> 00:21:04 breaking burn and anything else the universe

00:21:04 --> 00:21:05 throws at us.

00:21:05 --> 00:21:06 Avery: I'm Avery.

00:21:06 --> 00:21:09 Anna: And I'm Anna. Uh, thanks for listening.

00:21:09 --> 00:21:11 And if you're up for the Orionids, clear

00:21:11 --> 00:21:12 skies.