Space Nuts Episode 474 Q&A: Cosmic Constellations, Comet Mysteries, and Citizen Science
Join Andrew Dunkley and Professor Fred Watson as they explore the wonders of the universe in this Q&A edition of Space Nuts. From the shifting constellations as you journey through Space to the enigmatic nature of comets and the age of the universe, this episode is packed with celestial insights and intriguing questions from our audience.
Episode Highlights:
- Constellations from Afar: Discover how the constellations we know would appear from different vantage points in Space. How far must you travel before the familiar star patterns become unrecognisable?
- Comet Tsuchinshan-ATLAS : Delve into the story of Comet Tsuchinshan-ATLAS, its recent appearance in our skies, and the question of whether it has visited our solar system before. Learn about the signs that indicate a comet's history and its journey from the Oort Cloud.
- Age of the Universe: Uncover the methods used to determine the age of the universe, including the role of the Hubble constant and the importance of measuring cosmic distances. How close are we to knowing the exact age?
- Citizen Science Opportunities : Explore the world of citizen science and how you can contribute to astronomical discoveries. From asteroid occultations to light curve data, find out how you can be part of the scientific community.
For more Space Nuts, including our continually updating newsfeed and to listen to all our episodes, visit our website (https://www.spacenutspodcast.com) . Follow us on social media at SpaceNutsPod on facebook, X, YouTube, Tumblr, Instagram, and TikTok. We love engaging with our community, so be sure to drop us a message or comment on your favourite platform.
For more Space and Astronomy News Podcasts, visit our HQ at www.bitesz.com.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spacenutspodcast.com/about (https://www.spacenutspodcast.com/about)
Stay curious, keep looking up, and join us next time for more stellar insights and cosmic wonders. Until then, clear skies and happy stargazing.
00:00 - Space Nuts Q and A edition with Professor Fred Watson
01:29 - Roger asks how far can you go before constellations start getting disoriented
07:45 - Professor Fred and Andrew answer your questions about the Space Nuts podcast
09:13 - On the nights I was best able to observe it, it was cloudy
10:49 - Could this comet be its first visit into the inner solar system
13:47 - How did we measure how old the universe is? Thanks, Fred
19:16 - Sandy asks what is the greatest astronomical discovery by a citizen scientist
✍️ Episode References
Space Nuts Podcast
[Space Nuts Podcast](https://www.spacenutspodcast.com)
New Horizons
[New Horizons](https://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/newhorizons/main/index.html)
Zooniverse
[Zooniverse](https://www.zooniverse.org)
DreamLab App
[DreamLab](https://www.vodafone.com.au/about/news-centre/dreamlab)
Unistellar
[Unistellar](https://unistellaroptics.com)
Galaxy Zoo
[Galaxy Zoo](https://www.zooniverse.org/projects/zookeeper/galaxy-zoo)
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/space-nuts--2631155/support (https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/space-nuts--2631155/support?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=rss) .
Episode link: https://play.headliner.app/episode/24389324?utm_source=youtube
00:00:00 --> 00:00:02 hi there it's Space Nuts yet again how
00:00:02 --> 00:00:04 many are we up to now
00:00:04 --> 00:00:07 474 my goodness it's a Q&A Edition my
00:00:07 --> 00:00:08 name is Andrew Dunley thanks for joining
00:00:08 --> 00:00:12 us uh this time we are going to be
00:00:12 --> 00:00:14 answering questions about what
00:00:14 --> 00:00:16 constellations look like from a
00:00:16 --> 00:00:18 different point in space if you're
00:00:18 --> 00:00:21 traveling when when does it not look
00:00:21 --> 00:00:23 like your neighborhood anymore it's an
00:00:23 --> 00:00:24 interesting question uh we're going to
00:00:24 --> 00:00:27 talk about a comet that's been in the
00:00:27 --> 00:00:29 sky recently and uh I've seen lots of
00:00:29 --> 00:00:31 Happy snaps from people on the Space
00:00:31 --> 00:00:33 Nuts podcast group Facebook page about
00:00:33 --> 00:00:37 this Comet Su chin Shan uh we'll also be
00:00:37 --> 00:00:39 discussing the age of the universe and
00:00:39 --> 00:00:41 citizen science that's all on this
00:00:41 --> 00:00:45 edition of Space Nuts 15 seconds
00:00:45 --> 00:00:49 guidance is internal 10 9 ignition
00:00:49 --> 00:00:54 sequence start Space Nuts 5 4 3 2 1 2 3
00:00:54 --> 00:00:58 4 5 5 4 3 2 space nuts nuts reported
00:00:58 --> 00:01:01 feels good and joining us to answer all
00:01:01 --> 00:01:04 of those questions it is Professor Fred
00:01:04 --> 00:01:07 Watson hello Fred hello Andrew um nice
00:01:07 --> 00:01:10 to see you here it's very good yes yes
00:01:10 --> 00:01:12 uh how you been since I saw you
00:01:12 --> 00:01:15 last sitting here
00:01:15 --> 00:01:18 really just waiting for something to
00:01:18 --> 00:01:22 happen funny that funny um shall we get
00:01:22 --> 00:01:25 stuck straight into it we should yeah my
00:01:25 --> 00:01:27 coffee is going cold so we should oh
00:01:27 --> 00:01:30 yeah yeah get into that uh we going to
00:01:31 --> 00:01:35 New York first this is a question from
00:01:35 --> 00:01:40 Roger rer driver I'm traveling through
00:01:40 --> 00:01:43 the adarand park in Upstate New York I
00:01:43 --> 00:01:45 got a question about the
00:01:45 --> 00:01:47 constellations I'm guessing that
00:01:47 --> 00:01:49 anywhere in our solar system you went
00:01:49 --> 00:01:52 they pretty much look the same but how
00:01:52 --> 00:01:54 far would you have to go before things
00:01:54 --> 00:01:57 start to get disoriented we were to we
00:01:57 --> 00:02:00 were to go to Alpha centar
00:02:00 --> 00:02:03 like four light years away would you
00:02:03 --> 00:02:05 still recognize some of them or would
00:02:06 --> 00:02:08 they be completely
00:02:08 --> 00:02:10 disoriented and uh I'm kind of thinking
00:02:10 --> 00:02:13 of like science fiction shows where they
00:02:13 --> 00:02:16 show the Stars flying by like trees when
00:02:16 --> 00:02:19 you're going down the road I'm kind of
00:02:19 --> 00:02:20 guessing it wouldn't look like that
00:02:21 --> 00:02:22 because of the distance between them
00:02:22 --> 00:02:25 that they probably look like they stayed
00:02:25 --> 00:02:26 in the same place
00:02:26 --> 00:02:29 but um well the question is how far can
00:02:29 --> 00:02:31 you go before thing before you don't
00:02:31 --> 00:02:33 recognize the neighborhood
00:02:33 --> 00:02:37 anymore all right loving the show guys
00:02:37 --> 00:02:38 keep on
00:02:38 --> 00:02:40 tring there he
00:02:40 --> 00:02:44 is thank you Roger always love that um
00:02:44 --> 00:02:47 haven't heard from Roger in a while uh
00:02:47 --> 00:02:48 yeah there was an
00:02:49 --> 00:02:51 interesting um analogy about driving
00:02:51 --> 00:02:53 down the highway and the trees fly past
00:02:53 --> 00:02:56 they do portray space travel that way
00:02:56 --> 00:02:58 with the Stars but I think it would
00:02:58 --> 00:03:01 probably be a much more boring view than
00:03:01 --> 00:03:04 that in real terms after a while I mean
00:03:04 --> 00:03:06 it' be pretty extraordinary to look at
00:03:06 --> 00:03:08 but eventually you'd be saying oh yeah
00:03:08 --> 00:03:11 there it is that stars still
00:03:11 --> 00:03:14 there yeah I might check it in a
00:03:14 --> 00:03:17 thousand years time and see where it is
00:03:17 --> 00:03:19 um it might be a bit like
00:03:19 --> 00:03:22 that uh it probably is actually I mean
00:03:22 --> 00:03:26 um for first of all we you know on human
00:03:26 --> 00:03:28 time scales with the technology that we
00:03:28 --> 00:03:30 have today uh it takes a long time to
00:03:30 --> 00:03:35 get even beyond the orbit of of Pluto uh
00:03:35 --> 00:03:36 as we know from New Horizons which I
00:03:36 --> 00:03:39 think took nine years to get from Earth
00:03:39 --> 00:03:42 to Pluto on its epic Voyage in the early
00:03:42 --> 00:03:46 part of this Century um and it it is
00:03:46 --> 00:03:50 interesting that um that that has been
00:03:50 --> 00:03:53 used as a baseline to directly measure
00:03:53 --> 00:03:55 the distance to some of the Stars the
00:03:56 --> 00:03:58 fact that we know where a star is from
00:03:58 --> 00:04:01 the Earth and yeah you get to what is it
00:04:01 --> 00:04:03 30 30 astronomical units something like
00:04:04 --> 00:04:07 that the distance out to Pluto 30 40 and
00:04:07 --> 00:04:09 then astronomical unit is 150 million
00:04:09 --> 00:04:11 kilometers the distance from the Earth
00:04:11 --> 00:04:15 to the sun uh to get a A View from there
00:04:15 --> 00:04:19 uh their positions look very very
00:04:19 --> 00:04:21 slightly different uh you need to
00:04:21 --> 00:04:24 measure them accurately with the kind of
00:04:24 --> 00:04:27 equipment that New Horizons has on board
00:04:27 --> 00:04:28 but yeah you can see the difference
00:04:28 --> 00:04:30 there you can see what we call the par
00:04:30 --> 00:04:33 the dist the different um position in
00:04:33 --> 00:04:35 the sky that a star looks looks to be
00:04:35 --> 00:04:37 from different things yes and the name
00:04:37 --> 00:04:41 of a a well-known book by an author who
00:04:41 --> 00:04:42 has a voice very similar to the one that
00:04:42 --> 00:04:44 you're not listening to now but you will
00:04:44 --> 00:04:47 be in a second I think I think I know
00:04:47 --> 00:04:50 him yes I just happened to I just
00:04:50 --> 00:04:51 happened to have have a copy of the book
00:04:51 --> 00:04:54 on my desk as you mentioned so there you
00:04:54 --> 00:04:56 are yeah yeah it's a great great word
00:04:56 --> 00:05:00 and a great title for a book um but you
00:05:00 --> 00:05:02 know Roger comments are right on the
00:05:02 --> 00:05:04 money uh you got to go a long way before
00:05:04 --> 00:05:05 the constellations start looking
00:05:05 --> 00:05:07 different think if you went to Alpha
00:05:08 --> 00:05:11 centu you'd look at the sky and think uh
00:05:11 --> 00:05:13 that's pretty well the same sky that we
00:05:13 --> 00:05:17 see from oh really except actually for
00:05:17 --> 00:05:20 except for you know the alpha centu
00:05:20 --> 00:05:23 itself of the alpha centu systems is a
00:05:23 --> 00:05:25 triple triple star system that would
00:05:25 --> 00:05:27 look pretty damn bright um yeah and so
00:05:27 --> 00:05:30 you wouldn't really see the stars of
00:05:30 --> 00:05:32 Centaurus but a lot of the stars in the
00:05:32 --> 00:05:35 sky are at distances which you measure
00:05:35 --> 00:05:38 in hundreds of light years I guess with
00:05:38 --> 00:05:40 a naked eye we see out to about very
00:05:41 --> 00:05:43 roughly a thousand light years and so
00:05:43 --> 00:05:46 traveling just for for an a bit light
00:05:46 --> 00:05:48 years is not going to change things that
00:05:48 --> 00:05:49 much there'll be some constellations
00:05:49 --> 00:05:51 that will have the odd star looking as
00:05:51 --> 00:05:53 though it's in the wrong place and said
00:05:53 --> 00:05:55 Taurus will be one of them because
00:05:55 --> 00:05:57 you're right next to one of the stars of
00:05:57 --> 00:06:00 Centaurus uh but um
00:06:00 --> 00:06:02 I think generally speaking you will be
00:06:02 --> 00:06:04 able to recognize them they might look
00:06:04 --> 00:06:06 just slightly wared but you'll be able
00:06:06 --> 00:06:08 to recognize them it was certainly a
00:06:08 --> 00:06:11 common feature of textbooks that I used
00:06:11 --> 00:06:14 to read on astronomy when I was a you
00:06:14 --> 00:06:16 know a youngster growing up and getting
00:06:17 --> 00:06:18 interested in astronomy it's a common
00:06:18 --> 00:06:21 feature to have pictures of
00:06:21 --> 00:06:24 constellations as they are now as they
00:06:24 --> 00:06:27 would be in 10 years as they would
00:06:27 --> 00:06:30 be in 50 years uh and you know and
00:06:31 --> 00:06:32 so it goes on and that's because of the
00:06:32 --> 00:06:34 intrinsic motions of the Stars
00:06:34 --> 00:06:35 themselves it's not because we're
00:06:35 --> 00:06:38 changing our Vantage Point uh but it was
00:06:38 --> 00:06:40 always the same you could see the basic
00:06:40 --> 00:06:42 outline of a constellation and it would
00:06:43 --> 00:06:44 just change slightly sort of you know
00:06:44 --> 00:06:46 you realize that it's not quite the same
00:06:46 --> 00:06:47 that something's a bit different about
00:06:48 --> 00:06:50 it so I think that will be what you'd
00:06:50 --> 00:06:52 see as as you journeyed deeper and
00:06:52 --> 00:06:53 deeper into
00:06:53 --> 00:06:56 space yeah so you'd have to go a heck of
00:06:56 --> 00:07:00 a long way before you really sort of
00:07:00 --> 00:07:02 went where the hell am I yeah I think I
00:07:02 --> 00:07:05 think 50 light years 100 light years you
00:07:05 --> 00:07:07 would start seeing a completely
00:07:07 --> 00:07:10 different set of you know set of St
00:07:10 --> 00:07:11 patterns you you really would worry
00:07:12 --> 00:07:14 where where you were this would be a
00:07:14 --> 00:07:16 very alien Sky to
00:07:16 --> 00:07:20 you yes yes indeed uh but a really
00:07:20 --> 00:07:23 interesting question and uh that's great
00:07:23 --> 00:07:25 and you know not surprising that it's
00:07:25 --> 00:07:27 come from Roger who spends a lot of time
00:07:27 --> 00:07:29 traveling and he probably is driving
00:07:29 --> 00:07:31 along and the trees were flashing past
00:07:31 --> 00:07:34 and he went wait a minute yep there's a
00:07:34 --> 00:07:37 question in that so there it is
00:07:37 --> 00:07:43 um thank you Roger well
00:07:43 --> 00:07:46 done also Space Nuts uh our next
00:07:46 --> 00:07:51 question comes from Lisa uh Lisa is from
00:07:51 --> 00:07:54 Prince George in British Columbia in
00:07:54 --> 00:07:57 Canada uh hello Professor Fred and
00:07:57 --> 00:07:59 Andrew I was lucky enough to have clear
00:07:59 --> 00:08:01 guys to see
00:08:01 --> 00:08:03 Comet I'm going to get it right this
00:08:03 --> 00:08:07 time Su chin Shan was passing by y was
00:08:07 --> 00:08:10 passing by and got to observe it uh two
00:08:10 --> 00:08:12 nights in a row I shared a few pictures
00:08:12 --> 00:08:14 on the Space Nuts podcast group Facebook
00:08:14 --> 00:08:16 page if anyone is interested I probably
00:08:16 --> 00:08:20 saw them uh Lisa yes I did too yeah
00:08:20 --> 00:08:22 witnessing such a rare event was truly a
00:08:22 --> 00:08:25 inspiring and it got me thinking we know
00:08:25 --> 00:08:27 this comet has an orbital period of
00:08:27 --> 00:08:31 880 years but do we know for sure
00:08:31 --> 00:08:33 that it's been here before is it
00:08:33 --> 00:08:35 possible that it dropped out of the or
00:08:35 --> 00:08:38 Cloud more recently and is on its first
00:08:38 --> 00:08:41 lap so to speak uh is there any way to
00:08:41 --> 00:08:44 tell uh other than direct observation if
00:08:44 --> 00:08:46 a comet is a repeat visitor thanks for a
00:08:46 --> 00:08:48 wonderful podcast I've been listening
00:08:48 --> 00:08:51 since 2018 and love both the show and
00:08:51 --> 00:08:53 the community that has formed around it
00:08:54 --> 00:08:56 Lisa oh that's lovely Lisa glad you're
00:08:56 --> 00:08:59 um enjoying being part of the Space Nuts
00:08:59 --> 00:09:01 pod group on Facebook and if you're not
00:09:01 --> 00:09:03 yet maybe you should go along and have a
00:09:03 --> 00:09:05 look because it is uh a great little
00:09:05 --> 00:09:07 page and uh you know I think everyone
00:09:07 --> 00:09:10 really enjoys their um their time there
00:09:10 --> 00:09:12 and their company and the conversation
00:09:12 --> 00:09:15 they have with each other however we
00:09:15 --> 00:09:17 have an important question to answer
00:09:17 --> 00:09:20 with t chin Shan the comet that was in
00:09:20 --> 00:09:23 the sky recently uh on the nights I was
00:09:23 --> 00:09:25 best able to observe it it was cloudy
00:09:25 --> 00:09:27 and then when it finally cleared up the
00:09:27 --> 00:09:29 darn thing was too low on the horizon
00:09:29 --> 00:09:32 for me to get a a look at it so I never
00:09:32 --> 00:09:34 ever got to see it myself which I'm very
00:09:34 --> 00:09:36 disappointed about but I'm I'm pretty
00:09:36 --> 00:09:39 sure it won't be the last one to pass by
00:09:39 --> 00:09:41 in the next several years so I might get
00:09:41 --> 00:09:42 a shot at another
00:09:42 --> 00:09:46 one oh you will um and um i' got a
00:09:46 --> 00:09:49 similar story to you Andrew which is
00:09:49 --> 00:09:51 that um when it was at its brightest in
00:09:51 --> 00:09:53 the evening sky here in Sydney we had
00:09:53 --> 00:09:55 really overcast weather which we've got
00:09:55 --> 00:09:58 now it's been like this for a month uh
00:09:58 --> 00:09:59 and it's
00:09:59 --> 00:10:02 not very conducive to astronomy but I
00:10:02 --> 00:10:04 was lucky enough when we were I think I
00:10:04 --> 00:10:07 told you we were man and I were down at
00:10:07 --> 00:10:10 place called Sea Lake uh near Lake tyell
00:10:10 --> 00:10:14 in Northern Victoria uh for a starfest
00:10:14 --> 00:10:17 and there were lots of telescopes there
00:10:17 --> 00:10:21 and one of them uh had uh his one of the
00:10:21 --> 00:10:23 astronomers who was using these
00:10:23 --> 00:10:25 telescopes had his telescope coupled to
00:10:25 --> 00:10:29 a a detector a real time detector uh in
00:10:29 --> 00:10:32 other words a TV camera and um and he
00:10:32 --> 00:10:35 was showing the results on a screen and
00:10:35 --> 00:10:38 he was actually pointing it at tuin
00:10:38 --> 00:10:42 chanin Shan uh and so I did see it uh
00:10:42 --> 00:10:44 but not through the telescope but I saw
00:10:44 --> 00:10:47 it live as it was on the screen uh so
00:10:47 --> 00:10:50 that cheered me up quite a lot um now to
00:10:50 --> 00:10:53 Lisa's question that's a really good one
00:10:53 --> 00:10:56 as well uh and and this business of the
00:10:56 --> 00:10:58 80 years it's a little bit of a
00:10:58 --> 00:11:02 Movable Feast because comets are often
00:11:02 --> 00:11:04 their orbits are perturbed strongly by
00:11:04 --> 00:11:05 the gravity of other objects in the
00:11:05 --> 00:11:09 solar system including uh in particular
00:11:09 --> 00:11:12 the planet Jupiter which is um yeah the
00:11:12 --> 00:11:14 biggest of the planets and so often
00:11:14 --> 00:11:16 there the orbital period of these very
00:11:16 --> 00:11:21 long period comets changes um now to to
00:11:21 --> 00:11:23 the knb of the question could this be
00:11:23 --> 00:11:25 its first visit into the inner solar
00:11:25 --> 00:11:28 system um I think it could be I'm not
00:11:28 --> 00:11:32 sure this case uh and I should have read
00:11:32 --> 00:11:35 up on this because there are markers in
00:11:35 --> 00:11:37 a comet's emissions when it gets near
00:11:37 --> 00:11:41 the Sun that give you some idea uh as to
00:11:41 --> 00:11:44 how many times it has been round the
00:11:44 --> 00:11:46 tracks in other words how many times
00:11:46 --> 00:11:49 it's it's passed close by the sun
00:11:49 --> 00:11:51 because it changes the structure of the
00:11:51 --> 00:11:53 Comet every time it goes around the Sun
00:11:53 --> 00:11:56 you get more of the volatiles blown away
00:11:56 --> 00:11:59 and you're left with a more Dusty body
00:11:59 --> 00:12:01 and I think this you know the rate at
00:12:01 --> 00:12:03 which these chemicals uh the elements
00:12:03 --> 00:12:06 within and molecules within the Comets
00:12:06 --> 00:12:10 ice icy uh body the the the rate at
00:12:11 --> 00:12:13 which these are dispersed into space
00:12:13 --> 00:12:15 changes uh depending on which compound
00:12:16 --> 00:12:18 you're talking about and so I think by
00:12:18 --> 00:12:21 looking at the the mix of chemicals that
00:12:21 --> 00:12:23 is being emitted by a comet when it gets
00:12:23 --> 00:12:25 near the sun you can get some idea of
00:12:26 --> 00:12:27 how many times it's visited the sun now
00:12:27 --> 00:12:29 I'm I'm only
00:12:29 --> 00:12:31 saying things that I recall from having
00:12:31 --> 00:12:33 looked this up a long time ago so there
00:12:33 --> 00:12:36 might be nuances in that that aren't um
00:12:36 --> 00:12:37 correct and there might also be details
00:12:37 --> 00:12:40 that I haven't really explained but the
00:12:40 --> 00:12:42 bottom line is that it may have been the
00:12:42 --> 00:12:44 first time around the Sun uh if not we
00:12:44 --> 00:12:46 might have ways of of knowing about it
00:12:46 --> 00:12:47 and I should check them out just to see
00:12:47 --> 00:12:51 what the pundits say about that yeah
00:12:51 --> 00:12:54 well it was only discovered last year um
00:12:54 --> 00:12:56 that's right it was so it's it was on
00:12:56 --> 00:12:59 its incoming orbit last year so we know
00:12:59 --> 00:13:01 but the the first thing I just did a
00:13:01 --> 00:13:03 quick search and you know I've said has
00:13:03 --> 00:13:07 the comet been here before and it says
00:13:07 --> 00:13:08 it has never reached the inner solar
00:13:08 --> 00:13:10 system in human history before now
00:13:10 --> 00:13:13 apparently so there you are call for it
00:13:13 --> 00:13:16 it's it's a pristine Comet that's I
00:13:16 --> 00:13:18 thought okay so we just have to wait
00:13:18 --> 00:13:21 80 years to have another look at it
00:13:21 --> 00:13:25 and see what what's changed yeah yeah
00:13:25 --> 00:13:27 yes indeed there's a few that are going
00:13:27 --> 00:13:29 to be quicker than that that's that's
00:13:29 --> 00:13:31 that's the good news uh thank you Lisa
00:13:31 --> 00:13:33 though really good question and yeah
00:13:33 --> 00:13:34 you're right it's it's the first time
00:13:34 --> 00:13:37 it's been here apparently this is Space
00:13:37 --> 00:13:40 Nuts uh with Andrew Dunley and Professor
00:13:40 --> 00:13:43 Fred
00:13:43 --> 00:13:47 Watson and feel Space Nuts now Fred to
00:13:47 --> 00:13:49 our next question uh although we're not
00:13:49 --> 00:13:52 moving far around the globe because this
00:13:52 --> 00:13:54 one comes from David who happens to live
00:13:54 --> 00:13:58 in Canada hello Andrew and Professor
00:13:58 --> 00:14:03 Watson David here from St John's new
00:14:03 --> 00:14:07 Canada um just wondering how did
00:14:07 --> 00:14:09 we
00:14:09 --> 00:14:12 measure how old the universe is thanks
00:14:12 --> 00:14:15 love the podcast bye thanks David um I'm
00:14:15 --> 00:14:19 going to ask David a question that every
00:14:19 --> 00:14:21 time I travel and I tell people I'm
00:14:21 --> 00:14:23 Australian they'll say oh do you know
00:14:23 --> 00:14:26 John
00:14:26 --> 00:14:31 rwe so David do you know Lisa
00:14:31 --> 00:14:33 now I gather from the uh the um
00:14:33 --> 00:14:35 provinces they live in they're probably
00:14:35 --> 00:14:38 not very close together at
00:14:38 --> 00:14:41 all get that a lot I get that a lot when
00:14:42 --> 00:14:43 I travel it's
00:14:44 --> 00:14:47 ridiculous uh well I might know him
00:14:47 --> 00:14:50 except there are 30 million other people
00:14:50 --> 00:14:54 that you know oh yeah it's funny it is
00:14:54 --> 00:14:57 funny um age of the universe how do we
00:14:57 --> 00:14:59 know it's right how did we measure it in
00:14:59 --> 00:15:01 the first place what's what's the gos
00:15:01 --> 00:15:05 there so uh yeah so the first
00:15:06 --> 00:15:07 measurements made of the age of the
00:15:07 --> 00:15:11 universe were when we started measuring
00:15:11 --> 00:15:12 What's called the Hubble constant and
00:15:12 --> 00:15:14 the Hubble constant is the current rate
00:15:14 --> 00:15:16 of expansion of the universe it's how
00:15:16 --> 00:15:19 fast it's expanding now and it's an easy
00:15:19 --> 00:15:21 calculation to go from that if you
00:15:21 --> 00:15:23 assume the expansion has been constant
00:15:23 --> 00:15:24 throughout the history of the universe
00:15:24 --> 00:15:27 it's an easy calculation to go from the
00:15:27 --> 00:15:30 expansion velocity back to when
00:15:30 --> 00:15:32 everything was at the same point in
00:15:32 --> 00:15:35 space uh and you get the answer you get
00:15:35 --> 00:15:37 an answer of about if I remember right
00:15:37 --> 00:15:41 it's about 15 billion uh years uh so
00:15:41 --> 00:15:44 that was the first way that we we
00:15:44 --> 00:15:46 evaluated the edge of the universe and I
00:15:46 --> 00:15:48 guess that was in the early
00:15:48 --> 00:15:51 60s 70s when when the Big Bang Theory
00:15:51 --> 00:15:53 was really becoming very much the theory
00:15:53 --> 00:15:57 uh of the universe as we know it rather
00:15:57 --> 00:16:00 than one that was just a high hypothesis
00:16:00 --> 00:16:03 and so uh that's the first way but there
00:16:03 --> 00:16:06 are there are other ways of doing it and
00:16:07 --> 00:16:11 um we can you can sort of again it comes
00:16:11 --> 00:16:13 to it's all about accurately measuring
00:16:13 --> 00:16:15 distances and things of that sort
00:16:15 --> 00:16:17 because that's what you need to do to to
00:16:17 --> 00:16:19 to to get a good idea of well first of
00:16:19 --> 00:16:21 all the Hubble constant you've got to
00:16:21 --> 00:16:23 you you've got to evaluate what that is
00:16:23 --> 00:16:25 and it needs the measurement of
00:16:25 --> 00:16:27 distances um and there are two ways of
00:16:27 --> 00:16:30 measuring distances in this kind of
00:16:30 --> 00:16:33 context one is standard rulers and the
00:16:33 --> 00:16:37 other is standard candles uh so standard
00:16:37 --> 00:16:40 candle is is is a a light source that
00:16:40 --> 00:16:42 you hold up uh whose intrinsic
00:16:42 --> 00:16:45 brightness that you know uh and then you
00:16:45 --> 00:16:49 see how how how bright it is from your
00:16:49 --> 00:16:50 Vantage Point and if you know the
00:16:50 --> 00:16:51 intrinsic brightness you can work out
00:16:51 --> 00:16:54 the distance and that's how the
00:16:54 --> 00:16:58 Supernova uh work Works uh people are
00:16:58 --> 00:16:59 doing
00:16:59 --> 00:17:02 investigations of uh of the in fact in
00:17:02 --> 00:17:04 particular the dark energy and the
00:17:04 --> 00:17:05 accelerated expansion of the universe
00:17:05 --> 00:17:09 they look at Supernova explosions of a
00:17:09 --> 00:17:10 particular type that we know has a
00:17:10 --> 00:17:13 certain brightness and uh from that you
00:17:13 --> 00:17:15 can deduce the supernova's distance and
00:17:15 --> 00:17:17 from that you can tell whether your
00:17:17 --> 00:17:19 value of the Hubble constant is right or
00:17:19 --> 00:17:21 whether it needs tweaking and the
00:17:21 --> 00:17:23 standard ruler method actually goes back
00:17:23 --> 00:17:25 to uh the early Universe when there are
00:17:25 --> 00:17:28 characteristic separations of galaxies
00:17:28 --> 00:17:30 and even before that the characteristic
00:17:30 --> 00:17:33 separation of the hot and cold features
00:17:33 --> 00:17:35 the warm and cool features in the cosmic
00:17:35 --> 00:17:38 microwave background radiation give you
00:17:38 --> 00:17:41 an idea about um the you know the the
00:17:41 --> 00:17:43 age of the universe the state of the
00:17:43 --> 00:17:45 universe at that time so all these
00:17:45 --> 00:17:46 things come together and you you've got
00:17:46 --> 00:17:49 a much more subtle value for the age of
00:17:49 --> 00:17:50 the universe we now think it's 13.8
00:17:50 --> 00:17:53 billion years but that's not that
00:17:53 --> 00:17:54 different from just taking a
00:17:54 --> 00:17:57 straightforward um you know linear
00:17:57 --> 00:18:01 expansion uh since since zero uh uh to
00:18:01 --> 00:18:04 uh you know determine the edge of the
00:18:04 --> 00:18:05 Universe from the directly from the
00:18:05 --> 00:18:08 Hubble constant so 13.8 billion years
00:18:08 --> 00:18:10 it's got a lot of input into it but uh
00:18:10 --> 00:18:12 even the crudest method gives us
00:18:12 --> 00:18:15 something similar to that I while you
00:18:15 --> 00:18:16 were talking I thought I'll do a Google
00:18:17 --> 00:18:21 Search and I asked what is the exact age
00:18:21 --> 00:18:24 of the universe and the answer was
00:18:24 --> 00:18:26 interesting according to estimates the
00:18:26 --> 00:18:29 universe is 13.7 billion years old with
00:18:29 --> 00:18:30 an
00:18:30 --> 00:18:33 uncertainty of 200 million years we
00:18:33 --> 00:18:36 can't really be exact can we yeah no
00:18:36 --> 00:18:39 that's right uh so our our techn
00:18:39 --> 00:18:42 technology has to improve um I have
00:18:42 --> 00:18:47 always had uh not a theory but uh the
00:18:47 --> 00:18:51 notion that when we do get down to the
00:18:51 --> 00:18:52 exact age of the
00:18:52 --> 00:18:55 universe uh it will turn out to have
00:18:55 --> 00:18:58 been created on the 1st of April and
00:18:58 --> 00:18:59 that will tell us things about the
00:18:59 --> 00:19:01 universe that we probably don't really
00:19:01 --> 00:19:05 want to know it's just one big joke yeah
00:19:05 --> 00:19:09 oh oh how are we laughed yes imagine so
00:19:09 --> 00:19:11 uh so there it is David um several ways
00:19:11 --> 00:19:13 of making the measurement and they'll
00:19:13 --> 00:19:16 come up with round about the same
00:19:16 --> 00:19:19 number uh finally Fred we have a
00:19:19 --> 00:19:22 question from Sandy I love these short
00:19:22 --> 00:19:25 form questions um hi Fred and Andrew are
00:19:25 --> 00:19:27 there citizen science programs that you
00:19:27 --> 00:19:31 know of where average people I.E me uh
00:19:31 --> 00:19:35 help with scientific data for asteroid
00:19:35 --> 00:19:38 occultations occultations and light
00:19:38 --> 00:19:40 curve data submission for stars and
00:19:40 --> 00:19:43 asteroids wow thanks
00:19:43 --> 00:19:47 Sandy uh yes another great question um
00:19:47 --> 00:19:49 and good on you Sandy that means you're
00:19:49 --> 00:19:52 making measurements and uh and citizen
00:19:52 --> 00:19:53 science is a great way of getting those
00:19:53 --> 00:19:57 measurements into our knowledge base um
00:19:57 --> 00:19:59 so the first thing that came to my mind
00:19:59 --> 00:20:00 was
00:20:00 --> 00:20:04 theuniverse uh and Z universe is a kind
00:20:04 --> 00:20:06 of Suite of Citizen science programs
00:20:06 --> 00:20:09 that started I think with the Galaxy Zoo
00:20:10 --> 00:20:12 project which was citizen science
00:20:12 --> 00:20:14 citizen scientists looking at images
00:20:14 --> 00:20:18 from the Sloan digital Sky survey and
00:20:18 --> 00:20:20 that's a telescope in New Mexico that
00:20:20 --> 00:20:24 surveyed the the northern sky in very
00:20:24 --> 00:20:26 great detail discovered all these weird
00:20:26 --> 00:20:29 and wonderful objects uh and
00:20:29 --> 00:20:32 day among the galaxies uh I mean the
00:20:32 --> 00:20:34 weird and wonderful galaxies is probably
00:20:34 --> 00:20:36 what mostly this was about hence the
00:20:36 --> 00:20:39 name Galaxy Zoo uh which produced some
00:20:39 --> 00:20:43 quite extraordinary discoveries um uh
00:20:43 --> 00:20:45 Han's object is one that comes to mind I
00:20:45 --> 00:20:46 think we might have mentioned that
00:20:46 --> 00:20:49 recently uh a green blob next to a
00:20:49 --> 00:20:51 Galaxy which was eventually traced to
00:20:51 --> 00:20:54 gas fluorescing after an outburst from
00:20:54 --> 00:20:56 the center of the Galaxy probably a Burt
00:20:56 --> 00:20:58 by the black hole at the center of the
00:20:58 --> 00:21:00 Galaxy uh some millions or even billions
00:21:00 --> 00:21:03 of years ago Han's Han's the it was
00:21:03 --> 00:21:06 called because that's I think that's the
00:21:06 --> 00:21:08 the Dutch word for object and she was a
00:21:08 --> 00:21:11 Dutch school teacher she probably still
00:21:11 --> 00:21:14 is uh so that sort of thing uh was a
00:21:14 --> 00:21:15 particular version of citiz and science
00:21:15 --> 00:21:18 but that sort of spread its tentacles
00:21:18 --> 00:21:20 and became something called
00:21:20 --> 00:21:23 theuniverse uh which I think has a
00:21:23 --> 00:21:25 number of different projects in it and I
00:21:25 --> 00:21:28 think there may well be uh there may
00:21:28 --> 00:21:30 well be asteroid
00:21:30 --> 00:21:33 occultation uh you know Pages or light
00:21:33 --> 00:21:36 data light curve pages I actually just
00:21:36 --> 00:21:38 Googled cities and science asteroid
00:21:38 --> 00:21:40 occultations they came up with a number
00:21:40 --> 00:21:43 of interesting websites unistella has
00:21:43 --> 00:21:46 one uh unistellar citizen science
00:21:46 --> 00:21:50 unistellar is a company that um is
00:21:50 --> 00:21:52 actually manufactures a very particular
00:21:52 --> 00:21:56 kind of telescope uh and they they have
00:21:56 --> 00:21:59 an asteroid occultation citizen science
00:21:59 --> 00:22:01 page that's one to look for uh I also
00:22:01 --> 00:22:04 Googled uh light curves I think citizen
00:22:04 --> 00:22:06 science light curves that came up with a
00:22:06 --> 00:22:10 whole lot of uh things one of them is uh
00:22:10 --> 00:22:13 uh is actually uh you know the Hubble
00:22:13 --> 00:22:15 telescope has Global citiz and science
00:22:15 --> 00:22:17 projects of its own but Zuli versus
00:22:17 --> 00:22:20 perhaps the the classification that's
00:22:20 --> 00:22:23 biggest and perhaps most popular uh and
00:22:23 --> 00:22:25 they certainly do have a variable star
00:22:25 --> 00:22:29 like C um uh
00:22:29 --> 00:22:30 citizen science project there are
00:22:30 --> 00:22:33 specialist astronomical societies that
00:22:33 --> 00:22:35 do both of those things as well there
00:22:35 --> 00:22:38 there's socities dedicated to asteroid
00:22:38 --> 00:22:40 observations and uh dedicated to
00:22:40 --> 00:22:44 variable star work uh most of them are
00:22:44 --> 00:22:45 international and very well established
00:22:45 --> 00:22:48 and they're not that hard to find so
00:22:48 --> 00:22:49 have a have a look around Sandy and
00:22:49 --> 00:22:51 you're sure to find the right one for
00:22:51 --> 00:22:54 you oh yeah I I thought I'd just throw
00:22:54 --> 00:22:55 one out there and say you know what is
00:22:56 --> 00:22:57 what is the greatest discovery by you
00:22:57 --> 00:22:59 know Astron IAL Discovery by a citizen
00:22:59 --> 00:23:02 scientists and it it went straight to an
00:23:03 --> 00:23:07 August 2024 article in f.org citizen
00:23:07 --> 00:23:09 science projects identify 20 new
00:23:09 --> 00:23:11 astronomical discoveries and that
00:23:11 --> 00:23:15 included um uh previously unidentified
00:23:15 --> 00:23:18 Supernova yeah uh and uh there's more
00:23:18 --> 00:23:21 than 2 volunteers across 105
00:23:21 --> 00:23:23 countries that are working on uh on
00:23:23 --> 00:23:25 these projects the project is called
00:23:25 --> 00:23:30 kill Anova Seekers and
00:23:30 --> 00:23:33 they they're aing to find kilon no the
00:23:33 --> 00:23:36 explo cosmic explosions of neutron stars
00:23:36 --> 00:23:38 and black holes colliding in distant
00:23:38 --> 00:23:40 galaxies so there's there's all sorts of
00:23:40 --> 00:23:41 stuff going on out there if you if you
00:23:42 --> 00:23:43 search deep enough you you'll find what
00:23:43 --> 00:23:46 you or in terms of Citizen science in in
00:23:46 --> 00:23:50 the realm of astronomy so um yeah there
00:23:50 --> 00:23:52 there's a lot going on I I don't do it
00:23:52 --> 00:23:55 with astronomy but um I do do a little
00:23:55 --> 00:23:58 bit of um a thing that's not I don't
00:23:58 --> 00:24:00 suppose you call it citizen science I
00:24:00 --> 00:24:05 downloaded an app called dreamlab Dr lab
00:24:05 --> 00:24:07 and what what it does is at night when I
00:24:07 --> 00:24:12 put my mobile phone on a um on a charger
00:24:12 --> 00:24:15 I open up the dreamlab app and I just
00:24:15 --> 00:24:17 click Start session and it starts
00:24:17 --> 00:24:20 crunching numbers using my phone as part
00:24:20 --> 00:24:24 of a giant computer to sort out um
00:24:24 --> 00:24:26 whatever scientific problem somebody's
00:24:26 --> 00:24:28 trying to solve the last I did which
00:24:29 --> 00:24:32 took two years to Crunch was um a
00:24:32 --> 00:24:35 covid-19 calculation interes yeah right
00:24:35 --> 00:24:38 now I'm doing one through dreamlab um
00:24:38 --> 00:24:40 supporting the tropical Cyclone modeling
00:24:40 --> 00:24:44 phase 4 study so it's all sorts of
00:24:44 --> 00:24:46 subjects um that you could that's
00:24:46 --> 00:24:49 amazing stuff yeah cell identity Hunter
00:24:50 --> 00:24:52 phase two which is an Italian study the
00:24:52 --> 00:24:54 Imperial College London is doing a study
00:24:54 --> 00:24:57 on long covid so if you want to download
00:24:57 --> 00:24:59 if you want to use your phone for very
00:24:59 --> 00:25:02 positive reasons you may find um
00:25:02 --> 00:25:04 astronomical studies that you can do
00:25:04 --> 00:25:05 through a mobile phone app or if you
00:25:05 --> 00:25:08 want to help in um in so many other
00:25:08 --> 00:25:10 areas uh just have a look for dreamlab
00:25:10 --> 00:25:12 dreamlab with a little purple cloud is
00:25:12 --> 00:25:16 the icon I um basically let my let
00:25:16 --> 00:25:20 whoever use my phone when I'm asleep to
00:25:20 --> 00:25:22 um crunch calculations so it's a it's a
00:25:23 --> 00:25:24 good way to use mobile
00:25:24 --> 00:25:27 technology um for for the greater good I
00:25:27 --> 00:25:30 reckon but uh yeah Sandy I don't think
00:25:30 --> 00:25:31 you'll have any trouble finding um
00:25:31 --> 00:25:34 citizen science groups in those areas
00:25:34 --> 00:25:36 that you asked about thanks for your
00:25:36 --> 00:25:38 question uh and if you do have questions
00:25:39 --> 00:25:41 for us go to our website and uh send
00:25:41 --> 00:25:43 them to us there uh just click the am a
00:25:43 --> 00:25:46 tab on the SPAC nuts.com spatss
00:25:46 --> 00:25:48 podcast.com website and send us your
00:25:48 --> 00:25:50 text or audio questions there don't
00:25:50 --> 00:25:52 forget to tell us who you are and where
00:25:52 --> 00:25:54 you from uh just lately they've all been
00:25:54 --> 00:25:57 from Canada or Brisbane as it turns out
00:25:57 --> 00:25:59 um but I'm sure other people around the
00:25:59 --> 00:26:01 world s questions as will Jordy who's
00:26:01 --> 00:26:05 always asking for dinner and Fred thanks
00:26:05 --> 00:26:07 so much for your company and answering
00:26:07 --> 00:26:09 those questions today uh it's been good
00:26:09 --> 00:26:11 fun yeah thanks again I think Jord is
00:26:11 --> 00:26:14 telling me it's time I gave up on
00:26:14 --> 00:26:17 this than Pro walk so um thank you very
00:26:17 --> 00:26:20 much Andrew and we'll talk again soon we
00:26:20 --> 00:26:22 will Professor Fred Watson astronomer at
00:26:22 --> 00:26:24 large and to here in the
00:26:24 --> 00:26:27 studio nothing much to say there no
00:26:27 --> 00:26:29 movement at all and from me Andrew
00:26:29 --> 00:26:30 Dunley thanks to your company see you
00:26:31 --> 00:26:35 again and Jordy on the next
00:26:35 --> 00:26:40 episode of Space Nuts byebye sputs youve
00:26:40 --> 00:26:43 been listening to the Space Nuts
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