00:00:00 --> 00:00:02 hi there thanks for joining us yet again
00:00:02 --> 00:00:04 I don't know how you do it but welcome
00:00:04 --> 00:00:07 along this is Space Nuts with Andrew
00:00:07 --> 00:00:09 dunkley your host hope you're well uh
00:00:09 --> 00:00:12 this episode is dedicated to volcanoes
00:00:12 --> 00:00:16 supernovas that were not and Voyager two
00:00:16 --> 00:00:18 which told us something that turned out
00:00:18 --> 00:00:20 not to probably be true it's all coming
00:00:20 --> 00:00:24 up on this episode of Space Nuts 15
00:00:24 --> 00:00:28 seconds guidance is internal 10 9
00:00:28 --> 00:00:32 ignition sequence start Space Nuts 5 4 3
00:00:32 --> 00:00:37 2 1 2 3 4 5 5 4 3 2 1 Space Nuts as nuts
00:00:37 --> 00:00:40 report it feels good and joining us
00:00:40 --> 00:00:42 again to go over all of that is
00:00:42 --> 00:00:44 Professor Fred Watson astronomer at
00:00:44 --> 00:00:47 large hello Fred hello Andrew I'm still
00:00:47 --> 00:00:49 uh still at large or on the loose really
00:00:49 --> 00:00:52 now but that's all right yeah I've seen
00:00:52 --> 00:00:54 a few variations on what people think
00:00:54 --> 00:00:55 you should be called now we should we'll
00:00:55 --> 00:00:58 keep an eye on those if we get any good
00:00:58 --> 00:00:59 ones I'll pass them along you might want
00:00:59 --> 00:01:03 to changing business card yeah yes um
00:01:03 --> 00:01:06 that's right now there's a uh a story
00:01:06 --> 00:01:08 that we're going to start with today
00:01:08 --> 00:01:11 that uh brings into play something that
00:01:11 --> 00:01:13 I am very excited about and that's
00:01:13 --> 00:01:16 volcanoes uh I've visited several uh
00:01:16 --> 00:01:19 over my time um traveling around the
00:01:19 --> 00:01:21 world and you have visited uh a couple
00:01:21 --> 00:01:24 yourself um including them most infamous
00:01:24 --> 00:01:27 one that grounded all the planes in uh
00:01:27 --> 00:01:29 in the northern hemisphere when it blew
00:01:29 --> 00:01:33 a gas in 2010 was it 2010 the one in
00:01:33 --> 00:01:34 Iceland what's it called again cuz I
00:01:35 --> 00:01:38 can't pronounce
00:01:38 --> 00:01:42 it and and it's it means um let me get
00:01:42 --> 00:01:44 it right I think it means Island
00:01:44 --> 00:01:46 mountain glacia yal is a
00:01:46 --> 00:01:50 glacia um so so the the Double L so the
00:01:50 --> 00:01:52 there's two double L's in it and Double
00:01:52 --> 00:01:56 L is in Icelandic has the sound of it's
00:01:56 --> 00:01:59 not just a l it's got a kind of squeeze
00:01:59 --> 00:02:04 of the of the chigs before it so
00:02:04 --> 00:02:07 he f
00:02:07 --> 00:02:10 y good um one of our one on one of our
00:02:11 --> 00:02:13 visits to Iceland um a lovely guy who
00:02:13 --> 00:02:16 was our guide at the time he said um
00:02:16 --> 00:02:20 he'd spent uh a few years in Germany and
00:02:20 --> 00:02:22 I become fluent in German so I spoke
00:02:22 --> 00:02:25 everybody in German came back to Iceland
00:02:25 --> 00:02:27 and got back into uh Icelandic and he
00:02:28 --> 00:02:30 said his his jaw achd because of what
00:02:30 --> 00:02:32 you've got to do to get the
00:02:32 --> 00:02:33 pronunciation
00:02:33 --> 00:02:36 out he said it wasn't used to it you
00:02:36 --> 00:02:38 know his jaw start
00:02:38 --> 00:02:43 out the only go go I was gonna say that
00:02:43 --> 00:02:45 explains why the Vikings were so angry
00:02:45 --> 00:02:47 all the time no one could understand
00:02:47 --> 00:02:51 them yes yeah that's right anyway it was
00:02:51 --> 00:02:53 it's good I was going to say that's the
00:02:53 --> 00:02:58 only Icelandic word that I I know yeah
00:02:58 --> 00:03:00 and and you only Tik Tok you said you
00:03:00 --> 00:03:03 told us a very interesting factoid about
00:03:03 --> 00:03:05 it which I think we should share
00:03:05 --> 00:03:08 again that it um was the world's first
00:03:08 --> 00:03:11 carbon negative volcano uh because by
00:03:11 --> 00:03:14 grounding uh the world's Airlines for
00:03:14 --> 00:03:16 something like a week it was getting on
00:03:16 --> 00:03:19 for a week uh it took more carbon out of
00:03:19 --> 00:03:22 the atmosphere than it put in which is
00:03:22 --> 00:03:24 really quite an astonishing yeah it's
00:03:24 --> 00:03:26 Unthinkable isn't it cuz it it was not a
00:03:26 --> 00:03:29 small eruption no sending sending stuff
00:03:29 --> 00:03:31 up a long way that's right and and
00:03:31 --> 00:03:33 you've stood on the edge of that thing
00:03:33 --> 00:03:35 haven't you on the edge of the glacia
00:03:35 --> 00:03:36 that runs over it yes so so it's
00:03:37 --> 00:03:39 underneath the glassia um which is the
00:03:39 --> 00:03:41 yle bit of the word that's just too
00:03:41 --> 00:03:44 scary to think
00:03:44 --> 00:03:47 about yeah I I'll send you the picture
00:03:47 --> 00:03:49 we might have put way we've got a
00:03:49 --> 00:03:50 picture of me talking to ABC right at
00:03:50 --> 00:03:52 the snout of the glacia that that runs
00:03:52 --> 00:03:54 over
00:03:54 --> 00:03:57 a well uh one one volcano that we
00:03:57 --> 00:04:00 visited ended up erupting long after we
00:04:00 --> 00:04:02 were there as is our habit whenever we
00:04:02 --> 00:04:05 travel something happens and it stopped
00:04:05 --> 00:04:07 air traffic around the asia-pacific
00:04:07 --> 00:04:11 region for a while that was yeah vanatu
00:04:11 --> 00:04:14 and as we speak uh one airline that I'm
00:04:14 --> 00:04:16 aware of is cancelled all flights out of
00:04:16 --> 00:04:19 Denpasar in Indonesia barley yes because
00:04:19 --> 00:04:22 of another volcanic eruption yes
00:04:22 --> 00:04:25 eruption that's all happening it is
00:04:25 --> 00:04:28 certainly happening um now that's our
00:04:28 --> 00:04:30 planet and its active Volcan canas and
00:04:30 --> 00:04:32 we we know of a couple of other places
00:04:32 --> 00:04:35 in our solar system that seem to have
00:04:35 --> 00:04:38 volcanic activity maybe Venus uh EO was
00:04:38 --> 00:04:41 EO one of them um yes indeed that's
00:04:41 --> 00:04:43 probably the most volcanically active
00:04:43 --> 00:04:46 body in the solar system is EO yes but
00:04:46 --> 00:04:49 we are talking about an exoplanet that
00:04:49 --> 00:04:51 they think might be volcanic that's
00:04:51 --> 00:04:53 quite a
00:04:53 --> 00:04:56 find it is uh it rejoices in the name
00:04:56 --> 00:04:58 let's get this out of it out of the way
00:04:58 --> 00:05:02 l L 98-
00:05:02 --> 00:05:07 59d uh and that planet was a discovery
00:05:07 --> 00:05:10 from the Tess Space Telescope which
00:05:10 --> 00:05:12 we've talked about a lot because it was
00:05:12 --> 00:05:14 the the Space Telescope that really
00:05:14 --> 00:05:16 followed on from kepa which was a
00:05:16 --> 00:05:18 telescope designed to look for the dip
00:05:18 --> 00:05:20 in the light of a star because of the
00:05:20 --> 00:05:23 planet going around it likewise Tess did
00:05:23 --> 00:05:24 the same thing and both those two
00:05:24 --> 00:05:27 together absolutely revolutionized the
00:05:27 --> 00:05:30 science of Planet Discovery uh so l98
00:05:30 --> 00:05:35 59d uh discovered by Tess back in 2019
00:05:35 --> 00:05:38 and has now been analyzed in some detail
00:05:38 --> 00:05:43 uh because of the technology that we can
00:05:43 --> 00:05:44 apply I've got a feeling this has come
00:05:44 --> 00:05:46 from the
00:05:46 --> 00:05:49 jwst uh but I need to check that anyway
00:05:49 --> 00:05:52 uh it's yes that's right it it has been
00:05:52 --> 00:05:55 um Jes telescope observations that that
00:05:55 --> 00:05:59 uh have given us this new information uh
00:05:59 --> 00:06:02 which which is that um that particular
00:06:02 --> 00:06:07 Planet l98 59d I do like the name um has
00:06:07 --> 00:06:10 signatures in its atmosphere of some of
00:06:10 --> 00:06:14 the products which we know are
00:06:14 --> 00:06:17 associated with uh with volcanic
00:06:17 --> 00:06:20 eruptions and so uh sulfur dioxide is
00:06:20 --> 00:06:24 one of them uh and hydrogen sulfide bad
00:06:24 --> 00:06:28 egg gas that's another and what uh the
00:06:28 --> 00:06:30 scientists who have done this work are
00:06:30 --> 00:06:33 suggesting is that the presence of those
00:06:33 --> 00:06:35 combined with the absence of other ones
00:06:35 --> 00:06:38 which are much more common like carbon
00:06:38 --> 00:06:41 dioxide uh the presence of those um
00:06:41 --> 00:06:44 suggests that we have extreme conditions
00:06:44 --> 00:06:45 on
00:06:45 --> 00:06:47 l98
00:06:47 --> 00:06:51 59d uh either volcanic activity on a big
00:06:52 --> 00:06:56 scale uh or um even a molten surface now
00:06:56 --> 00:06:59 we think that at some stage in its past
00:06:59 --> 00:07:01 uh the Earth's surface was molten it was
00:07:01 --> 00:07:04 what we call a lava world and we may be
00:07:04 --> 00:07:07 seeing this particular Planet uh
00:07:07 --> 00:07:11 basically um uh doing the same sort of
00:07:11 --> 00:07:14 thing uh so just to give it some
00:07:14 --> 00:07:17 statistics Andrew it's about 50% bigger
00:07:17 --> 00:07:18 than the earth it's what we call a super
00:07:18 --> 00:07:21 Earth in the scale of exoplanets it's
00:07:21 --> 00:07:24 about 35 light years away as a crow
00:07:24 --> 00:07:27 flies uh and it has a record uh it's a
00:07:27 --> 00:07:31 record breaker because um if if the
00:07:31 --> 00:07:33 details of this these observations are
00:07:33 --> 00:07:34 confirmed and they're still fairly
00:07:34 --> 00:07:37 tentative the details of the chemistry
00:07:37 --> 00:07:39 of the atmosphere if they're concerned
00:07:39 --> 00:07:41 if they're confirmed I big of Pardon it
00:07:41 --> 00:07:44 would be the smallest known exoplanet
00:07:44 --> 00:07:48 with an atmosphere uh so it's uh
00:07:48 --> 00:07:49 interesting because we're now starting
00:07:49 --> 00:07:52 to probe down to earth siiz planets here
00:07:52 --> 00:07:55 uh with the the ability to to use
00:07:55 --> 00:07:56 spectroscopy to determine what's in
00:07:56 --> 00:07:57 their
00:07:57 --> 00:08:00 atmospheres uh so really interesting
00:08:00 --> 00:08:03 observation yeah absolutely and it's not
00:08:03 --> 00:08:05 that far away this one is it either is
00:08:05 --> 00:08:08 it 35 light years no that's right it's
00:08:08 --> 00:08:10 uh you know it's certainly within the
00:08:10 --> 00:08:13 sun's local neighborhood uh so not that
00:08:13 --> 00:08:15 that makes it any difference you know
00:08:15 --> 00:08:18 it's once you get beyond the uh the
00:08:18 --> 00:08:20 orbit of Neptune you're talking about a
00:08:20 --> 00:08:23 different sort of T distance scale all
00:08:23 --> 00:08:24 together from what we used to in the
00:08:24 --> 00:08:27 solar system uh but nevertheless it's
00:08:27 --> 00:08:31 it's good and just a a quick note to how
00:08:31 --> 00:08:33 we can measure what's in the atmosphere
00:08:33 --> 00:08:37 of an exoplanet uh and that it's a very
00:08:37 --> 00:08:39 very delicate measurement and needs the
00:08:39 --> 00:08:40 best
00:08:40 --> 00:08:42 instrumentation uh what you do is you
00:08:42 --> 00:08:45 wait until the planet transits in front
00:08:45 --> 00:08:47 of its parent star and you look at the
00:08:47 --> 00:08:50 Spectrum of the parent star and then you
00:08:50 --> 00:08:52 compare that with what the parent star
00:08:52 --> 00:08:55 looks like without the planet in front
00:08:55 --> 00:08:57 of it uh because and the difference in
00:08:57 --> 00:09:02 them is caused by the light of the star
00:09:02 --> 00:09:04 passing through the additional layer of
00:09:04 --> 00:09:06 the atmosphere of the planet which is
00:09:06 --> 00:09:08 sitting in front of it and so even
00:09:08 --> 00:09:10 though that atmosphere might be very
00:09:10 --> 00:09:12 small in diameter compared with the
00:09:12 --> 00:09:14 diameter of the star in fact it's a ring
00:09:14 --> 00:09:16 of course because you've got the planet
00:09:16 --> 00:09:18 itself blocking it uh that area is very
00:09:18 --> 00:09:20 small compared with the surface area of
00:09:20 --> 00:09:23 the Star as we see it uh it's still with
00:09:23 --> 00:09:25 the sensitive equipment that we have now
00:09:25 --> 00:09:28 it's still possible to tease out what
00:09:28 --> 00:09:32 the spec lines the spectral signature of
00:09:32 --> 00:09:33 the gases in the atmosphere of the
00:09:33 --> 00:09:35 exoplanet o and it's a technique that's
00:09:35 --> 00:09:38 being used more and more uh and I think
00:09:38 --> 00:09:40 has a great future and of course once we
00:09:40 --> 00:09:43 get uh into the elt league the extremely
00:09:43 --> 00:09:45 large telescope League this will be a
00:09:45 --> 00:09:46 standard kind of measurement that we'll
00:09:46 --> 00:09:49 be hearing about every week I'm
00:09:49 --> 00:09:52 sure yes that's uh very exciting um I
00:09:52 --> 00:09:54 remember going to a lecture on not of MC
00:09:54 --> 00:09:56 at once where they were talking about
00:09:56 --> 00:10:00 using spec uh spectrographs I'll say to
00:10:00 --> 00:10:05 analyze uh exoplanets and now it's sort
00:10:05 --> 00:10:07 of becoming the norm which is very
00:10:07 --> 00:10:11 exciting that forecast was spot on that
00:10:11 --> 00:10:13 might even have been one of the
00:10:13 --> 00:10:16 um was it the bo lectures that's right I
00:10:16 --> 00:10:20 was involved in yes the lectures yeah
00:10:20 --> 00:10:23 now uh I I did have a question uh do we
00:10:23 --> 00:10:27 think that L 98- 59d is independently
00:10:27 --> 00:10:30 volcanic or is it being in influenced by
00:10:30 --> 00:10:34 something else EO um is is kind of
00:10:34 --> 00:10:36 volcanic because Jupiter gives it a bit
00:10:36 --> 00:10:39 of a crushing hug all the
00:10:39 --> 00:10:42 time yes exactly that's right uh and
00:10:42 --> 00:10:44 that's a great question and the answer
00:10:44 --> 00:10:49 is probably because uh it goes around
00:10:49 --> 00:10:53 its parent star in if I remember right
00:10:53 --> 00:10:55 it's just a few days I can't remember
00:10:55 --> 00:10:57 just exactly how many days it is you
00:10:57 --> 00:10:58 might have it in front of you yeah s and
00:10:58 --> 00:11:03 a half Earth days so what what we take a
00:11:03 --> 00:11:06 year to do around the Sun uh that
00:11:06 --> 00:11:08 particular planet takes seven and a half
00:11:08 --> 00:11:11 days to do around its around its parents
00:11:11 --> 00:11:13 star so it means it's very close to its
00:11:13 --> 00:11:16 parents star uh and much closer than
00:11:16 --> 00:11:18 Mercury is to the Sun and that's another
00:11:18 --> 00:11:22 reason why it might be um volcanically
00:11:22 --> 00:11:24 active to the degree that we think it is
00:11:24 --> 00:11:27 and it's not just the the radiant heat
00:11:27 --> 00:11:30 of the star itself because it's close by
00:11:30 --> 00:11:33 it's that closeness that gives uh the
00:11:33 --> 00:11:35 the planet a squash and a squeeze every
00:11:35 --> 00:11:38 time it goes around and causes this
00:11:38 --> 00:11:41 heating of its interior um by what we
00:11:41 --> 00:11:43 call tidal forces uh exactly the same
00:11:43 --> 00:11:46 mechanism that keeps EO volcanically
00:11:46 --> 00:11:48 active yes so it's uh it's a bit bigger
00:11:48 --> 00:11:51 than Earth at one and a half times our
00:11:51 --> 00:11:55 size but it's uh surprisingly much
00:11:55 --> 00:11:57 stinkier
00:11:57 --> 00:12:00 place we talked about H2S in a recent
00:12:00 --> 00:12:02 episode didn't we because it was the
00:12:02 --> 00:12:05 nickname given to the to the radar that
00:12:05 --> 00:12:08 was used on Lancaster bombers that's the
00:12:08 --> 00:12:11 the H2 because it smells bad that's what
00:12:11 --> 00:12:14 they said yes
00:12:14 --> 00:12:16 absolutely uh and if you want to read
00:12:17 --> 00:12:20 about that particular story f.org of
00:12:20 --> 00:12:24 course phys.org uh just do a a search
00:12:24 --> 00:12:26 for a distant planet seems tour of a
00:12:26 --> 00:12:28 suful rich atmosphere hinting at alien
00:12:28 --> 00:12:31 volcano knows this is Space Nuts with
00:12:31 --> 00:12:35 Andrew Dunley and Professor Fred
00:12:35 --> 00:12:40 Watson the RO and I feel fine Space Nuts
00:12:40 --> 00:12:43 now Fred uh we get questions um
00:12:43 --> 00:12:45 semi-regularly about Supernova those
00:12:45 --> 00:12:49 cataclysmic explosions of stars that um
00:12:49 --> 00:12:51 that can be you know sometimes seen in
00:12:51 --> 00:12:53 daylight if they're close enough to us
00:12:53 --> 00:12:55 and there's been a couple in recorded
00:12:55 --> 00:12:58 history uh and they ultimately collapse
00:12:58 --> 00:13:00 and become a black hole whole now we've
00:13:01 --> 00:13:04 got a situation that's so um unusual and
00:13:04 --> 00:13:07 and somewhat rare a supernova that did
00:13:07 --> 00:13:09 not happen but the star still turned
00:13:09 --> 00:13:12 into a black hole that is that is sort
00:13:12 --> 00:13:14 of on the realm of
00:13:14 --> 00:13:17 weird it's weird that's right um
00:13:17 --> 00:13:19 although sort of
00:13:19 --> 00:13:24 understood um the the mechanism
00:13:24 --> 00:13:27 is you know predicted by theory that you
00:13:27 --> 00:13:30 you can do this but it is so unusual you
00:13:30 --> 00:13:32 know we always think of black holes
00:13:32 --> 00:13:35 being formed um in Supernova explosions
00:13:35 --> 00:13:37 and here we've got something that
00:13:37 --> 00:13:41 doesn't detonate um so it it basically
00:13:41 --> 00:13:44 the collapse takes place uh without
00:13:44 --> 00:13:46 without the explosion and and and just
00:13:46 --> 00:13:49 to recap why stars do collapse at the
00:13:49 --> 00:13:52 end of their lives uh you have a
00:13:52 --> 00:13:54 situation during the normal lifetime of
00:13:54 --> 00:13:56 a star and our Sun's in this situation
00:13:56 --> 00:13:58 where the outward pressure of the
00:13:58 --> 00:14:00 radiation coming from the nuclear fusion
00:14:00 --> 00:14:02 in its Center and that's what makes the
00:14:02 --> 00:14:05 sun shine that has a pressure on the gas
00:14:05 --> 00:14:07 of the Sun and that just balances the
00:14:07 --> 00:14:10 gravitational pull of the whole thing uh
00:14:10 --> 00:14:12 its own self-gravity so you got this
00:14:13 --> 00:14:14 Balancing Act between the radiation
00:14:14 --> 00:14:18 pressure and the gravity uh when the uh
00:14:18 --> 00:14:22 Sun or the star runs out of its fuel
00:14:22 --> 00:14:25 hydrogen fuel that changes so the
00:14:25 --> 00:14:27 radiation uh it actually goes through a
00:14:27 --> 00:14:30 few complex phases but eventually the
00:14:30 --> 00:14:34 radiation stops and so the uh the the
00:14:34 --> 00:14:37 the battle is won by gravity gravity
00:14:37 --> 00:14:40 tries to collapse the the uh the star
00:14:40 --> 00:14:42 into well if it can a black hole but it
00:14:42 --> 00:14:44 needs to be more than about eight times
00:14:44 --> 00:14:45 the mass of the Sun before it will do
00:14:45 --> 00:14:47 that perhaps even 10 times the mess of
00:14:47 --> 00:14:51 the sun um so that's the the process and
00:14:51 --> 00:14:53 it's the that sort of collapse that
00:14:54 --> 00:14:57 takes place uh what you've got is is
00:14:57 --> 00:14:59 heavy atoms basically basally mixing
00:14:59 --> 00:15:02 with light atoms and transferring their
00:15:02 --> 00:15:04 energy to them I used to do a trick with
00:15:04 --> 00:15:07 um with pingpong balls that demonstrates
00:15:07 --> 00:15:10 this quite nicely that if you have atoms
00:15:10 --> 00:15:13 different of different masses in close
00:15:13 --> 00:15:15 proximity um what some of them fall and
00:15:15 --> 00:15:17 some of them don't some of them bounce
00:15:17 --> 00:15:19 outwards uh and that's what gives rise
00:15:19 --> 00:15:22 to the explosion but with a with what
00:15:22 --> 00:15:25 we've seen in this it's actually in the
00:15:25 --> 00:15:27 Andromeda galaxy the star itself it's
00:15:27 --> 00:15:29 it's it's basically a star that's been
00:15:29 --> 00:15:31 studied for a while and has now just
00:15:31 --> 00:15:34 disappeared um and it it it was known to
00:15:34 --> 00:15:36 be a star of the sort of mass that you
00:15:37 --> 00:15:39 would form a a a
00:15:40 --> 00:15:44 supernova um but but it's it's just gone
00:15:44 --> 00:15:46 and so we believe that that has created
00:15:46 --> 00:15:49 a black hole without the explosion uh it
00:15:49 --> 00:15:52 this is research is being done uh uh LED
00:15:52 --> 00:15:56 actually from MC Massachusetts Institute
00:15:56 --> 00:15:58 of Technology The cavali Institute for
00:15:58 --> 00:16:02 astrophysics and based research so um
00:16:02 --> 00:16:04 it's as I said it's in the Andromeda
00:16:04 --> 00:16:06 galaxy uh it's been observed over a
00:16:06 --> 00:16:10 number of years um it did actually uh
00:16:10 --> 00:16:13 brighten uh for a while and this is in
00:16:13 --> 00:16:16 the infrared Wave band back in 2014 I
00:16:16 --> 00:16:18 should give it a name since we like
00:16:18 --> 00:16:21 giving stars names it's called M31 D
00:16:21 --> 00:16:22 2014-
00:16:22 --> 00:16:27 DS1 uh and it brightened in 2014 but
00:16:27 --> 00:16:29 then uh it stayed stayed bright for
00:16:29 --> 00:16:31 about three years but then for another
00:16:31 --> 00:16:34 three years it it faded away uh and has
00:16:34 --> 00:16:37 now now disappeared uh and in 2023 it
00:16:37 --> 00:16:40 couldn't detect couldn't be detected in
00:16:40 --> 00:16:43 imaging observations so it's gone uh
00:16:43 --> 00:16:47 it's thought to have a a fa a mass of
00:16:47 --> 00:16:50 about 6.7 times the the mass of the Sun
00:16:50 --> 00:16:54 uh and um basically has essentially
00:16:54 --> 00:16:57 banished as a black hole without what we
00:16:57 --> 00:16:59 call an optical outburst uh in other
00:16:59 --> 00:17:01 words without a supern no explosion so
00:17:01 --> 00:17:03 it's kind of like a do it reminds me of
00:17:03 --> 00:17:05 when you let fireworks and they didn't
00:17:05 --> 00:17:07 go off in the days when you could do
00:17:07 --> 00:17:09 that
00:17:09 --> 00:17:13 yourself yeah it is a very odd one and
00:17:13 --> 00:17:16 uh I suppose it's because it wasn't
00:17:16 --> 00:17:18 quite big enough would that be the the
00:17:18 --> 00:17:21 basic reason for it not doing what a
00:17:21 --> 00:17:22 supernova normally
00:17:22 --> 00:17:25 does yes I think that's right although
00:17:25 --> 00:17:27 it's a very complex process and once
00:17:27 --> 00:17:29 again we're we have a very nice article
00:17:29 --> 00:17:32 about this on f.org uh which also
00:17:32 --> 00:17:34 references the paper which is currently
00:17:34 --> 00:17:37 I think being uh peer-reviewed it's the
00:17:37 --> 00:17:39 paper's title is The Disappearance of a
00:17:39 --> 00:17:40 massive star marking the birth of a
00:17:41 --> 00:17:44 black hole in M31 m31's the Posh for the
00:17:44 --> 00:17:49 Andromeda galaxy Messier 31 uh but it's
00:17:49 --> 00:17:55 uh it's a process that has um has
00:17:55 --> 00:17:59 nuances and uh and the the reason why I
00:17:59 --> 00:18:01 mentioned the fizz. org article is that
00:18:01 --> 00:18:06 it describes those nuances very well uh
00:18:06 --> 00:18:09 and it start is a whole section which
00:18:09 --> 00:18:11 starts with the sentence super noia
00:18:11 --> 00:18:14 complex event then you can read on and
00:18:14 --> 00:18:15 you'll see what's happening with the
00:18:15 --> 00:18:19 burst of neutrinos uh the neutrino shock
00:18:19 --> 00:18:23 uh all of these things uh you know are
00:18:23 --> 00:18:24 part and parcel of what makes a
00:18:24 --> 00:18:26 supernova a
00:18:26 --> 00:18:29 supernova uh and sometimes
00:18:29 --> 00:18:31 uh that this is's this What's called the
00:18:31 --> 00:18:34 neutrino shock which apparently also
00:18:34 --> 00:18:37 stalls always stalls but usually revives
00:18:37 --> 00:18:40 again uh and that's what causes the
00:18:40 --> 00:18:44 Supernova to explode uh the neutrino
00:18:44 --> 00:18:49 shock was not revived it says um so it
00:18:49 --> 00:18:51 let me let me read a little bit from the
00:18:52 --> 00:18:56 article uh which says uh in M31 2014 DS1
00:18:56 --> 00:18:59 the neutrino shock was not revived D the
00:18:59 --> 00:19:01 researchers were able to constrain the
00:19:01 --> 00:19:04 amount of material ejected by the star
00:19:04 --> 00:19:06 and it was Far Below what a supernova
00:19:06 --> 00:19:09 would eject and there's a quote from one
00:19:09 --> 00:19:12 of the authors um or from the paper
00:19:12 --> 00:19:14 actually these constraints imply that
00:19:14 --> 00:19:16 the majority of Stellar material that's
00:19:16 --> 00:19:19 more than five times the mass of the Sun
00:19:19 --> 00:19:21 collapsed into the core exceeding the
00:19:21 --> 00:19:23 maximum mass of a neutron star and
00:19:23 --> 00:19:27 forming a black hole uh about 98% of the
00:19:27 --> 00:19:29 star's Mass collapsed and created a
00:19:29 --> 00:19:31 black hole with about 6.5 times the mass
00:19:31 --> 00:19:36 of the Sun um so it's it's you know it's
00:19:36 --> 00:19:40 uh a one of these things where we we
00:19:40 --> 00:19:43 really struggle to those of us who
00:19:43 --> 00:19:45 aren't um absolutely immersed in the
00:19:45 --> 00:19:47 physics struggle to understand the
00:19:47 --> 00:19:49 details there's a lovely sentence which
00:19:49 --> 00:19:52 I like very much in the f.org article
00:19:52 --> 00:19:55 M31 2014 DS1 isn't the only failed
00:19:55 --> 00:19:57 Supernova or candidate failed Supernova
00:19:57 --> 00:20:00 the astronom the astronomers have found
00:20:00 --> 00:20:02 they're difficult to spot because
00:20:02 --> 00:20:04 they're characterized by what doesn't
00:20:04 --> 00:20:06 happen rather than what does uh
00:20:06 --> 00:20:08 Supernova is how to miss because it's so
00:20:08 --> 00:20:10 bright and appears in the sky suddenly
00:20:10 --> 00:20:13 an ancient astronomer recorded several
00:20:13 --> 00:20:14 of them but there there are other ones
00:20:14 --> 00:20:16 that have been found that that have just
00:20:16 --> 00:20:20 disappeared as this one has yeah so
00:20:20 --> 00:20:23 usually when a a star explodes Supernova
00:20:23 --> 00:20:27 style uh it produces all these really
00:20:27 --> 00:20:31 incredible elements um that well
00:20:31 --> 00:20:33 documented this one I assume would not
00:20:33 --> 00:20:37 have done that so it didn't pay its toll
00:20:37 --> 00:20:40 maybe not uh and I'm not well enough
00:20:40 --> 00:20:42 versed in Supernova physics to to know
00:20:42 --> 00:20:44 the answer to that def definitively but
00:20:44 --> 00:20:45 I think you're probably right Andrew
00:20:45 --> 00:20:48 that it didn't you know dish out gold
00:20:48 --> 00:20:50 and platinum and all the other stuff
00:20:50 --> 00:20:52 that uh permeates the universe from
00:20:53 --> 00:20:54 Supernova explosions I think that would
00:20:54 --> 00:20:57 be the case that the ejected material is
00:20:57 --> 00:20:59 much too small for it to have paid its
00:20:59 --> 00:21:03 to as you've said yeah so no lithium no
00:21:03 --> 00:21:05 blue Tac
00:21:05 --> 00:21:08 geez that stuff
00:21:08 --> 00:21:12 D what are we going to do okay uh that
00:21:12 --> 00:21:14 is a great story and uh yeah something a
00:21:14 --> 00:21:17 little bit different and um yeah I'm
00:21:17 --> 00:21:19 guessing we'll get some more black hole
00:21:19 --> 00:21:21 questions about that so um yeah does
00:21:21 --> 00:21:23 this well I'll ask one cuz someone's
00:21:23 --> 00:21:25 probably wondering will this be a
00:21:25 --> 00:21:26 different kind of black hole will it be
00:21:26 --> 00:21:29 um unusual in some respect because it
00:21:29 --> 00:21:32 didn't wasn't birthed by a
00:21:32 --> 00:21:35 supernova um I don't think so black
00:21:35 --> 00:21:38 holes are characterized by very few
00:21:38 --> 00:21:41 parameters like uh one of them is the
00:21:41 --> 00:21:45 magnetic field one's the spin uh and so
00:21:45 --> 00:21:47 there's not that much to differentiate
00:21:47 --> 00:21:49 between one black hole and another
00:21:49 --> 00:21:52 except for the mass and the mass is not
00:21:52 --> 00:21:53 that much different it might be a bit
00:21:53 --> 00:21:55 smaller than what you would get from a a
00:21:55 --> 00:21:59 bigger Supernova explosion uh there's a
00:21:59 --> 00:22:02 there's um a theorem that I I always
00:22:02 --> 00:22:04 like the name of about black holes and
00:22:04 --> 00:22:07 it's called the no hair theorem and you
00:22:07 --> 00:22:09 can understand why I quite like that one
00:22:09 --> 00:22:12 and the no hair theorem basically tells
00:22:13 --> 00:22:15 you that you can't see very much from
00:22:15 --> 00:22:18 the outside of a black hole um so you
00:22:18 --> 00:22:20 know like no hair just doesn't give you
00:22:20 --> 00:22:23 much of a clue about what color somebody
00:22:23 --> 00:22:24 say might have been I'm not quite sure
00:22:24 --> 00:22:26 where the term comes from but the no
00:22:26 --> 00:22:28 hair theorem is one that tells you that
00:22:28 --> 00:22:30 there's very few parameters that you can
00:22:30 --> 00:22:33 measure outside the black hole though
00:22:33 --> 00:22:35 they're all much of a muchness excep in
00:22:35 --> 00:22:38 their Mass okay interesting all right
00:22:38 --> 00:22:40 there it is it uh is another story on
00:22:40 --> 00:22:44 fizz. org phys as I keep reminding you
00:22:45 --> 00:22:47 and uh yeah fascinating and unusual
00:22:47 --> 00:22:50 event this is Space Nuts Andrew Dunley
00:22:50 --> 00:22:54 and Professor Fred Watson
00:22:55 --> 00:22:59 here and I feel fine Space Nuts our
00:22:59 --> 00:23:01 final story Fred we're going to look at
00:23:01 --> 00:23:03 Uranus no we're not we don't want to do
00:23:03 --> 00:23:05 that but we are going to look at the
00:23:05 --> 00:23:09 planet and sorry couldn't help it uh any
00:23:09 --> 00:23:11 opportunity uh this is really
00:23:11 --> 00:23:13 interesting though because when Voyager
00:23:13 --> 00:23:15 2 which is the
00:23:15 --> 00:23:19 only uh spacecraft that's visited um
00:23:19 --> 00:23:22 Uranus as far as I'm aware uh went by
00:23:22 --> 00:23:24 took measurements and sent the data back
00:23:24 --> 00:23:25 and we all went oh my gosh this is
00:23:25 --> 00:23:28 unusual how interesting wow now they've
00:23:28 --> 00:23:30 Revisited the daughter and gone oh hang
00:23:30 --> 00:23:31 on a
00:23:31 --> 00:23:34 minute if it had arrived if it had
00:23:34 --> 00:23:37 arrived this I love this bit 2 days
00:23:37 --> 00:23:39 earlier the readings would have been
00:23:39 --> 00:23:40 completely
00:23:40 --> 00:23:44 different this is a really fascinating
00:23:44 --> 00:23:48 story I think so too um and it's you
00:23:48 --> 00:23:49 know we've we've always thought Uranus
00:23:49 --> 00:23:51 was a bit peculiar with I mean it is
00:23:51 --> 00:23:54 peculiar because it's lying on its side
00:23:54 --> 00:23:57 it's uh rotates with its its North Pole
00:23:57 --> 00:23:59 just below the plane of its orbit which
00:23:59 --> 00:24:02 means it's tipped over by about 98 I
00:24:02 --> 00:24:05 think degrees um and that probably is
00:24:05 --> 00:24:07 the result of a a collision at some time
00:24:07 --> 00:24:11 in its past history um but it's also had
00:24:11 --> 00:24:13 other uh aspects that have that have
00:24:13 --> 00:24:14 puzzled
00:24:14 --> 00:24:18 astronomers um very very odd
00:24:18 --> 00:24:20 magnetosphere so the magnetosphere is
00:24:20 --> 00:24:23 the is the region around the planet
00:24:23 --> 00:24:26 which is dominated by its own magnetism
00:24:26 --> 00:24:30 and um the Magneto spere has been
00:24:30 --> 00:24:32 thought to be highly asymmetric very
00:24:32 --> 00:24:37 unusual in shape uh and uh to have
00:24:37 --> 00:24:41 strange you know the the the the um
00:24:41 --> 00:24:44 phenomena to do with the moons of Uranus
00:24:44 --> 00:24:47 have thought to be uh have thought
00:24:47 --> 00:24:50 thought to be been unusual that there
00:24:50 --> 00:24:53 was no evidence for example of there
00:24:53 --> 00:24:56 being any kind of uh ice you know the
00:24:56 --> 00:25:00 conventional ice Moon IDE
00:25:00 --> 00:25:05 uh the the um um the reason for that is
00:25:06 --> 00:25:09 that you detect the sub ice ocean of a
00:25:09 --> 00:25:13 moon by its magnetism by sensing it with
00:25:13 --> 00:25:13 a
00:25:13 --> 00:25:16 magnetometer and um if you can't detect
00:25:16 --> 00:25:19 it then you suspect there isn't any
00:25:19 --> 00:25:22 ocean uh whereas uh in the case of
00:25:22 --> 00:25:25 Uranus it now is thought that because
00:25:25 --> 00:25:28 the mag magnetic bubble that the plan it
00:25:28 --> 00:25:31 lives in was highly distorted maybe that
00:25:31 --> 00:25:35 interpretation was wrong um and um as
00:25:35 --> 00:25:37 you said if it had arrived two days
00:25:37 --> 00:25:39 earlier we would probably have had a
00:25:39 --> 00:25:41 better idea of what was going on and the
00:25:41 --> 00:25:44 reason why uh that two days is important
00:25:44 --> 00:25:47 is because of a a solar flare a an
00:25:47 --> 00:25:50 emission of plasma from the Sun that uh
00:25:50 --> 00:25:54 reached Uranus kind of just before um
00:25:54 --> 00:25:57 just before voer got Voyer 2 got there
00:25:57 --> 00:26:00 uh and totally orted the magnetic bubble
00:26:00 --> 00:26:04 in which the the planet lives so really
00:26:04 --> 00:26:10 very very you know unusual and um uh
00:26:10 --> 00:26:12 perhaps misleading set of observations
00:26:12 --> 00:26:14 were or deductions were made from the
00:26:14 --> 00:26:18 Voyager 2 data which with hindsight uh
00:26:19 --> 00:26:22 might be incorrect and that hindsight is
00:26:22 --> 00:26:23 coming about because people are
00:26:23 --> 00:26:27 reanalyzing the data of Voyer 2 it's uh
00:26:27 --> 00:26:29 something that I think great that we
00:26:29 --> 00:26:31 constantly look back at what we might
00:26:31 --> 00:26:35 call old data old information uh and um
00:26:35 --> 00:26:38 you you can learn new things from it and
00:26:38 --> 00:26:41 this there's a comment sorry a comment
00:26:41 --> 00:26:43 uh by one of the great planetary
00:26:43 --> 00:26:48 scientists of uh of the present day um
00:26:48 --> 00:26:50 uh who works at JPL and is somebody that
00:26:50 --> 00:26:53 we know Linda spilker she was the
00:26:53 --> 00:26:55 project scientist for the Cassini space
00:26:55 --> 00:26:57 mission but back in the day she was also
00:26:57 --> 00:27:01 among the Voyager 2 mission scientists
00:27:01 --> 00:27:05 uh when the flyby took place in uh in
00:27:05 --> 00:27:09 1986 uh the fly by of Uranus um and she
00:27:09 --> 00:27:11 there's a nice quote from her uh again
00:27:11 --> 00:27:12 in one of the articles that we've been
00:27:12 --> 00:27:15 looking at uh she says the flyby was
00:27:15 --> 00:27:17 packed with surprises and we were
00:27:17 --> 00:27:18 searching for an explanation of its
00:27:18 --> 00:27:21 unusual behavior the magnetosphere
00:27:21 --> 00:27:24 Voyager 2 measured was only a snapshot
00:27:24 --> 00:27:27 in time and this new work explains some
00:27:27 --> 00:27:28 of the apparent contrad
00:27:28 --> 00:27:30 and it will change our view of Uranus
00:27:30 --> 00:27:32 once again so she's commenting on this
00:27:32 --> 00:27:35 new research a veteran Observer very
00:27:35 --> 00:27:38 interesting person uh who was a delight
00:27:38 --> 00:27:40 to host back in whatever year it was
00:27:40 --> 00:27:44 might be 2017 I think uh for no yeah I
00:27:44 --> 00:27:46 think it was 2017 just after the end of
00:27:46 --> 00:27:48 the uh of the mission this Cassini
00:27:48 --> 00:27:50 Mission she gave our Alice and levic
00:27:50 --> 00:27:53 lecture here in Sydney so that's how we
00:27:53 --> 00:27:55 got to know her yes of course behind
00:27:55 --> 00:27:56 closed doors everyone's going back to
00:27:56 --> 00:27:59 the original team that oversaw a voyage
00:27:59 --> 00:28:03 or two and said you had one
00:28:03 --> 00:28:06 job yeah maybe that's right on the other
00:28:06 --> 00:28:08 hand you know research is like that
00:28:08 --> 00:28:11 sometimes you bark up the wrong tree for
00:28:11 --> 00:28:13 decades as we've seen here what it's
00:28:13 --> 00:28:16 proven though is that Uranus is
00:28:16 --> 00:28:20 ordinary you know it's more or than we
00:28:20 --> 00:28:21 thought it was that's right yeah more
00:28:21 --> 00:28:22 ordinary than we thought it was it's
00:28:22 --> 00:28:24 like the other gas giants in that
00:28:24 --> 00:28:27 respect but in other ways it is quite
00:28:27 --> 00:28:30 unusual and unique yeah indeed yeah uh
00:28:30 --> 00:28:32 there's a great article on that at
00:28:32 --> 00:28:33 Cosmos
00:28:33 --> 00:28:36 magazine.com if you want to check it out
00:28:36 --> 00:28:38 um th where we're going to end things
00:28:38 --> 00:28:40 Fred thank you very
00:28:40 --> 00:28:42 much thank you Andrew it's been a
00:28:42 --> 00:28:46 delight to talk as always yes yes I like
00:28:46 --> 00:28:48 talking to you my wife won't talk to me
00:28:48 --> 00:28:50 but um talk to you I don't know what's
00:28:50 --> 00:28:54 going on me uh but uh anyway we'll
00:28:54 --> 00:28:57 um uh we will see you next time Fred
00:28:57 --> 00:28:58 thank you very much
00:28:58 --> 00:29:01 I hope so
00:29:01 --> 00:29:05 yeah Fred Watson astronomer at large and
00:29:05 --> 00:29:08 uh Hugh in the studio uh what was Hugh
00:29:08 --> 00:29:09 up to
00:29:09 --> 00:29:12 today nothing didn't help us didn't help
00:29:12 --> 00:29:14 his wife didn't pick up the kids from
00:29:14 --> 00:29:16 school didn't do
00:29:16 --> 00:29:20 anything that's that's you uh although
00:29:20 --> 00:29:21 we're getting I must say we're getting a
00:29:21 --> 00:29:23 lot of emails from people saying can't
00:29:23 --> 00:29:28 you be nice to hear uh no and from me
00:29:28 --> 00:29:30 Andrew Dunley thanks to your company see
00:29:30 --> 00:29:32 you on the next episode of Space Nuts
00:29:32 --> 00:29:35 bye-bye Space Nuts you'll be listening
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