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Unraveling the Cosmos: Black Holes, Gravity Theories, and Planet Nine
In this thought-provoking Q&A episode of Space Nuts, host Andrew Dunkley and the ever-insightful Professor Fred Watson dive into a variety of compelling questions from listeners. They tackle the intriguing concept of the universe potentially being born inside a black hole, explore a new theory of gravity, and discuss the ongoing search for the elusive Planet Nine.
Episode Highlights:
- The Universe Inside a Black Hole: Listener Ash from Brisbane poses a fascinating question about the possibility of our universe being trapped inside a black hole and the implications of such a theory. Andrew and Fred Watson discuss the mechanics of black holes and what it would mean for our existence.
- A New Gravity Theory: Casey from Colorado asks about the latest advancements in gravity theories, prompting a discussion on the unification of quantum field theory and relativity, and the potential breakthroughs from Finnish researchers that could reshape our understanding of gravity.
- Understanding Hubble Tension: The duo explains the concept of Hubble tension, highlighting the discrepancies between two methods of measuring the universe's expansion rate and what this could mean for cosmology.
- The Quest for Planet Nine: Simon from New South Wales raises questions about the search for Planet Nine and the methods used to detect it, while Joe from Washington inquires about the limits of gravitational assists for interstellar travel, leading to a discussion on the practicality of such missions.
For more Space Nuts, including our continually updating newsfeed and to listen to all our episodes, visit our website. (https://www.spacenutspodcast.com/) Follow us on social media at SpaceNutsPod on Facebook, X, YouTube Music, Tumblr, Instagram, and TikTok. We love engaging with our community, so be sure to drop us a message or comment on your favourite platform.
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Stay curious, keep looking up, and join us next time for more stellar insights and cosmic wonders. Until then, clear skies and happy stargazing.
(00:00) Welcome to Space Nuts with Andrew Dunkley and Fred Watson Watson
(01:20) Discussion on the universe inside a black hole
(15:00) New theory of gravity from Finnish researchers
(25:30) Explaining Hubble tension
(35:00) The search for Planet Nine and gravitational assists
For commercial-free versions of Space Nuts, join us on Patreon, Supercast, Apple Podcasts, or become a supporter here: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/space-nuts-astronomy-insights-cosmic-discoveries--2631155/support (https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/space-nuts-astronomy-insights-cosmic-discoveries--2631155/support?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=rss) .
Episode link: https://play.headliner.app/episode/27188974?utm_source=youtube
00:00:00 --> 00:00:01 Hi there. Thanks for joining us. This is
00:00:01 --> 00:00:04 a Q&A edition of Space Nuts. My name is
00:00:04 --> 00:00:06 Andrew Dunley. It's good to have your
00:00:06 --> 00:00:09 company. Uh today, uh we will be hearing
00:00:10 --> 00:00:12 questions about uh the universe being
00:00:12 --> 00:00:15 inside a black hole. In fact, I think
00:00:15 --> 00:00:16 they're suggesting it was born in a
00:00:16 --> 00:00:19 black hole and is stuck in there and how
00:00:19 --> 00:00:21 do we get out? Uh we'll also be looking
00:00:21 --> 00:00:23 at a new gravity theory uh theory,
00:00:23 --> 00:00:26 Hubble tension. Not surprisingly,
00:00:26 --> 00:00:28 questions about planet 9 with the most
00:00:28 --> 00:00:30 recent announcement of something being
00:00:30 --> 00:00:34 out there that's not planet 9 and um
00:00:34 --> 00:00:37 getting gravity assistance to max delta
00:00:37 --> 00:00:40 v. Those are all the questions coming up
00:00:40 --> 00:00:43 on this episode of Space Nuts. 15
00:00:43 --> 00:00:47 seconds. Guidance is internal. 10 9
00:00:47 --> 00:00:51 ignition sequence start. Space nuts. 5 4
00:00:51 --> 00:00:56 3 2 1 2 3 4 5 5 4 3 2 1 Space Nuts.
00:00:56 --> 00:00:59 Astronauts report. It feels good. And
00:00:59 --> 00:01:01 Fred Watson is with us again to solve
00:01:01 --> 00:01:03 all these little riddles. Hello, Fred.
00:01:04 --> 00:01:06 Hello, Andrew. Nice to um help me solve
00:01:06 --> 00:01:09 the riddles.
00:01:09 --> 00:01:11 I don't know anything.
00:01:11 --> 00:01:13 That's why I bring you along. Oh, good.
00:01:13 --> 00:01:14 Well, I might like to be of assistance.
00:01:14 --> 00:01:16 Makes it so much more interesting when
00:01:16 --> 00:01:18 there's two people talking. Monologues
00:01:18 --> 00:01:20 are just so boring, don't you reckon?
00:01:20 --> 00:01:22 Uh,
00:01:22 --> 00:01:24 unless unless it's a super interesting
00:01:24 --> 00:01:26 person person like yourself. Right. No,
00:01:26 --> 00:01:29 I'm I'm capable of boring the pants off
00:01:29 --> 00:01:31 people as uh people have assured me
00:01:31 --> 00:01:33 before. So, that's all
00:01:33 --> 00:01:36 right. So, we've got a lot to get
00:01:36 --> 00:01:39 through and uh it's it's even trickier
00:01:39 --> 00:01:41 this week because we do have a technical
00:01:41 --> 00:01:43 uh issue which means you are going to
00:01:43 --> 00:01:45 have to
00:01:45 --> 00:01:48 lipre. Okay.
00:01:48 --> 00:01:52 Uh, so right, I'll do my best. We'll see
00:01:52 --> 00:01:53 how that goes. Wondering where the lips
00:01:53 --> 00:01:55 are going to be. That's the only thing.
00:01:55 --> 00:01:57 Yes. Yes. Well, the first set of lips
00:01:57 --> 00:02:00 come from Paul. So, let's hear his
00:02:00 --> 00:02:03 question. Good day, Fred, Andrew, Jonty,
00:02:03 --> 00:02:05 Heidi, whoever happens to be at the
00:02:05 --> 00:02:07 helm. Uh, this is Paul from sunny Bris
00:02:07 --> 00:02:09 Vegas. Uh, thanks for doing a great job
00:02:09 --> 00:02:12 as always. I have a quick question about
00:02:12 --> 00:02:16 surprise black holes. Um, Dr. Shamir put
00:02:16 --> 00:02:18 out a paper recently
00:02:18 --> 00:02:22 about his ideas regarding the fact that
00:02:22 --> 00:02:25 some galaxies are spinning one way and a
00:02:25 --> 00:02:28 lot of them most of them the other way.
00:02:28 --> 00:02:30 And another fellow chipped in a Nicadan
00:02:30 --> 00:02:33 Poploski from uh New Haven suggested
00:02:33 --> 00:02:35 that maybe that was because our universe
00:02:35 --> 00:02:38 was born inside a black hole. If that is
00:02:38 --> 00:02:42 true, how the heck did we get out? And
00:02:42 --> 00:02:44 if we didn't get out and we're still
00:02:44 --> 00:02:47 inside, then how is that possible given
00:02:47 --> 00:02:49 that, you know, anything that goes
00:02:49 --> 00:02:53 inside a black hole uh is spaghettified
00:02:53 --> 00:02:55 according to our current thinking and
00:02:55 --> 00:02:57 therefore incoherent? I mean, I know I'm
00:02:57 --> 00:02:59 incoherent, but you know what I'm
00:02:59 --> 00:03:01 talking about when it comes to ordinary
00:03:01 --> 00:03:04 barionic matter. Uh, love to get your
00:03:04 --> 00:03:05 thoughts on
00:03:05 --> 00:03:08 this. Anyway, uh, keep up the good work
00:03:08 --> 00:03:12 and catch us later. Cheers. Thank you,
00:03:12 --> 00:03:14 Paul, and hope all is well. In Brisbane,
00:03:14 --> 00:03:16 Paul is asking about the universe being
00:03:16 --> 00:03:19 born inside a black hole. How do we get
00:03:19 --> 00:03:22 out and why don't we get spaghettified
00:03:22 --> 00:03:25 as a consequence of that amongst many
00:03:25 --> 00:03:27 other things, but uh that was the basis
00:03:27 --> 00:03:29 of the question. So, yes. So, as as
00:03:29 --> 00:03:31 you've uh already mentioned, I didn't
00:03:31 --> 00:03:33 hear any of Paul's question there. Not
00:03:33 --> 00:03:36 at all. However, I did uh listen to it
00:03:36 --> 00:03:38 yesterday, so I've got a bit of an idea
00:03:38 --> 00:03:40 of what Paul was suggesting. the fact
00:03:40 --> 00:03:44 that um we have uh new observations
00:03:44 --> 00:03:46 which uh have been made with the James
00:03:46 --> 00:03:49 Web Space Telescope
00:03:49 --> 00:03:53 uh that um are intriguing in the sense
00:03:53 --> 00:03:57 that uh these scientists uh and they um
00:03:57 --> 00:04:00 are basically uh mostly located at
00:04:00 --> 00:04:02 Kansas State
00:04:02 --> 00:04:05 University. Uh that the rotation of
00:04:05 --> 00:04:07 galaxies in the deep universe isn't
00:04:07 --> 00:04:10 random. uh you'd expect, you know,
00:04:10 --> 00:04:13 galaxies to be rotating
00:04:13 --> 00:04:16 in they can only go one way or the
00:04:16 --> 00:04:18 other, but you would expect an equal
00:04:18 --> 00:04:22 balance of rotations. Uh and uh what we
00:04:22 --> 00:04:26 find uh or what these scientists find at
00:04:26 --> 00:04:29 Kansas State University using the James
00:04:29 --> 00:04:32 Web Space Telescope Advanced Deep
00:04:32 --> 00:04:35 Extragalactic Survey or JADES um what
00:04:35 --> 00:04:40 they find is out of 263 galaxies
00:04:40 --> 00:04:43 um which you know which sort of give
00:04:43 --> 00:04:45 away their rotation because we know that
00:04:45 --> 00:04:47 spiral arms nearly always trail. There's
00:04:47 --> 00:04:49 at least one galaxy where the spiral
00:04:49 --> 00:04:51 arms are leading, but most of them
00:04:51 --> 00:04:53 trail. And what they find that out of
00:04:53 --> 00:04:57 these 263 galaxies, about 2/3 of them
00:04:58 --> 00:05:00 are going clockwise and the rest are
00:05:00 --> 00:05:02 going anticlockwise. And that is an
00:05:02 --> 00:05:04 imbalance. That's a statistically
00:05:04 --> 00:05:07 significant imbalance. Uh that suggests
00:05:07 --> 00:05:09 that something's going on that we don't
00:05:09 --> 00:05:13 understand. And that leads to the
00:05:13 --> 00:05:16 possibility that perhaps the universe
00:05:16 --> 00:05:18 itself is
00:05:18 --> 00:05:22 rotating. Um, and I've seen other um,
00:05:22 --> 00:05:24 papers on this topic that suggest that
00:05:24 --> 00:05:27 maybe the universe rotates once in every
00:05:27 --> 00:05:29 500 billion years. That's one figure
00:05:29 --> 00:05:33 that I've seen. Now, um, a consequence
00:05:33 --> 00:05:35 of the rotating universe, and I think
00:05:35 --> 00:05:37 this is where Paul's question went. I'm
00:05:37 --> 00:05:39 trying to remember having heard it
00:05:39 --> 00:05:44 yesterday. Uh is that uh it it lends
00:05:44 --> 00:05:47 some weight to the idea that the
00:05:47 --> 00:05:51 universe is inside a black hole. Uh in
00:05:51 --> 00:05:52 other words, that there is an event
00:05:52 --> 00:05:56 horizon at some huge distance from where
00:05:56 --> 00:06:00 we are. Uh and we are all within this
00:06:00 --> 00:06:01 black
00:06:01 --> 00:06:05 hole. Um what does that mean for
00:06:05 --> 00:06:07 observational cosmology? I suspect it's
00:06:07 --> 00:06:10 going to be very difficult for us to
00:06:10 --> 00:06:15 confirm that ever. Uh and I think um you
00:06:15 --> 00:06:18 know this is speculative research. It's
00:06:18 --> 00:06:21 important research because you you you
00:06:21 --> 00:06:23 want to know um how some of these things
00:06:23 --> 00:06:25 interact. And I might just mention and I
00:06:25 --> 00:06:27 think we've discussed this before Andrew
00:06:27 --> 00:06:29 on space notes that the idea of a
00:06:29 --> 00:06:32 rotating universe actually relieves some
00:06:32 --> 00:06:35 of the issues uh that we find uh in
00:06:35 --> 00:06:37 observing the universe. One of them is
00:06:37 --> 00:06:38 the Hubble tension and I know there's a
00:06:38 --> 00:06:41 question coming up about that. Um so a
00:06:41 --> 00:06:43 rotating universe has certainly
00:06:43 --> 00:06:45 attractive possibilities but we
00:06:45 --> 00:06:47 absolutely don't know whether it is a
00:06:47 --> 00:06:49 rotating universe and indeed whether
00:06:49 --> 00:06:51 that means that we're inside a black
00:06:51 --> 00:06:53 hole. Uh so what I was going to say was
00:06:53 --> 00:06:54 the idea of a universe within a black
00:06:54 --> 00:06:57 hole is akin to the idea of multiverses.
00:06:57 --> 00:07:00 The the idea that um um multiple
00:07:00 --> 00:07:03 universes exist and we are just one of
00:07:03 --> 00:07:05 them. Uh I'm not really I don't think
00:07:05 --> 00:07:07 giving a sensible answer to Paul's
00:07:07 --> 00:07:08 question partly because I couldn't hear
00:07:08 --> 00:07:11 it but I think he was basically asking
00:07:11 --> 00:07:13 you know what happens how does it
00:07:13 --> 00:07:15 happen? Uh how are we not being
00:07:15 --> 00:07:18 spaghettified? That's because uh I can
00:07:18 --> 00:07:20 tell you the answer to that. uh we're
00:07:20 --> 00:07:22 we're not in a region um of the black
00:07:22 --> 00:07:26 hole where the um
00:07:26 --> 00:07:27 gravitational
00:07:27 --> 00:07:31 gravitational pull is changing very very
00:07:31 --> 00:07:34 rapidly with space and that's what makes
00:07:34 --> 00:07:36 a black hole spaghettify you. You go
00:07:36 --> 00:07:37 from one point to another and your
00:07:38 --> 00:07:39 gravitational pull is very different. So
00:07:39 --> 00:07:41 your head feels a different gravity from
00:07:41 --> 00:07:43 your feet and you get spaghettified.
00:07:43 --> 00:07:45 We're not in a in a place where that
00:07:45 --> 00:07:47 would be happening if we were inside a
00:07:47 --> 00:07:50 black hole. But, you know, all bets are
00:07:50 --> 00:07:53 off because inside a black hole, uh,
00:07:53 --> 00:07:54 there might we we're in a different
00:07:54 --> 00:07:56 dimensional space. A black hole is a
00:07:56 --> 00:07:58 singularity. Are we in a singularity? A
00:07:58 --> 00:08:01 singularity is a point with no
00:08:01 --> 00:08:03 dimensions. Work that one out. So, we'd
00:08:03 --> 00:08:05 have to be almost in a different
00:08:05 --> 00:08:07 dimensional space. So, it's a
00:08:07 --> 00:08:10 interesting question. um to which I
00:08:10 --> 00:08:12 don't think anybody knows the answer,
00:08:12 --> 00:08:13 but there are a few people who are
00:08:13 --> 00:08:15 probably thinking through it a lot more
00:08:15 --> 00:08:18 clearly than I am. Well, Paul mentioned
00:08:18 --> 00:08:22 a physicist by the name of Nicodemus.
00:08:22 --> 00:08:25 Uh he he's one that's put this theory
00:08:25 --> 00:08:28 forward that um our observable
00:08:28 --> 00:08:30 observable universe is not just a part
00:08:30 --> 00:08:33 of a larger universe, but is in fact the
00:08:33 --> 00:08:35 interior of a black hole within a larger
00:08:35 --> 00:08:37 context. Yes. So you've got extra
00:08:37 --> 00:08:39 dimensions somewhere out there uh within
00:08:39 --> 00:08:44 which we exist. Uh that's right. It's um
00:08:44 --> 00:08:47 you know I I Yes. I remember um checking
00:08:47 --> 00:08:49 out the the researchers that that Paul
00:08:49 --> 00:08:51 mentioned yesterday when I looked at it.
00:08:51 --> 00:08:54 Uh it's interesting stuff. Yeah. What do
00:08:54 --> 00:08:56 you think personally? I mean is there
00:08:56 --> 00:09:00 any possibility that this could be real?
00:09:00 --> 00:09:03 Um it to me it's on the same level as
00:09:03 --> 00:09:06 does heaven exist? uh you know it's it's
00:09:06 --> 00:09:09 questions to which we really can't find
00:09:09 --> 00:09:12 answers. We can theorize, we can
00:09:12 --> 00:09:14 conjecture, we can speculate, we can
00:09:14 --> 00:09:17 write equations down and probably some
00:09:17 --> 00:09:18 of the equations do support the idea
00:09:18 --> 00:09:20 that we're within a within an event
00:09:20 --> 00:09:22 horizon. It goes back a very long way.
00:09:22 --> 00:09:26 It's not a new idea at all. Um but um I
00:09:26 --> 00:09:28 mean people have put new numbers on it I
00:09:28 --> 00:09:30 think and new observations. I think we
00:09:30 --> 00:09:32 we watch this space. Next time this
00:09:32 --> 00:09:33 question comes up, I might be able to
00:09:34 --> 00:09:35 hear it properly and might be able to
00:09:35 --> 00:09:38 give a more cogent answer.
00:09:38 --> 00:09:40 Yes, indeed. I'll be working on that
00:09:40 --> 00:09:42 technicality. I don't I'm sure it's not
00:09:42 --> 00:09:43 your fault, Andrew. I know what these
00:09:43 --> 00:09:45 gremlins are like. We get them all the
00:09:45 --> 00:09:48 time. Yeah. I blame the equipment. Never
00:09:48 --> 00:09:51 ever though. Never the police. That's
00:09:51 --> 00:09:53 right.
00:09:53 --> 00:09:55 Thank you, Paul. Hope we covered that
00:09:55 --> 00:09:57 adequately as we strive to do here on
00:09:58 --> 00:10:00 Space Nuts.
00:10:00 --> 00:10:02 Let's take a little break from the show
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00:12:37 --> 00:12:39 deal and then have a look and see what
00:12:39 --> 00:12:43 suits you best. Now, back to the show.
00:12:43 --> 00:12:46 And I feel space nuts. Uh, our next
00:12:46 --> 00:12:49 question, Fred, comes from Casey in
00:12:49 --> 00:12:51 Colorado. In fact, he has two. Could you
00:12:52 --> 00:12:54 please explain the new theory of gravity
00:12:54 --> 00:12:57 in simple terms? Does it uh have any
00:12:57 --> 00:13:00 merit? And could you please explain
00:13:00 --> 00:13:02 Hubble tension and what it means for our
00:13:02 --> 00:13:05 understanding of the universe?
00:13:05 --> 00:13:09 Yes. Uh, so that's the answer. The
00:13:09 --> 00:13:12 answer is yes. Yes, I can.
00:13:12 --> 00:13:14 um the new theory of gravity which I
00:13:14 --> 00:13:16 like very much um this comes from
00:13:16 --> 00:13:19 scientists in Finland which is place I
00:13:19 --> 00:13:23 like very much as well um and it's what
00:13:23 --> 00:13:27 they've done you know they've taken um a
00:13:27 --> 00:13:28 step
00:13:28 --> 00:13:32 forward and and I'm assuming this is the
00:13:32 --> 00:13:36 uh this is indeed the um the uh the new
00:13:36 --> 00:13:39 theory that case is speaking about
00:13:39 --> 00:13:41 because we get nearly one every week a
00:13:41 --> 00:13:43 new theory in gravity but this is the
00:13:43 --> 00:13:46 latest one um it's uh as I said it's
00:13:46 --> 00:13:50 from uh it's from Finnish scientists uh
00:13:50 --> 00:13:53 at Alto University
00:13:53 --> 00:13:58 um so it's what they've done is what
00:13:58 --> 00:14:00 Einstein tried to do for the last for 30
00:14:00 --> 00:14:05 years of his life uh which is to unify
00:14:05 --> 00:14:08 quantum field theory and relativity
00:14:08 --> 00:14:11 uh and that's an issue because uh they
00:14:12 --> 00:14:14 are incompatible at the levels that we
00:14:14 --> 00:14:19 try and look at them now. Um and so uh
00:14:19 --> 00:14:22 to bring a quantum theory of gravity
00:14:22 --> 00:14:26 into being is a big step. So um what do
00:14:26 --> 00:14:28 I mean by bringing a theory into being?
00:14:28 --> 00:14:31 Well, we know that there are four
00:14:31 --> 00:14:34 fundamental forces in nature. Uh the
00:14:34 --> 00:14:37 strong and weak nuclear forces,
00:14:37 --> 00:14:39 electromagnetism and gravity. And the
00:14:39 --> 00:14:43 first three of those have very very
00:14:43 --> 00:14:46 wellestablished and uh well understood
00:14:46 --> 00:14:49 quantum theories. Um we for example we
00:14:49 --> 00:14:51 know that electromagnetism is propagated
00:14:51 --> 00:14:53 by photons. We talk about it all the
00:14:53 --> 00:14:55 time. So the suspicion is that gravity
00:14:55 --> 00:14:58 is propagated by gravitons but so far
00:14:58 --> 00:15:00 there's been no theory of what gravitons
00:15:00 --> 00:15:02 might be like. So what these scientists
00:15:02 --> 00:15:06 have done have developed a new theory a
00:15:06 --> 00:15:08 new quantum theory of gravity. Uh and
00:15:08 --> 00:15:10 I'm I'm actually going to once again uh
00:15:10 --> 00:15:13 quote from fizz.org. Uh very nice
00:15:13 --> 00:15:17 account of this um uh which is actually
00:15:17 --> 00:15:19 I think it is part of the press release
00:15:19 --> 00:15:21 from Alto University in Finland. So I'm
00:15:21 --> 00:15:24 quoting the university. Um, researchers
00:15:24 --> 00:15:26 at Alto University have developed a new
00:15:26 --> 00:15:28 theory, quantum theory of gravity, which
00:15:28 --> 00:15:30 describes gravity in a way that is
00:15:31 --> 00:15:33 compatible with the standard model of
00:15:33 --> 00:15:35 particle physics, opening the door to an
00:15:35 --> 00:15:37 improved understanding of how the
00:15:37 --> 00:15:41 universe began. While the world of uh
00:15:41 --> 00:15:43 quant theoretical physics may seem
00:15:43 --> 00:15:45 remote from applicable tech, the
00:15:45 --> 00:15:46 findings are remarkable. Modern
00:15:46 --> 00:15:48 technologies built on such fundamental
00:15:48 --> 00:15:50 advances. For example, the GPS in your
00:15:50 --> 00:15:52 smartphone works thanks to Einstein's
00:15:52 --> 00:15:55 theory of gravity. Uh and then uh the
00:15:55 --> 00:15:58 the article goes on to describe the
00:15:58 --> 00:16:00 theory. It's published in uh research
00:16:00 --> 00:16:05 reports on progress in physics. Um and
00:16:05 --> 00:16:06 this is the quote that I wanted to make.
00:16:06 --> 00:16:08 This comes from the uh lead author of
00:16:08 --> 00:16:13 the paper. Uh, and um
00:16:13 --> 00:16:16 um basically they
00:16:16 --> 00:16:19 um they the they
00:16:19 --> 00:16:21 the they've got lovely Finnish names.
00:16:21 --> 00:16:23 That's why I'm stumbling. It's Miko
00:16:23 --> 00:16:26 Partinan who's the uh who's the um lead
00:16:26 --> 00:16:31 author. Uh and the quote is as follows.
00:16:31 --> 00:16:33 And and this is this kind of puts it
00:16:33 --> 00:16:36 into perspective. If that's the big
00:16:36 --> 00:16:39 word, if this turns out to lead to a
00:16:39 --> 00:16:41 complete quantum field theory of
00:16:41 --> 00:16:43 gravity, then eventually it will give
00:16:43 --> 00:16:45 answers to the very difficult problems
00:16:45 --> 00:16:47 of understanding singularities in black
00:16:47 --> 00:16:51 hole, black holes and the big bang. A
00:16:51 --> 00:16:54 theory uh that coherently describes all
00:16:54 --> 00:16:56 fundamental forces of nature is often
00:16:56 --> 00:16:58 called the theory of everything. Uh some
00:16:58 --> 00:17:00 fundamental questions of physics still
00:17:00 --> 00:17:02 remain unanswered. For example, the
00:17:02 --> 00:17:04 present theories do not yet explain why
00:17:04 --> 00:17:06 there is more matter than antimatter in
00:17:06 --> 00:17:08 the observable universe. Uh and they
00:17:08 --> 00:17:10 what they've done is they've developed
00:17:10 --> 00:17:12 something called a a gauge theory. And
00:17:12 --> 00:17:13 gauge theories are a particular kind of
00:17:13 --> 00:17:15 theory in about the way particles
00:17:15 --> 00:17:18 interact with each other through a field
00:17:18 --> 00:17:21 like the Higs field and the Higs Bzon.
00:17:21 --> 00:17:25 Um so uh it's a basically a very nice uh
00:17:25 --> 00:17:27 a very nice account. Uh I won't read
00:17:27 --> 00:17:29 anymore because the you know gauge
00:17:29 --> 00:17:31 theories got symmetries and things of
00:17:31 --> 00:17:33 that sort.
00:17:33 --> 00:17:37 Um it's um a nice account. I recommend
00:17:37 --> 00:17:40 people have a look at the fizz.org uh
00:17:40 --> 00:17:44 paper uh sorry the f.org article Casey
00:17:44 --> 00:17:46 I'd send you to that as well to have a
00:17:46 --> 00:17:48 look. It's a very nice account of what's
00:17:48 --> 00:17:50 happening. You may end up like me
00:17:50 --> 00:17:52 thinking I really need to know a bit
00:17:52 --> 00:17:53 more about gauge theory before I can
00:17:53 --> 00:17:56 understand this. Uh but uh nevertheless,
00:17:56 --> 00:17:58 you'll get um a good idea of what's
00:17:58 --> 00:18:01 going on, I think.
00:18:01 --> 00:18:04 Okay. Now, Casey also wanted you to
00:18:04 --> 00:18:06 explain if you could Hubble tension.
00:18:06 --> 00:18:08 Yeah, that that's an easier one. And uh
00:18:08 --> 00:18:10 we as we've spoken about that's good. As
00:18:10 --> 00:18:13 we've spoken about today, uh that's one
00:18:13 --> 00:18:14 of the things we might get rid of. Yes,
00:18:14 --> 00:18:16 Hubble tension is a lot easier than
00:18:16 --> 00:18:18 gauge theory. Um and what it amounts to
00:18:18 --> 00:18:22 is we've got two ways of calculating the
00:18:22 --> 00:18:24 current expansion of the
00:18:24 --> 00:18:28 universe. Uh one is by looking at
00:18:28 --> 00:18:32 galaxies in our vicinity uh and looking
00:18:32 --> 00:18:35 at the rate at which they are speeding
00:18:35 --> 00:18:37 away from us. They go they're moving
00:18:37 --> 00:18:39 away from us faster as their distance
00:18:39 --> 00:18:41 increases. This is exactly the discovery
00:18:41 --> 00:18:44 that Hubble made in 1929.
00:18:44 --> 00:18:46 And uh gives us something we call the
00:18:46 --> 00:18:48 Hubble constant which is just the rate
00:18:48 --> 00:18:50 of expansion of the universe today. We
00:18:50 --> 00:18:52 call it hn
00:18:52 --> 00:18:56 um Hubble zero which is the expansion
00:18:56 --> 00:18:59 rate today. Now you can also get an idea
00:18:59 --> 00:19:02 of that or a measurement of it from the
00:19:02 --> 00:19:04 cosmic microwave background radiation.
00:19:04 --> 00:19:07 And that to recap is the flash of the
00:19:07 --> 00:19:09 big bang. We're looking back so far in
00:19:09 --> 00:19:10 time. We're seeing back to a time
00:19:10 --> 00:19:12 380 years after the Big Bang when
00:19:12 --> 00:19:14 the universe was still opaque and
00:19:14 --> 00:19:16 glowing brightly. So, we see this wall
00:19:16 --> 00:19:18 of radiation which is now in the
00:19:18 --> 00:19:21 microwave region of the spectrum. Uh,
00:19:21 --> 00:19:24 and it's peppered with a pattern of
00:19:24 --> 00:19:29 warmer and cooler places. Uh, and those
00:19:29 --> 00:19:31 uh zones of higher and lower
00:19:31 --> 00:19:33 temperature, and it's only by a tiny
00:19:33 --> 00:19:35 fraction, uh, they correspond to the
00:19:35 --> 00:19:39 structure in that fireball. Um in fact
00:19:39 --> 00:19:41 they're that it's caused by sound waves
00:19:41 --> 00:19:42 moving through it. They're called
00:19:42 --> 00:19:44 barionic acoustic oscillations. And we
00:19:44 --> 00:19:47 can by measuring the properties of the
00:19:47 --> 00:19:49 that peppering of warmer and cooler
00:19:49 --> 00:19:52 regions we can actually work out what
00:19:52 --> 00:19:55 the expansion of the universe is today.
00:19:55 --> 00:19:57 And it turns out that the two figures
00:19:57 --> 00:20:02 are different um by something like four
00:20:02 --> 00:20:05 5%. And that in modern terms is big
00:20:05 --> 00:20:08 enough to worry about. It's not just an
00:20:08 --> 00:20:10 error of measurement. These are these
00:20:10 --> 00:20:12 have got fairly tight limits on the
00:20:12 --> 00:20:14 uncertainties, but they're different.
00:20:14 --> 00:20:17 And that is the Hubble
00:20:17 --> 00:20:20 tension. But didn't they rec
00:20:20 --> 00:20:22 recently release a paper that suggested
00:20:22 --> 00:20:25 that the variations are actually within
00:20:25 --> 00:20:28 a normal range that this
00:20:28 --> 00:20:32 this these two figures that don't match
00:20:32 --> 00:20:34 are close enough? Well, yes. Didn't we
00:20:34 --> 00:20:36 talk? We did. Um, some people have
00:20:36 --> 00:20:38 suggested that that it is that it is
00:20:38 --> 00:20:40 actually within the experimental
00:20:40 --> 00:20:42 uncertainty, but it's still seen as a
00:20:42 --> 00:20:43 tension. They could they should be
00:20:43 --> 00:20:46 nearer than what they are.
00:20:46 --> 00:20:49 Yeah. Okay. Very, very interesting.
00:20:49 --> 00:20:50 Casey, thanks for both your questions.
00:20:50 --> 00:20:52 And no, you haven't spammed us. Two
00:20:52 --> 00:20:54 questions doesn't equal
00:20:54 --> 00:20:56 spam. There's probably a definition
00:20:56 --> 00:20:59 somewhere online that says how many how
00:20:59 --> 00:21:02 many emails become spam. You're well
00:21:02 --> 00:21:04 well outside that tolerance. So, no
00:21:04 --> 00:21:07 problem there. This is Space Nuts Q&A
00:21:07 --> 00:21:09 edition with Andrew Dunley and Professor
00:21:10 --> 00:21:13 Fred Watson.
00:21:13 --> 00:21:16 Roger, you're here. Also, Space Nuts.
00:21:16 --> 00:21:19 Okay, Fred, let's uh move on to our next
00:21:19 --> 00:21:21 question. It's an audio question, so you
00:21:21 --> 00:21:24 won't be able to hear it, but it comes
00:21:24 --> 00:21:28 from Simon. Hi, it's uh Simon from Vasey
00:21:28 --> 00:21:31 in uh New South Wales here. Uh my
00:21:31 --> 00:21:34 questions around uh the search for
00:21:34 --> 00:21:35 planet
00:21:35 --> 00:21:39 9. Uh other exoplanets uh few have been
00:21:39 --> 00:21:42 found using radial velocity method. Is
00:21:42 --> 00:21:45 that something we could do with the sun?
00:21:45 --> 00:21:49 Um, I guess planet 9 being so far out
00:21:49 --> 00:21:51 probably wouldn't have much
00:21:51 --> 00:21:53 influence, but we would have so much
00:21:53 --> 00:21:58 data on the sun as well um that it might
00:21:58 --> 00:22:01 be easy to sus out. Anyway, that's uh
00:22:01 --> 00:22:05 that's my question.
00:22:05 --> 00:22:07 Thank you, Simon. Good to hear from you.
00:22:07 --> 00:22:09 Hope all is well in Vasey in New South
00:22:09 --> 00:22:12 Wales. Uh he's asking in the search for
00:22:12 --> 00:22:15 planet 9 um we we've used the radial
00:22:15 --> 00:22:18 velocity method uh in the past to find
00:22:18 --> 00:22:22 other objects uh could we use the sun in
00:22:22 --> 00:22:24 the search for planet 9. Yeah, and it's
00:22:24 --> 00:22:27 a great question. Uh, and very well
00:22:27 --> 00:22:29 posed, Simon. Uh, I did actually manage
00:22:29 --> 00:22:31 to hear that through my own um
00:22:31 --> 00:22:33 recording, which I found and listened
00:22:33 --> 00:22:36 back to. So, I know what Simon
00:22:36 --> 00:22:41 asked. And what he's saying is that we
00:22:41 --> 00:22:42 know that when we look for exoplanets,
00:22:42 --> 00:22:45 planets around other stars, what we look
00:22:45 --> 00:22:48 for is the change in position of the
00:22:48 --> 00:22:51 star itself as it's pulled one way and
00:22:51 --> 00:22:52 another by the planet orbiting around
00:22:52 --> 00:22:53 it.
00:22:53 --> 00:22:58 And yes indeed the solar system uh has
00:22:58 --> 00:23:00 such an effect. So Jupiter principally
00:23:00 --> 00:23:03 is the the main planet that's pulling
00:23:03 --> 00:23:05 the pulling the sun's center one way or
00:23:05 --> 00:23:08 the other. Uh but the other planets all
00:23:08 --> 00:23:12 intervene as well. And so what we have
00:23:12 --> 00:23:14 is something that's called the solar
00:23:14 --> 00:23:17 systems barry center, the center of mass
00:23:17 --> 00:23:19 of the solar system. And that moves as
00:23:20 --> 00:23:21 the planets wander
00:23:21 --> 00:23:26 around. And um we've exactly as um as
00:23:26 --> 00:23:30 Simon says, we've managed to work out
00:23:30 --> 00:23:33 the position of the Barry center very
00:23:33 --> 00:23:36 very accurately. Uh partly because we
00:23:36 --> 00:23:38 know where the planets are and things of
00:23:38 --> 00:23:39 that sort.
00:23:39 --> 00:23:44 Now, Simon's question is actually
00:23:44 --> 00:23:47 exactly the same as a question that I
00:23:47 --> 00:23:50 found on Stack Exchange online. The
00:23:50 --> 00:23:53 question was can the paper narrowing the
00:23:53 --> 00:23:56 solar systems barry center to within 100
00:23:56 --> 00:24:00 meters help find planet 9? Uh so that's
00:24:00 --> 00:24:02 basically what Simon asked and the
00:24:02 --> 00:24:05 bottom line there's a long long set of
00:24:06 --> 00:24:08 calculations here which I won't go
00:24:08 --> 00:24:11 through but the answer is probably not.
00:24:11 --> 00:24:15 Um it's because the planet
00:24:15 --> 00:24:18 9 planet 9's influence on the solar
00:24:18 --> 00:24:20 systems barry center it's it's helped by
00:24:20 --> 00:24:22 the fact that planet 9's a long way
00:24:22 --> 00:24:26 away. Um um so it's got sort of leverage
00:24:26 --> 00:24:31 uh as it goes around. Um um the the the
00:24:31 --> 00:24:33 short answer
00:24:33 --> 00:24:37 is maybe we could do it, but we wouldn't
00:24:37 --> 00:24:39 be able to do it without hundreds if not
00:24:40 --> 00:24:42 thousands of years of precise data. And
00:24:42 --> 00:24:45 that's because planet 9 is probably
00:24:45 --> 00:24:47 orbiting the sun on that kind of time
00:24:47 --> 00:24:50 scale. And so you don't see any, you
00:24:50 --> 00:24:53 know, what you'd be looking for is um
00:24:54 --> 00:24:55 changes in the position of the Barry
00:24:55 --> 00:24:58 center which are not caused by the known
00:24:58 --> 00:25:01 planets, but it'll take you hundreds or
00:25:01 --> 00:25:03 thousands of years to see that because
00:25:03 --> 00:25:05 of the the great distance that planet 9
00:25:05 --> 00:25:09 is at. So the answer is probably not.
00:25:09 --> 00:25:10 But it's a great question and really
00:25:10 --> 00:25:12 nice thinking. I like Simon's thinking
00:25:12 --> 00:25:16 there. Yeah. Yeah. It's quite astute.
00:25:16 --> 00:25:18 The other factor that comes into play
00:25:18 --> 00:25:21 here is the new theory that planet 9
00:25:22 --> 00:25:24 doesn't exist because there's another
00:25:24 --> 00:25:25 planet even further
00:25:25 --> 00:25:29 out that uh has only just been sort of
00:25:29 --> 00:25:32 put into a um into a paper and open for
00:25:32 --> 00:25:34 discussion. So we only talked about that
00:25:34 --> 00:25:37 last week. So the search for planet 9
00:25:37 --> 00:25:40 might be a fororn hope anyway. Yeah. U
00:25:40 --> 00:25:42 because it probably according to the new
00:25:42 --> 00:25:44 theory doesn't that's correct. Yeah.
00:25:44 --> 00:25:46 Now, the new theory is based more on
00:25:46 --> 00:25:49 observations than theory because it's
00:25:49 --> 00:25:51 two observations separated by something
00:25:51 --> 00:25:53 like 30 years that seem to show
00:25:53 --> 00:25:54 something moving very slowly in the
00:25:54 --> 00:25:55 outer solar
00:25:55 --> 00:25:58 system. You can bet your life we'll do
00:25:58 --> 00:26:01 more observing of that over uh coming
00:26:01 --> 00:26:04 decades uh and maybe that will turn out
00:26:04 --> 00:26:05 to be what I think is being called
00:26:05 --> 00:26:07 planet 8 and a half at the moment
00:26:07 --> 00:26:09 because nobody really knows whether it's
00:26:09 --> 00:26:11 there or not. But as you said, if that
00:26:11 --> 00:26:14 is real, it rules out planet 9. the two
00:26:14 --> 00:26:16 colors exist together.
00:26:16 --> 00:26:18 Exactly. Right. All right. There you go,
00:26:18 --> 00:26:21 Simon. Um, we'll see where that ends up,
00:26:21 --> 00:26:24 but it might take a while. Our final
00:26:24 --> 00:26:27 question comes from Joe in Ola in
00:26:28 --> 00:26:29 Washington. I hope I pronounced that
00:26:29 --> 00:26:31 correctly. Is there an upper limit to
00:26:31 --> 00:26:34 how much delta V uh that can be
00:26:34 --> 00:26:36 practically generated by gravitational
00:26:36 --> 00:26:39 assists? Is it possible to develop
00:26:39 --> 00:26:41 sufficient delta V for timely
00:26:41 --> 00:26:43 interstellar travel by winding up a
00:26:43 --> 00:26:45 probe in our solar system before
00:26:45 --> 00:26:48 launching it uh to a nearby star? Uh
00:26:48 --> 00:26:50 thanks for all that you do. Cheers, Joe.
00:26:50 --> 00:26:53 Now, delta V, that is the impulse per
00:26:53 --> 00:26:57 unit of spacecraft mass. Yes. Well, it's
00:26:57 --> 00:26:59 basically the change in
00:26:59 --> 00:27:02 velocity. Um yes. So impulse is the
00:27:02 --> 00:27:05 that's the way people talk about these
00:27:05 --> 00:27:06 delta V's in this in the rocket
00:27:06 --> 00:27:09 industry. It's all rocket science or is
00:27:09 --> 00:27:12 it anyway delta V uh I think in Joe's
00:27:12 --> 00:27:16 context here is how much velocity
00:27:16 --> 00:27:18 increase you can get from a gravity
00:27:18 --> 00:27:22 assist from a slingshot. Uh and the
00:27:22 --> 00:27:24 answer is probably no. um in terms of
00:27:24 --> 00:27:27 trying to wind up you know the speed of
00:27:27 --> 00:27:30 things so that you you know you hurl
00:27:30 --> 00:27:33 something out of the solar system at uh
00:27:33 --> 00:27:34 10th the speed of light or something
00:27:34 --> 00:27:38 like that. Um the reading that I've done
00:27:38 --> 00:27:41 on this and I did check it out uh seems
00:27:41 --> 00:27:41 to
00:27:41 --> 00:27:45 suggest excuse me that um we are
00:27:45 --> 00:27:47 probably
00:27:47 --> 00:27:52 limited to um the sorts of velocities
00:27:52 --> 00:27:55 that we see among the planets of the
00:27:55 --> 00:27:57 solar system. Now remember the earth is
00:27:57 --> 00:28:01 orbiting the the sun at 30 kilometers/s
00:28:01 --> 00:28:05 um and um those velocities get less as
00:28:05 --> 00:28:07 you get farther away from the sun. And
00:28:07 --> 00:28:09 that's part of the equation with a
00:28:09 --> 00:28:10 slingshot because what you're trying to
00:28:10 --> 00:28:12 do is steal some momentum from the
00:28:12 --> 00:28:15 planet and give it to the spacecraft.
00:28:15 --> 00:28:18 And so there are upper limits uh on what
00:28:18 --> 00:28:20 sort of velocity change you can get. It
00:28:20 --> 00:28:22 depends on how close you go to the
00:28:22 --> 00:28:23 planet, depends whether the planet's got
00:28:23 --> 00:28:25 an atmosphere or not. uh depends on the
00:28:26 --> 00:28:28 angle that you come in. Um the figure
00:28:28 --> 00:28:31 that I've seen quoted as a maximum for
00:28:31 --> 00:28:32 Jupiter, which is the most effective
00:28:32 --> 00:28:34 planet for this sort of thing, being the
00:28:34 --> 00:28:35 by far the most massive planet in the
00:28:35 --> 00:28:38 solar system, is a change of 40
00:28:38 --> 00:28:40 kilometers/s.
00:28:40 --> 00:28:43 Um, now that's very good if you're, you
00:28:43 --> 00:28:44 know, trying to get something out to the
00:28:44 --> 00:28:47 outer solar system, but it's not going
00:28:47 --> 00:28:49 to help you getting things to other
00:28:49 --> 00:28:52 planets, especially when you think, you
00:28:52 --> 00:28:56 know, if you give a a planet, sorry, a
00:28:56 --> 00:28:59 spacecraft an impulse a delta V of 40
00:28:59 --> 00:29:02 kilometers/s by interacting with
00:29:02 --> 00:29:05 Jupiter. You've got to then find another
00:29:05 --> 00:29:07 planet that's that's going to give it
00:29:07 --> 00:29:09 even more. But the other planets are all
00:29:09 --> 00:29:12 moving slower than that. So, uh, that
00:29:12 --> 00:29:14 the change in momentum is a lot harder
00:29:14 --> 00:29:17 to get. Uh, so, so I think the answer is
00:29:17 --> 00:29:19 it's a very nice idea, you know, as Joe
00:29:19 --> 00:29:21 suggests, winding up by all these
00:29:21 --> 00:29:23 gravitational interactions. You can only
00:29:23 --> 00:29:25 do it within limits. You're not going to
00:29:25 --> 00:29:27 be able to get, you know, like 100
00:29:28 --> 00:29:30 kilometers/s or something like that from
00:29:30 --> 00:29:32 doing that. Yeah. I I suppose you could
00:29:32 --> 00:29:34 equate it to using a slingshot or a
00:29:34 --> 00:29:36 Shanghai. there's there's only so much
00:29:36 --> 00:29:39 tension you can put in into the the
00:29:39 --> 00:29:41 rubber band to say to fire the rock and
00:29:41 --> 00:29:42 you're not going to be able to fire the
00:29:42 --> 00:29:46 rock any faster than the maximum amount
00:29:46 --> 00:29:48 of storage the rubber band can hold and
00:29:48 --> 00:29:50 I I'm guessing it's the same for yes
00:29:50 --> 00:29:53 there's a yeah there's a limited amount
00:29:53 --> 00:29:55 of energy that you can get from from a
00:29:55 --> 00:29:58 slingshot that's right yeah nice idea
00:29:58 --> 00:30:01 although it's it's been very effective
00:30:01 --> 00:30:03 as you said for sending things to the
00:30:03 --> 00:30:05 outer solar system the the Voyager
00:30:05 --> 00:30:09 probes particularly uh used um the
00:30:09 --> 00:30:12 slingshot effect um several times to to
00:30:12 --> 00:30:14 to to get to the outer solar system
00:30:14 --> 00:30:16 because they didn't have the fuel to do
00:30:16 --> 00:30:20 it. So they figured out through a um an
00:30:20 --> 00:30:23 alignment of the planets that they could
00:30:23 --> 00:30:26 they could get out there just by using
00:30:26 --> 00:30:28 the um the rotation of the planets or
00:30:28 --> 00:30:33 the um the process that uh that uh Joe's
00:30:33 --> 00:30:35 been talking about. So, um, yeah, it it
00:30:35 --> 00:30:38 does work quite effectively for
00:30:38 --> 00:30:42 slower slower speeds, but uh, yeah, it
00:30:42 --> 00:30:44 interstellar probably beyond us in that
00:30:44 --> 00:30:47 regard. Yeah, probably the the the
00:30:47 --> 00:30:49 lasers and, um, you know, in a solar
00:30:49 --> 00:30:51 sail or a light sail might be a better
00:30:51 --> 00:30:54 bet, but even that's beyond our
00:30:54 --> 00:30:57 technology at the moment.
00:30:57 --> 00:30:59 Uh, probably won't be for long, though.
00:30:59 --> 00:31:01 I think they'll develop that and and get
00:31:02 --> 00:31:03 some spacecraft heading out towards the
00:31:04 --> 00:31:07 Alpha Centator sector and um anyway,
00:31:07 --> 00:31:09 that remains to be seen. Uh but that
00:31:09 --> 00:31:11 would still be a pretty slow mission in
00:31:11 --> 00:31:14 the scheme of things. But um yeah, great
00:31:14 --> 00:31:15 question, Joe. Thanks for sending it in.
00:31:16 --> 00:31:18 And if you'd like to send us a question,
00:31:18 --> 00:31:21 uh you can do that uh through our
00:31:21 --> 00:31:22 website,
00:31:22 --> 00:31:24 spacenutspodcast.com. Spacenuts.io.
00:31:24 --> 00:31:27 Click on the AMA link at the top and you
00:31:27 --> 00:31:30 can send us text and audio questions.
00:31:30 --> 00:31:31 And don't forget to tell us who you are
00:31:31 --> 00:31:33 and where you're from. We love to know
00:31:33 --> 00:31:34 that sort of stuff so that we can send
00:31:34 --> 00:31:37 the boys around. Uh or we could send
00:31:37 --> 00:31:38 Hugh around because he can't be with us
00:31:38 --> 00:31:40 today. So he must be visiting one of you
00:31:40 --> 00:31:43 guys um with his with his um you know
00:31:43 --> 00:31:46 balaclava on maybe. Yeah. Um thank you
00:31:46 --> 00:31:49 Fred as always. A pleasure Andrew as
00:31:49 --> 00:31:52 always. Good to talk and uh good to hear
00:31:52 --> 00:31:54 our listeners questions.
00:31:54 --> 00:31:56 It is. It is. All right. Well, catch you
00:31:56 --> 00:31:58 again real soon. Professor Fred Watson,
00:31:58 --> 00:32:00 astronomer at large. And from me, Andrew
00:32:00 --> 00:32:02 Dunley. Thanks for your company. See you
00:32:02 --> 00:32:04 on the next episode of Space Nuts. Bye
00:32:04 --> 00:32:07 for now. Space Nuts. You'll be listening
00:32:07 --> 00:32:10 to the Space Nuts podcast.
00:32:10 --> 00:32:13 Available at Apple Podcasts, Spotify,
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00:32:18 --> 00:32:21 byes.com. This has been another quality
00:32:21 --> 00:32:25 podcast production from knights.com.