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Cosmic Discoveries: Erupting Comets, Boiling Ice Moons, and Mars' Climate Secrets
In this captivating episode of Space Nuts , hosts Andrew Dunkley and Professor Fred Watson delve into the latest astronomical revelations that are reshaping our understanding of the cosmos. From the surprising eruptions of the exo-comet 3I Atlas to the intriguing boiling oceans beneath the icy crusts of moons like Enceladus, this episode is filled with cosmic wonders.
Episode Highlights:
- Eruptions on Comet 3I Atlas: Andrew and Fred explore the recent findings about the interstellar comet 3I Atlas, which appears to be experiencing volcanic eruptions. They discuss the concept of cryovolcanoes and how the comet's interactions with solar radiation may be causing these fascinating phenomena.
- Boiling Oceans of Ice Moons: The hosts examine new research from the University of California, Davis, which suggests that the ice moons of our solar system, including Enceladus, may have boiling oceans beneath their icy crusts. They explain how tidal forces and pressure changes could lead to this unexpected behavior.
- New Evidence of Mars' Climate: Andrew and Fred discuss exciting discoveries made by NASA's Perseverance rover, which has found evidence of a wet, tropical climate on Mars billions of years ago. They delve into the implications of these findings and what they might mean for the potential of past life on the Red Planet.
- Launch Pad Mishap: The episode concludes with a discussion about the recent incident involving the Soyuz launch pad, where a service platform was damaged following a successful launch. The hosts reflect on the challenges faced in human spaceflight and the ongoing cooperation between international space agencies despite geopolitical tensions.
For more Space Nuts, including our continuously updating newsfeed and to listen to all our episodes, visit our website. (https://www.spacenutspodcast.com/) Follow us on social media at SpaceNutsPod on Facebook, X, YouTube Music Music, Tumblr, Instagram, and TikTok. We love engaging with our community, so be sure to drop us a message or comment on your favorite platform.
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Stay curious, keep looking up, and join us next time for more stellar insights and cosmic wonders. Until then, clear skies and happy stargazing.
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Episode link: https://play.headliner.app/episode/30485159?utm_source=youtube
00:00:00 --> 00:00:02 Hello again. Thanks for joining us on
00:00:02 --> 00:00:05 Space Nuts. My name is Andrew Dunley,
00:00:05 --> 00:00:07 your host, and it's good to be with you.
00:00:07 --> 00:00:09 Uh this is where we talk about astronomy
00:00:09 --> 00:00:12 and space science every week, twice a
00:00:12 --> 00:00:15 week, in fact. And on today's program,
00:00:15 --> 00:00:19 uh more news coming from the exoc comet
00:00:19 --> 00:00:23 3iLas. Apparently, it is erupting. How
00:00:23 --> 00:00:25 so? What can we learn from that? We're
00:00:25 --> 00:00:27 also going to look at the boiling oceans
00:00:27 --> 00:00:29 of ice moons. That sounds like a
00:00:29 --> 00:00:30 contradiction in terms, doesn't it?
00:00:30 --> 00:00:33 Boiling ice, but apparently it's
00:00:33 --> 00:00:35 happening. Uh, more revelations about
00:00:35 --> 00:00:38 the former climate of Mars. And this is
00:00:38 --> 00:00:40 really interesting. And a whoopsy daisy
00:00:40 --> 00:00:43 with the Sawyers launch pad. That's all
00:00:43 --> 00:00:46 coming up in this episode of Space Nuts.
00:00:46 --> 00:00:51 >> 15 seconds. Guidance is internal. 10 9
00:00:51 --> 00:00:52 Ignition sequence start.
00:00:52 --> 00:00:56 >> Space Nuts. 5 4 3 2
00:00:56 --> 00:00:58 >> 1 2 3 4 5 4 3 2 1
00:00:58 --> 00:00:59 >> Space nuts.
00:00:59 --> 00:01:02 >> Astronauts report it. It feels good.
00:01:02 --> 00:01:03 >> And looking better than this morning's
00:01:03 --> 00:01:06 golf round at my golf club. Is Professor
00:01:06 --> 00:01:08 Fred Watson astronomer at large? Hello,
00:01:08 --> 00:01:09 Fred.
00:01:09 --> 00:01:11 >> How you doing, Andrew?
00:01:11 --> 00:01:13 >> Uh I'm I'm not sure. Uh if you looked
00:01:14 --> 00:01:15 like my golf round, you would be in a
00:01:15 --> 00:01:18 very bad way. But you know that that's
00:01:18 --> 00:01:21 golf. You had some shockers occasionally
00:01:21 --> 00:01:23 and I had one today. So,
00:01:23 --> 00:01:25 >> well, you but last week you were
00:01:25 --> 00:01:27 championship winning, so
00:01:27 --> 00:01:29 >> Yes. And and we have an old saying in
00:01:29 --> 00:01:31 golf, uh, from rooster to feather
00:01:31 --> 00:01:33 duster. That's what's that's what's
00:01:33 --> 00:01:33 happened there.
00:01:33 --> 00:01:36 >> Oh, I see. Okay. Oh, yeah. Well, feather
00:01:36 --> 00:01:38 dusters have their place.
00:01:38 --> 00:01:40 >> Yeah. Not on a golf course.
00:01:40 --> 00:01:41 >> No.
00:01:41 --> 00:01:44 >> You can't hit a can't hit a ball very
00:01:44 --> 00:01:45 far with a feather duster. I can tell
00:01:45 --> 00:01:46 you that.
00:01:46 --> 00:01:49 >> Yes. What's been happening in your
00:01:49 --> 00:01:50 world, Fred? Are you all right?
00:01:50 --> 00:01:53 >> Yep. All right. I'm I've been having the
00:01:53 --> 00:01:57 um 30 kilometer oil and water tires
00:01:57 --> 00:01:59 check with I was just saying my eighth
00:01:59 --> 00:02:01 medical appointment this morning since
00:02:01 --> 00:02:04 we got back two weeks ago. So, but it's
00:02:04 --> 00:02:06 all so so far so good. Yeah.
00:02:06 --> 00:02:07 >> Yeah. Well, after we did our three
00:02:07 --> 00:02:10 months overseas. Yeah. That was our life
00:02:10 --> 00:02:11 for a couple of weeks, too. Catching up
00:02:11 --> 00:02:12 on all those things.
00:02:12 --> 00:02:14 >> Catching up on the medical stuff.
00:02:14 --> 00:02:15 >> Yeah. Cuz if you if you get a medical
00:02:15 --> 00:02:18 checkup on a on a cruise ship, it cost
00:02:18 --> 00:02:20 you it cost you a fortune. Just don't
00:02:20 --> 00:02:22 get sick on a cruise ship.
00:02:22 --> 00:02:24 >> No, I wouldn't actually do that. No,
00:02:24 --> 00:02:27 >> no, not a good idea. Uh, let's get into
00:02:27 --> 00:02:30 it, Fred. And our first story takes us
00:02:30 --> 00:02:33 once again to Three Eye Atlas, the exoc
00:02:33 --> 00:02:36 comet that has been in our skies since I
00:02:36 --> 00:02:38 think it was discovered in July.
00:02:38 --> 00:02:39 >> Yes.
00:02:39 --> 00:02:41 >> And we've been talking about it ever
00:02:41 --> 00:02:43 since. And it's been quite an exciting
00:02:43 --> 00:02:46 find. And now they've discovered uh
00:02:46 --> 00:02:49 volcanic eruptions. Is that am I is that
00:02:49 --> 00:02:52 just you know creative license or is
00:02:52 --> 00:02:54 that sort of what's happening?
00:02:54 --> 00:02:58 >> It's um it is a bit of both actually.
00:02:58 --> 00:03:03 Uh I think um so the the idea of what we
00:03:03 --> 00:03:06 call cryo volcanoes, volcanic eruptions
00:03:06 --> 00:03:10 on cold icy worlds is a phenomenon that
00:03:10 --> 00:03:14 we've seen before uh on a number of
00:03:14 --> 00:03:19 bodies. Uh we think that uh series the
00:03:19 --> 00:03:21 biggest object in the asteroid belt and
00:03:21 --> 00:03:23 a dwarf planet as according to our
00:03:23 --> 00:03:26 current classification Titan Saturn's
00:03:26 --> 00:03:30 giant moon Titan and probably Pluto as
00:03:30 --> 00:03:33 well um the dwarf planet Pluto we think
00:03:33 --> 00:03:37 they have all had um ice volcanoes cry
00:03:37 --> 00:03:39 volcanoes on their surface because their
00:03:39 --> 00:03:41 surface temperatures well in the case of
00:03:41 --> 00:03:43 Pluto it's way below it's about 200
00:03:43 --> 00:03:45 minus 230 I
00:03:45 --> 00:03:47 Uh it's a little bit warmer on Titan and
00:03:47 --> 00:03:50 a little bit warmer still on uh series,
00:03:50 --> 00:03:53 but still way below zero. And so the
00:03:53 --> 00:03:55 structure of these worlds is a, as you
00:03:55 --> 00:03:59 know, it's a rocky core with an ocean of
00:03:59 --> 00:04:01 maybe liquid water, maybe something
00:04:01 --> 00:04:03 slushy, maybe as in the case of series,
00:04:04 --> 00:04:07 a mix with ammonia in it. Um, and
00:04:08 --> 00:04:11 uh the that because over over the top of
00:04:11 --> 00:04:13 that you've got a crust of water ice
00:04:13 --> 00:04:15 which is as hard as rock and that's what
00:04:15 --> 00:04:18 it behaves like but the liquid below
00:04:18 --> 00:04:20 just like magma on the earth's crust
00:04:20 --> 00:04:23 only that's a lot hotter but the liquid
00:04:23 --> 00:04:25 below is under pressure and sometimes
00:04:25 --> 00:04:27 punctures the crusty surface the icy
00:04:27 --> 00:04:29 crust and you get a cryo volcano uh
00:04:29 --> 00:04:31 which are a little bit funnyl looking.
00:04:31 --> 00:04:33 They're not um you know what we think of
00:04:33 --> 00:04:35 as a classic strata volcano. And you and
00:04:36 --> 00:04:37 I have both seen Mount Fuji and we know
00:04:37 --> 00:04:41 that's the absolute archetypal uh um
00:04:41 --> 00:04:43 strata volcano.
00:04:43 --> 00:04:46 >> I've se I've seen them in Guatemala.
00:04:46 --> 00:04:46 They
00:04:46 --> 00:04:48 >> Yes, that's right. They are monsters of
00:04:48 --> 00:04:49 things. Those
00:04:49 --> 00:04:50 >> Yes. Yes. I remember you telling me
00:04:50 --> 00:04:55 about quite extraordinary. Um but uh ice
00:04:55 --> 00:04:57 volcanoes tend to be more rounded in
00:04:57 --> 00:04:59 their in their you know in their
00:04:59 --> 00:05:01 structure. Certainly around the cold era
00:05:01 --> 00:05:04 that they've got a rounded top and I
00:05:04 --> 00:05:05 think that's just because of the
00:05:05 --> 00:05:07 properties of the liquid that's being
00:05:07 --> 00:05:09 gushed out. It's not molten lava. It's
00:05:09 --> 00:05:13 molten slush. Uh that's as I said
00:05:13 --> 00:05:16 probably ammonia and um and water in the
00:05:16 --> 00:05:21 case of of series. Anyway, um the bottom
00:05:21 --> 00:05:26 line with all this is that uh we we
00:05:26 --> 00:05:30 believe that cryov volcanoes are common
00:05:30 --> 00:05:32 on trans neptunian objects and and
00:05:32 --> 00:05:36 certainly uh Pluto is a trans neptunian
00:05:36 --> 00:05:38 object. Uh we think there is evidence
00:05:38 --> 00:05:41 that other trans neptunian objects out
00:05:41 --> 00:05:44 there thinks beyond the orbit of Neptune
00:05:44 --> 00:05:46 uh have got cryo volcanoes on their
00:05:46 --> 00:05:50 surface as well. Um and what's happened
00:05:50 --> 00:05:55 um is that if if you imagine that comet
00:05:56 --> 00:05:59 3i Atlas, the uh interstellar comet or
00:06:00 --> 00:06:01 exoc comet as you said, I like that
00:06:01 --> 00:06:05 term. Um it's uh if you imagine that
00:06:05 --> 00:06:08 being from the trans neptunian zone of
00:06:08 --> 00:06:10 its uh original solar system, which it
00:06:10 --> 00:06:13 probably is, uh then it may well have
00:06:13 --> 00:06:16 cry volcanoes on its surface. And so
00:06:16 --> 00:06:18 that's the sort of premise I think from
00:06:18 --> 00:06:22 which this work has started. Uh but
00:06:22 --> 00:06:24 there is a group of uh I think they're
00:06:24 --> 00:06:27 Spanish uh scientists who have used a
00:06:27 --> 00:06:30 telescope in Spain and they've basically
00:06:30 --> 00:06:36 looked at um the comet when it was close
00:06:36 --> 00:06:40 to its um closest approach to the sun.
00:06:40 --> 00:06:41 In other words, when it was close to
00:06:41 --> 00:06:43 perihelion. Now, when it went through
00:06:44 --> 00:06:46 perihelion, it was invisible to us. That
00:06:46 --> 00:06:48 was on October the 29th.
00:06:48 --> 00:06:48 >> Yeah.
00:06:48 --> 00:06:51 >> Um and because the sun was in the way.
00:06:51 --> 00:06:53 Uh and that kind of spoils the view a
00:06:53 --> 00:06:55 bit. But they uh what they so what
00:06:55 --> 00:06:57 they're um what they're doing is uh
00:06:57 --> 00:07:00 taking um observations before that and
00:07:00 --> 00:07:03 after that as close as they can. Uh and
00:07:03 --> 00:07:06 it's all to see what happens to the icy
00:07:06 --> 00:07:09 surface of the comet as it uh gets
00:07:10 --> 00:07:13 heated up by the sun sun's radiation.
00:07:13 --> 00:07:15 >> Uh so um
00:07:16 --> 00:07:19 uh the the the
00:07:19 --> 00:07:23 brightness of the comet uh got much more
00:07:23 --> 00:07:26 uh much higher when it passed the sun.
00:07:26 --> 00:07:28 And that's typical because as the
00:07:28 --> 00:07:30 nearest point to the sun, the comet's
00:07:30 --> 00:07:33 feeling the most extreme solar radiation
00:07:33 --> 00:07:35 both in terms of ultraviolet light and
00:07:36 --> 00:07:38 solar wind and that's when they tend to
00:07:38 --> 00:07:40 get most active. Uh so what they're
00:07:40 --> 00:07:46 suggesting is that there is
00:07:46 --> 00:07:50 basically um something that's happened
00:07:50 --> 00:07:54 that means that the solid carbon dioxide
00:07:54 --> 00:07:58 uh which is turning into gaseous carbon
00:07:58 --> 00:08:01 dio dioxide under the sun's radiation.
00:08:01 --> 00:08:04 They think that um there's been a
00:08:04 --> 00:08:08 reaction uh because the um the crust
00:08:08 --> 00:08:10 looks as though they they believe the
00:08:10 --> 00:08:13 comet has a crust uh and a reaction
00:08:13 --> 00:08:18 within the comet has u essentially and
00:08:18 --> 00:08:22 it involves um uh the um
00:08:22 --> 00:08:25 molecules that they mention are reactive
00:08:25 --> 00:08:28 metallic grains like nickel and iron
00:08:28 --> 00:08:31 sulfides. I'm not a chemist, so I can't
00:08:31 --> 00:08:33 comment on that, but I can believe that.
00:08:33 --> 00:08:35 Um, and what they're saying is that
00:08:35 --> 00:08:37 there's there's been stuff happening
00:08:37 --> 00:08:39 underneath the surface of the comet that
00:08:39 --> 00:08:43 has um basically allowed gas to erupt
00:08:43 --> 00:08:46 from the comet itself. And that's the
00:08:46 --> 00:08:48 gas that has caused the increase in
00:08:48 --> 00:08:49 brightening because you've suddenly got
00:08:49 --> 00:08:52 a lot more gas around the comet which is
00:08:52 --> 00:08:55 basically glowing because of the uh
00:08:55 --> 00:08:57 effect of the solar radiation. Uh, I
00:08:57 --> 00:08:59 think that's the gist of the story,
00:08:59 --> 00:09:00 Andrew. It's um
00:09:00 --> 00:09:03 >> Yeah, I I'd be I'm a bit surprised given
00:09:03 --> 00:09:07 how big Three Atlas is. It's not a not a
00:09:07 --> 00:09:09 huge object in this. Well, you know, if
00:09:09 --> 00:09:11 it hit us, it wouldn't be nice, but um
00:09:11 --> 00:09:13 it it I I would have thought something
00:09:13 --> 00:09:15 that small wouldn't be able to kind of
00:09:16 --> 00:09:17 erupt, but I suppose it's more of a
00:09:17 --> 00:09:20 reaction to its uh environment.
00:09:20 --> 00:09:23 >> That That's correct. Yes. and and it I
00:09:23 --> 00:09:25 suppose what needs an eruption or what
00:09:26 --> 00:09:27 would drive an eruption is if you've got
00:09:27 --> 00:09:30 a harder crust above something beneath
00:09:30 --> 00:09:35 it that is uh more vol sorry more um uh
00:09:35 --> 00:09:37 less viscous that way something that's
00:09:37 --> 00:09:39 slloshing around and I think that's what
00:09:39 --> 00:09:41 these scientists are suggesting and it's
00:09:41 --> 00:09:43 their um you know their observations of
00:09:43 --> 00:09:45 the the coma of the comet the coma is
00:09:45 --> 00:09:48 the the brightness around the nucleus
00:09:48 --> 00:09:51 the nucleus is the icy body itself the
00:09:51 --> 00:09:53 coma that has brightened up. I think the
00:09:53 --> 00:09:56 tail has brightened up as well. Um and
00:09:56 --> 00:09:59 the basically they're suggesting that
00:09:59 --> 00:10:02 that's due to this phenomenon of of a
00:10:02 --> 00:10:07 less viscous sub um mantle if you want
00:10:07 --> 00:10:08 to put it that way because that's what
00:10:08 --> 00:10:10 it is in the case of the earth. Uh that
00:10:10 --> 00:10:12 allows an eruption to take place. Um
00:10:12 --> 00:10:14 you're right about the size though
00:10:14 --> 00:10:18 because at first um estimates of three
00:10:18 --> 00:10:20 Atlas's size and this is the nucleus
00:10:20 --> 00:10:22 that we're talking about the actual icy
00:10:22 --> 00:10:24 object itself was in the region of 20
00:10:24 --> 00:10:26 kilometers which would be very very
00:10:26 --> 00:10:29 large for a comet but I think the the
00:10:29 --> 00:10:31 latest observations from the Hubble
00:10:31 --> 00:10:33 Space Telescope suggest it's much less
00:10:33 --> 00:10:36 than that between about 500 meters and a
00:10:36 --> 00:10:39 kilometer or so something of that sort.
00:10:39 --> 00:10:39 M
00:10:39 --> 00:10:42 >> um actually it it might be more than
00:10:42 --> 00:10:46 that sort of 500 m maybe to 5 km some
00:10:46 --> 00:10:48 something in that range is what they're
00:10:48 --> 00:10:49 suggesting.
00:10:49 --> 00:10:52 >> Okay. And so there's um there's much to
00:10:52 --> 00:10:55 learn from this behavior because uh we
00:10:55 --> 00:10:56 we might be able to see what's going on
00:10:56 --> 00:10:57 inside.
00:10:58 --> 00:10:59 >> Yes, that's right. That's the thing
00:10:59 --> 00:11:01 about cry volcanoes, what they spew out
00:11:01 --> 00:11:03 is what's inside the object. And so it's
00:11:03 --> 00:11:06 worth studying. Um, all the ones that
00:11:06 --> 00:11:08 we've seen so far, like on Pluto, Titan,
00:11:08 --> 00:11:11 and series, they're all extinct. They're
00:11:11 --> 00:11:13 not doing anything. But there's uh
00:11:13 --> 00:11:15 evidence around them. Certainly in
00:11:15 --> 00:11:17 series, there's all these uh chemicals
00:11:17 --> 00:11:19 that have been and and you might
00:11:19 --> 00:11:21 remember that series has got bright
00:11:21 --> 00:11:24 spots on it, uh, which we think are
00:11:24 --> 00:11:27 salts left behind by liquid that's oozed
00:11:27 --> 00:11:29 up in these either in fractures or the
00:11:29 --> 00:11:32 cry volcanoes themselves. uh and left
00:11:32 --> 00:11:34 and as the solar radiation has sort of
00:11:34 --> 00:11:36 boiled away the liquid uh you've got
00:11:36 --> 00:11:38 you've got these salts left which are
00:11:38 --> 00:11:41 really quite white in color. Uh that's
00:11:41 --> 00:11:43 why series was such an interesting world
00:11:43 --> 00:11:45 when the dawn spacecraft was approaching
00:11:45 --> 00:11:47 it and we could see all these spots on
00:11:47 --> 00:11:50 it markets put there by extraterrestrial
00:11:50 --> 00:11:52 intelligence. No, there were fields of
00:11:52 --> 00:11:55 salt someone
00:11:55 --> 00:11:56 there.
00:11:56 --> 00:11:59 >> No, we continue to be mesmerized by
00:11:59 --> 00:12:01 three Atlas. it just keeps um for, you
00:12:01 --> 00:12:03 know, no pun intended, throwing up new
00:12:03 --> 00:12:06 information and interesting things. So,
00:12:06 --> 00:12:08 um I'm sure there'll be more to learn uh
00:12:08 --> 00:12:13 as it keeps um skimming our sun and
00:12:13 --> 00:12:15 it'll disappear later next year. Next
00:12:15 --> 00:12:16 year sometime, won't it? It'll be
00:12:16 --> 00:12:19 >> I think that's right. Yeah. Below
00:12:19 --> 00:12:21 >> below the level that we can detect it,
00:12:21 --> 00:12:22 especially if it's, you know, only 5
00:12:22 --> 00:12:25 kilometers or less in size. That's not
00:12:25 --> 00:12:27 much to refle reflect the sun's light
00:12:27 --> 00:12:29 once you've got all the activity
00:12:29 --> 00:12:31 stopping because the sun's radiation's
00:12:31 --> 00:12:31 going.
00:12:32 --> 00:12:34 >> Yes, indeed. All right. Um I think you
00:12:34 --> 00:12:37 can read up on that story uh at the live
00:12:37 --> 00:12:39 science website, but I think they've
00:12:39 --> 00:12:42 also published their findings in um the
00:12:42 --> 00:12:44 archive server. Yes, they have. So, you
00:12:44 --> 00:12:46 might want to check that out there. This
00:12:46 --> 00:12:49 is Space Nuts with Andrew Dunley and
00:12:49 --> 00:12:51 Professor Fred Watson.
00:12:51 --> 00:12:53 Let's take a little break from the show
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00:15:27 --> 00:15:29 Click get the deal and then have a look
00:15:29 --> 00:15:32 and see what suits you best.
00:15:32 --> 00:15:35 >> And I feel space nuts. Now, you might
00:15:35 --> 00:15:37 think it's weird that a an object as
00:15:38 --> 00:15:40 small as a comet could um you know have
00:15:40 --> 00:15:43 a cryo volcano, but what's even weirder
00:15:43 --> 00:15:46 is this story about ice moons having
00:15:46 --> 00:15:50 boiling oceans. Do tell.
00:15:50 --> 00:15:53 >> This is work from uh uh I think a number
00:15:54 --> 00:15:57 of um authors, some at least of whom are
00:15:57 --> 00:15:59 from the University of California,
00:15:59 --> 00:16:03 Davis. uh the lead author Max Rudolph is
00:16:03 --> 00:16:06 from that institution and uh they've
00:16:06 --> 00:16:09 been thinking about
00:16:09 --> 00:16:11 uh the
00:16:11 --> 00:16:14 the exact details of the structure of
00:16:14 --> 00:16:16 the ice moons that we so often talk
00:16:16 --> 00:16:18 about on space shuttles.
00:16:18 --> 00:16:20 >> Once again, that structure, a rocky
00:16:20 --> 00:16:22 core, a liquid ocean over the top of it,
00:16:22 --> 00:16:26 and an icy crust on top of that. So um
00:16:26 --> 00:16:29 they've um looked in some detail at the
00:16:29 --> 00:16:32 physics of this and what's driven that
00:16:32 --> 00:16:35 are things that we see on these ice
00:16:35 --> 00:16:37 moons and some of the contrasts. For
00:16:37 --> 00:16:40 example um you know you've only to think
00:16:40 --> 00:16:43 about Enceladus perhaps the poster child
00:16:43 --> 00:16:44 of the ice moons because of the geysers
00:16:44 --> 00:16:47 of ice crystals that erupt from its
00:16:47 --> 00:16:51 southern pole. Um, and the region where
00:16:51 --> 00:16:55 those geysers erupt, uh, is is very
00:16:55 --> 00:16:57 fractured. Um, in fact, the fractures
00:16:57 --> 00:16:59 were discovered first before Cassini
00:16:59 --> 00:17:02 spotted the the the ice geysers. Um, and
00:17:02 --> 00:17:04 they were called tiger stripes because
00:17:04 --> 00:17:06 they're sort of blue in color. I'm not
00:17:06 --> 00:17:08 quite sure why a blue tiger would uh
00:17:08 --> 00:17:11 have those stripes, but anyway, that's
00:17:11 --> 00:17:12 what they look like. They look like
00:17:12 --> 00:17:13 stripes on a tiger, but they're blue. It
00:17:14 --> 00:17:16 is otherwise a stunningly beautiful
00:17:16 --> 00:17:19 world. Yes, it is. Absolutely, I agree
00:17:19 --> 00:17:23 with that. But contrast that with Mimas,
00:17:23 --> 00:17:26 which is one of um Saturn's moons that
00:17:26 --> 00:17:29 is, you know, it's in the same region of
00:17:29 --> 00:17:31 the solar system, but it is totally
00:17:31 --> 00:17:33 totally different. It's got an ancient
00:17:33 --> 00:17:36 surface uh peppered with craters, one of
00:17:36 --> 00:17:38 which is huge and makes it look like the
00:17:38 --> 00:17:41 Death Star. Uh that's why Mimas, I
00:17:41 --> 00:17:42 think, is the poster child of science
00:17:42 --> 00:17:46 fiction readers rather than physicists.
00:17:46 --> 00:17:48 um but they've all got the same the same
00:17:48 --> 00:17:50 structure. So why are they so different?
00:17:50 --> 00:17:53 >> And so um these scientists at the
00:17:53 --> 00:17:54 University of California Davis and
00:17:54 --> 00:17:57 elsewhere have looked in detail at that
00:17:57 --> 00:18:01 the physics of what happens. And um it
00:18:01 --> 00:18:05 so it it a lot depends on
00:18:05 --> 00:18:08 how they manage to maintain their
00:18:08 --> 00:18:11 internal heat and in certainly in the
00:18:11 --> 00:18:13 case of Enceladus and I think this is
00:18:13 --> 00:18:14 probably true with Mimas as well but to
00:18:14 --> 00:18:18 a le lesser extent you've got uh tidal
00:18:18 --> 00:18:20 forces you've got a giant planet in this
00:18:20 --> 00:18:23 case we're talking about Saturn which is
00:18:23 --> 00:18:26 your next door neighbor uh and having
00:18:26 --> 00:18:29 something big that big that near is
00:18:29 --> 00:18:32 going to exert really strong tidal
00:18:32 --> 00:18:34 forces. And tidal forces are ones that
00:18:34 --> 00:18:39 tend to stretch and squeeze uh a um a
00:18:39 --> 00:18:43 body like a moon. Um and so that's where
00:18:43 --> 00:18:45 we think most of the internal heat comes
00:18:45 --> 00:18:48 from uh in uh certainly in Enceladus
00:18:48 --> 00:18:50 that you've got Enceladus in an orbit
00:18:50 --> 00:18:53 that is not circular. And so as it's
00:18:53 --> 00:18:55 nearer and further away from Saturn in
00:18:55 --> 00:18:57 its orbits, it will be stretched and
00:18:57 --> 00:19:00 squeezed that causes frictional heating
00:19:00 --> 00:19:03 and that in excuse me that in turn keeps
00:19:04 --> 00:19:08 that liquid water ocean liquid uh rather
00:19:08 --> 00:19:11 than letting it freeze. So, but what
00:19:11 --> 00:19:14 they have suggested these authors is um
00:19:14 --> 00:19:18 if you think about what's happening here
00:19:18 --> 00:19:23 uh the ice uh above the ocean when
00:19:23 --> 00:19:27 you've got stronger tidal heating that
00:19:27 --> 00:19:30 shell of ice can melt on its underside.
00:19:30 --> 00:19:34 >> And we know that ice is odd in that it
00:19:34 --> 00:19:37 gets bigger as it freezes.
00:19:37 --> 00:19:39 >> Yes. Um it's um that's why you get burst
00:19:39 --> 00:19:41 pipes because when the ice freezes it
00:19:41 --> 00:19:42 gets bigger.
00:19:42 --> 00:19:42 >> That's right.
00:19:42 --> 00:19:46 >> Um and so if the ice melts then you've
00:19:46 --> 00:19:50 got um basically uh a smaller smaller
00:19:50 --> 00:19:53 volume of ice. And what they're
00:19:53 --> 00:19:58 suggesting is that uh when that happens
00:19:58 --> 00:20:01 um the when the ice shell melts from the
00:20:01 --> 00:20:05 bottom you get effectively a vacuum uh
00:20:05 --> 00:20:07 above the liquid. Mhm.
00:20:07 --> 00:20:10 >> Um or it wants to form a vacuum because
00:20:10 --> 00:20:13 the pressure is suddenly low and what
00:20:13 --> 00:20:17 that can do is cause the liquid to boil.
00:20:17 --> 00:20:18 Um I don't know whether you've ever seen
00:20:18 --> 00:20:21 liquid boiling under low pressure.
00:20:21 --> 00:20:21 Andrew,
00:20:21 --> 00:20:22 >> no.
00:20:22 --> 00:20:24 >> Uh it's pretty easy to demonstrate if
00:20:24 --> 00:20:26 you've if you've got a hypodermic
00:20:26 --> 00:20:28 syringe or something like that. Um
00:20:28 --> 00:20:29 transparent one. And I used to use them
00:20:29 --> 00:20:33 for uh dropping bits of liquid onto
00:20:33 --> 00:20:35 things when I was building fiber optic
00:20:35 --> 00:20:37 systems at the observatory. If you got a
00:20:37 --> 00:20:39 hypodermic syringe and you fill it with
00:20:39 --> 00:20:41 water uh and you put your finger over
00:20:41 --> 00:20:45 the end of it um and then pull back the
00:20:45 --> 00:20:48 uh pull back the the syringe uh piston,
00:20:48 --> 00:20:50 uh the water will boil because you
00:20:50 --> 00:20:53 create a vacuum above it uh and and it
00:20:53 --> 00:20:55 basically just boils. It's quite
00:20:55 --> 00:20:57 dramatic to watch. Does it boil boil hot
00:20:58 --> 00:20:58 or is it just
00:20:58 --> 00:20:59 >> No, it's it's boiling at room
00:20:59 --> 00:21:00 temperature.
00:21:00 --> 00:21:01 >> Wow.
00:21:01 --> 00:21:03 >> Um so, and so and what we're talking
00:21:03 --> 00:21:04 about here is something that's boiling
00:21:04 --> 00:21:07 at much lower than room temperature
00:21:07 --> 00:21:09 because you've got ice above it. But if
00:21:09 --> 00:21:10 the pressure is low enough, the water
00:21:10 --> 00:21:13 will boil. Uh and that's why you can't
00:21:13 --> 00:21:15 have liquid water for very long anyway
00:21:15 --> 00:21:17 on Mars because the air pressure above
00:21:17 --> 00:21:19 it is too too low.
00:21:19 --> 00:21:22 So yes, um uh the suggestion is that we
00:21:22 --> 00:21:25 might get this boiling. Uh and what
00:21:25 --> 00:21:29 they're saying is that that could give
00:21:29 --> 00:21:32 you some of the strange
00:21:32 --> 00:21:35 uh or the differences in terrain that we
00:21:35 --> 00:21:39 see between the moons. Um
00:21:39 --> 00:21:41 if I can um uh let's see this is from
00:21:41 --> 00:21:46 Scitec Daily. This is uh it might be a
00:21:46 --> 00:21:47 press release actually by University of
00:21:47 --> 00:21:49 California Davis. I was going to read
00:21:50 --> 00:21:52 from it. I want to credit the uh the
00:21:52 --> 00:21:57 origin. Um, let me say so, so Mimas, uh,
00:21:57 --> 00:22:00 that's the Death Star ice moon. Oh, it
00:22:00 --> 00:22:01 says, I'll read the whole thing and I
00:22:01 --> 00:22:05 won't comment on it. Um, images.
00:22:06 --> 00:22:09 All right. There's a there's a there's
00:22:09 --> 00:22:10 another world another world that they're
00:22:10 --> 00:22:12 talking about, which is Miranda, which
00:22:12 --> 00:22:14 is one of Uranus's moons. We'll forget
00:22:14 --> 00:22:15 that for a minute, but we'll just talk
00:22:16 --> 00:22:19 about Mimas. uh less than 250 mi across
00:22:19 --> 00:22:20 and pitted with craters, including a
00:22:20 --> 00:22:22 very large crater, earning it the
00:22:22 --> 00:22:24 nickname Death Star. It appears to be
00:22:24 --> 00:22:27 geologically dead, Rudolph said, uh lead
00:22:27 --> 00:22:30 author. But a wubble in its movement
00:22:30 --> 00:22:32 suggests an ocean is present. Because
00:22:32 --> 00:22:35 Mimos's ice shell is not expected to
00:22:35 --> 00:22:37 break as a result of ice shell thinning,
00:22:37 --> 00:22:40 the presence of an ocean can be
00:22:40 --> 00:22:42 reconciled with a geologically dead
00:22:42 --> 00:22:45 surface. Um, but what they're then
00:22:45 --> 00:22:48 saying is, uh, that if you've got, uh, a
00:22:48 --> 00:22:51 thinner eye shell, then you'll end up
00:22:51 --> 00:22:53 with a surface like the one on Enceladus
00:22:53 --> 00:22:55 with stuff actually bursting through it.
00:22:55 --> 00:22:55 >> Okay.
00:22:55 --> 00:22:58 >> Uh, really interesting piece of work.
00:22:58 --> 00:23:01 Um, it's uh, it's in nature astronomy.
00:23:01 --> 00:23:03 So, it's a top level journal that this
00:23:03 --> 00:23:06 is published in. Uh, and the paper in
00:23:06 --> 00:23:07 Nature Astronomy is called Boiling
00:23:07 --> 00:23:10 Oceans and Compressional Tectonics on
00:23:10 --> 00:23:13 emerging ocean worlds. There you go.
00:23:13 --> 00:23:15 >> Yeah. I mean, when I was a kid, we
00:23:15 --> 00:23:19 didn't even know that ice moons existed.
00:23:19 --> 00:23:21 I um I'm sure
00:23:21 --> 00:23:23 >> when you were when you were an adult,
00:23:23 --> 00:23:25 you didn't know any, you know, but now
00:23:25 --> 00:23:28 we're finding more and more of them.
00:23:28 --> 00:23:29 We're starting to go, well, hang on a
00:23:29 --> 00:23:30 minute.
00:23:30 --> 00:23:33 >> Pluto could be one of these, too. And
00:23:33 --> 00:23:35 the list just gets longer and longer.
00:23:35 --> 00:23:36 >> Yeah, it probably is.
00:23:36 --> 00:23:39 >> It Yeah. Um so, and so much to learn.
00:23:39 --> 00:23:42 And of course, um, yeah, as we've
00:23:42 --> 00:23:44 mentioned many times before, there's a
00:23:44 --> 00:23:46 lot of excitement in regard to having
00:23:46 --> 00:23:48 worlds in our solar system with liquid
00:23:48 --> 00:23:50 oceans because,
00:23:50 --> 00:23:53 um, you know, water means life on Earth.
00:23:53 --> 00:23:55 So, could it be the same elsewhere?
00:23:55 --> 00:23:59 It's, um, yeah, it's it's it's a mystery
00:23:59 --> 00:24:01 that's going to be resolved in the not
00:24:01 --> 00:24:03 too distant future, I imagine.
00:24:03 --> 00:24:05 >> We can, but hope so. Um, I mean, you
00:24:05 --> 00:24:08 know, our friend Linda Spilka, former
00:24:08 --> 00:24:11 Cassini mission scientist, she's working
00:24:11 --> 00:24:16 on a on a on a flyby mission to sample
00:24:16 --> 00:24:20 the geysers of Enceladus again um with
00:24:20 --> 00:24:23 with a view to looking for exactly that
00:24:23 --> 00:24:26 evidence of living organisms in the sub
00:24:26 --> 00:24:30 ocean uh sub ice ocean of Enceladus. I
00:24:30 --> 00:24:33 hope we are space knotting long enough
00:24:33 --> 00:24:36 to get the results of that.
00:24:36 --> 00:24:38 >> And of course, Europa clip is on its way
00:24:38 --> 00:24:38 too.
00:24:38 --> 00:24:39 >> Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Which is And
00:24:40 --> 00:24:42 so Europa is another ice moon. Similar,
00:24:42 --> 00:24:43 you know, similar story.
00:24:43 --> 00:24:43 >> Yep.
00:24:44 --> 00:24:46 >> Yeah. We watch with interest. As Fred
00:24:46 --> 00:24:48 said, you can read all about it uh on
00:24:48 --> 00:24:51 the website Sciiet Daily, or you could
00:24:51 --> 00:24:54 uh go to the uh the paper itself, which
00:24:54 --> 00:24:57 um is down the bottom of this particular
00:24:57 --> 00:24:59 article somewhere, and I've lost it, but
00:24:59 --> 00:25:01 um yes, it is a it is a published
00:25:01 --> 00:25:04 document. Uh Nature Astronomy. There it
00:25:04 --> 00:25:05 is right in front of me. This is Space
00:25:06 --> 00:25:08 Nuts with Andrew Dunley and Fred Watson.
00:25:08 --> 00:25:11 >> 3 2 1
00:25:11 --> 00:25:14 >> Space Nuts. The more we look at Mars,
00:25:14 --> 00:25:17 the more we study Mars, the more we
00:25:17 --> 00:25:20 start to learn about it. And there's a a
00:25:20 --> 00:25:23 new uh piece of evidence that's been uh
00:25:23 --> 00:25:24 discovered. And I believe there's
00:25:24 --> 00:25:27 another paper been published saying we
00:25:27 --> 00:25:30 think that not only did Mars have an
00:25:30 --> 00:25:33 atmosphere, it had uh and oceans. We
00:25:33 --> 00:25:36 already know that. But it looks like uh
00:25:36 --> 00:25:39 for billions of years it had a near
00:25:39 --> 00:25:42 tropical environment with pouring rain
00:25:42 --> 00:25:44 and um all the things that we take for
00:25:44 --> 00:25:47 granted on Earth. This this is quite an
00:25:47 --> 00:25:50 amazing um claim I suppose you'd call
00:25:50 --> 00:25:58 it. It is. Yes. Um so uh lots of um lots
00:25:58 --> 00:26:01 of uh I guess comparisons being drawn
00:26:01 --> 00:26:05 here. Um and um our old friend fizz.org
00:26:05 --> 00:26:09 has got a very nice article uh entitled
00:26:09 --> 00:26:11 evidence of raindriven climate on Mars
00:26:11 --> 00:26:13 found in bleach rocks scattered in
00:26:13 --> 00:26:16 Jezero crater. Jezro crater is where
00:26:16 --> 00:26:20 perseverance is. Uh and that is
00:26:20 --> 00:26:23 something that uh is kind of expected
00:26:23 --> 00:26:26 because Jezro crater was once a river
00:26:26 --> 00:26:30 delta uh from water that flowed from a a
00:26:30 --> 00:26:33 river into the crater itself. And we
00:26:33 --> 00:26:35 have plenty of evidence that that
00:26:35 --> 00:26:38 happened maybe three to four billion
00:26:38 --> 00:26:42 years ago. But what is now happening is
00:26:42 --> 00:26:45 that Perseverance is actually having a
00:26:45 --> 00:26:47 closer look at some of the rocks around
00:26:47 --> 00:26:51 and has discovered uh some um would you
00:26:51 --> 00:26:54 excuse me just a moment now that's not
00:26:54 --> 00:26:55 going to work. I'm just going to ignore
00:26:56 --> 00:26:58 that as a phone call. Um I'll have to
00:26:58 --> 00:26:59 I'll have to ignore it. There's no point
00:27:00 --> 00:27:01 in sending a message because it's not
00:27:01 --> 00:27:03 coming from a mobile phone.
00:27:03 --> 00:27:04 >> Oh right.
00:27:04 --> 00:27:06 >> Yeah. Sorry. Keep going. You can edit
00:27:06 --> 00:27:09 that bit without you. Um what uh what
00:27:09 --> 00:27:12 has been discovered by Perseverance
00:27:12 --> 00:27:19 are um aluminium rich clay rocks
00:27:19 --> 00:27:22 uh and well I'll read the sentence. It's
00:27:22 --> 00:27:24 a lovely summary of what the story is.
00:27:24 --> 00:27:27 As I said it's on the f.org website. The
00:27:27 --> 00:27:29 rocks discovered by NASA's Perseverance
00:27:29 --> 00:27:32 Mars rover are white alium aluminium
00:27:32 --> 00:27:35 rich sorry aluminum rich. I should read
00:27:36 --> 00:27:39 it properly and pronounce it properly.
00:27:39 --> 00:27:41 We call it aluminium. Uh other side of
00:27:41 --> 00:27:43 the Pacific calls it aluminum. So that's
00:27:43 --> 00:27:44 where this came from. So let's call it
00:27:44 --> 00:27:48 that. Uh they are white aluminum rich
00:27:48 --> 00:27:53 kaolinite clay. So kaite is a clayish uh
00:27:53 --> 00:27:56 mineral which forms on earth after rocks
00:27:56 --> 00:27:58 and sediment are leeched of all other
00:27:58 --> 00:28:01 minerals by millions of years of a wet
00:28:01 --> 00:28:04 rainy climate. That's the bottom line
00:28:04 --> 00:28:06 and it's exactly as you've said evidence
00:28:06 --> 00:28:10 for uh rain uh long periods of rain uh
00:28:10 --> 00:28:14 and you know the what this speaks of is
00:28:14 --> 00:28:16 and this is I guess the big question
00:28:16 --> 00:28:18 about water on Mars. Were these lakes
00:28:18 --> 00:28:21 and seas that we know were there? Were
00:28:21 --> 00:28:23 they there just, you know, sporadically
00:28:23 --> 00:28:26 uh just once in a while for a few u
00:28:26 --> 00:28:29 million years but not there permanently
00:28:29 --> 00:28:31 or were we talking about oceans that
00:28:31 --> 00:28:33 themselves lasted for millions of years?
00:28:33 --> 00:28:35 And some of the recent work as well as
00:28:35 --> 00:28:37 this particular piece of work uh
00:28:37 --> 00:28:39 definitely support the latter. Uh that
00:28:39 --> 00:28:41 there was rain falling for millions of
00:28:41 --> 00:28:44 years and it was probably a tropical
00:28:44 --> 00:28:46 climate uh exactly as you said in the
00:28:46 --> 00:28:51 intro. Um um Andrew um so one of the
00:28:51 --> 00:28:55 authors uh has commented so when you see
00:28:55 --> 00:28:58 Kalinite on a place like Mars where it's
00:28:58 --> 00:29:00 barren cold and with certainly no liquid
00:29:00 --> 00:29:02 water at the surface it tells us that
00:29:02 --> 00:29:04 there was once a lot more water than
00:29:04 --> 00:29:06 there is today and it's somebody who's
00:29:06 --> 00:29:08 actually a collaborator on the
00:29:08 --> 00:29:11 Perseverance rover. So yes, more
00:29:11 --> 00:29:13 evidence still that we had a wet warm
00:29:13 --> 00:29:17 past uh on the planet Mars and just me
00:29:17 --> 00:29:21 just maybe uh we had uh life there
00:29:21 --> 00:29:23 because
00:29:23 --> 00:29:26 um the the the sort of rocks that we're
00:29:26 --> 00:29:29 talking about the kalinite uh are
00:29:29 --> 00:29:31 thought to be a little bit like a time
00:29:31 --> 00:29:33 capsule that there might be information
00:29:33 --> 00:29:35 in those rocks from billions of years
00:29:35 --> 00:29:38 ago that tell you about whether there
00:29:38 --> 00:29:42 were living organism isms on on Mars. Uh
00:29:42 --> 00:29:44 and that is the sort of holy grail of
00:29:44 --> 00:29:47 all this work. Whether a chunk of
00:29:47 --> 00:29:51 kalonite kalinite will be something that
00:29:51 --> 00:29:56 the hope hoped for Mars return mission
00:29:56 --> 00:29:57 would be able to bring back is another
00:29:57 --> 00:30:00 question. But maybe perseverance will
00:30:00 --> 00:30:02 drill samples from it so that we might
00:30:02 --> 00:30:04 find out. Uh because those those caches
00:30:04 --> 00:30:06 of of drilled samples are what we're
00:30:06 --> 00:30:08 expecting to come back to Earth at some
00:30:08 --> 00:30:10 point. At the moment, there isn't
00:30:10 --> 00:30:11 actually a mission on the cards that
00:30:11 --> 00:30:13 will do that.
00:30:13 --> 00:30:15 >> Yeah, I know. And that's frustrating,
00:30:15 --> 00:30:15 right?
00:30:15 --> 00:30:18 >> But um that's just the way it is at the
00:30:18 --> 00:30:21 moment. But I was just reading that the
00:30:21 --> 00:30:25 um ocean or the lake that existed in
00:30:25 --> 00:30:27 Jezero Crater they say is about twice
00:30:27 --> 00:30:30 the size of Lake Taho.
00:30:30 --> 00:30:32 Um, that would probably mean something
00:30:32 --> 00:30:34 to someone. I had to look up how big
00:30:34 --> 00:30:38 Lake Tahoe is and they're talking 496
00:30:38 --> 00:30:42 km. So, the lake that um they're
00:30:42 --> 00:30:44 investigating or the remnants of it on
00:30:44 --> 00:30:47 Mars is twice that size kilometers.
00:30:47 --> 00:30:47 So,
00:30:47 --> 00:30:48 >> y
00:30:48 --> 00:30:51 >> yeah, um it's pretty uh pretty amazing
00:30:51 --> 00:30:56 stuff and uh yeah, getting up close to
00:30:56 --> 00:30:58 some of this evidence is really starting
00:30:58 --> 00:31:02 to um provide people with the fuel they
00:31:02 --> 00:31:03 need
00:31:03 --> 00:31:05 >> to come up with um pretty solid theories
00:31:06 --> 00:31:07 I I would suggest.
00:31:07 --> 00:31:07 >> Yeah.
00:31:07 --> 00:31:09 >> Or even liquid theories.
00:31:09 --> 00:31:11 >> Yes, maybe.
00:31:11 --> 00:31:13 Maybe. Uh because they they keep saying
00:31:14 --> 00:31:15 where did all the water go? Oh, there
00:31:15 --> 00:31:17 must have and makes you wonder now if it
00:31:17 --> 00:31:19 had billions of years of saturating
00:31:19 --> 00:31:22 rain, I'm guessing it wasn't continuous.
00:31:22 --> 00:31:24 It was, you know, like it is on Earth
00:31:24 --> 00:31:25 comes and goes, but um there must have
00:31:25 --> 00:31:27 been a heck of a lot of water around at
00:31:27 --> 00:31:29 some stage.
00:31:29 --> 00:31:30 >> Yeah. And we know that a lot of it's
00:31:30 --> 00:31:32 still there uh locked up in the
00:31:32 --> 00:31:36 perafrost underneath the surface and uh
00:31:36 --> 00:31:38 in the Arctic and Antarctic regions of
00:31:38 --> 00:31:41 Mars. There's uh the ice caps themselves
00:31:41 --> 00:31:44 have got huge coms of water locked up in
00:31:44 --> 00:31:47 them. But a lot of it also leeched off
00:31:47 --> 00:31:49 into space. We know that Mars has lost a
00:31:49 --> 00:31:51 lot of its water by the hydrogen and
00:31:52 --> 00:31:54 oxygen atoms being dissociated and off
00:31:54 --> 00:31:56 goes the hydrogen because it's very
00:31:56 --> 00:31:57 light.
00:31:57 --> 00:31:58 >> Indeed.
00:31:58 --> 00:31:59 >> All right. But if you'd like to read up
00:31:59 --> 00:32:01 on that, as Fred said, it's at fizz.org
00:32:02 --> 00:32:04 or you can read the paper. Uh the
00:32:04 --> 00:32:05 findings were published in the journal
00:32:05 --> 00:32:08 Communications Earth and Environment.
00:32:08 --> 00:32:11 This is Space Nuts with Andrew Dunley
00:32:11 --> 00:32:14 and Professor Fred Watson. Space Nuts.
00:32:14 --> 00:32:18 Finally, Fred, uh bit of a bit of a
00:32:18 --> 00:32:20 bummer really. A whoopsy daisy with the
00:32:20 --> 00:32:23 Sawyer's launch pad after a um a launch
00:32:23 --> 00:32:25 the other day.
00:32:25 --> 00:32:26 >> Yes, that's correct. So the launch
00:32:26 --> 00:32:28 itself was successful and it's an
00:32:28 --> 00:32:31 important one. It was um I think so
00:32:31 --> 00:32:33 mission 28 if I remember rightly. I
00:32:33 --> 00:32:35 haven't got the details in front of me.
00:32:35 --> 00:32:39 Uh and uh took three astronauts or three
00:32:39 --> 00:32:41 space people up to the international
00:32:41 --> 00:32:44 space station. One NASA astronaut and
00:32:44 --> 00:32:48 two so uh Russian cosminauts. Um so they
00:32:48 --> 00:32:51 were fed up very successfully to the
00:32:51 --> 00:32:53 international space station. They docked
00:32:53 --> 00:32:55 about 3 hours after launch, I think, and
00:32:55 --> 00:32:58 are now happily um in the space station
00:32:58 --> 00:32:59 and doing what you do in the space
00:32:59 --> 00:33:01 station, which is
00:33:01 --> 00:33:02 >> chess with magnetic chess pieces. That's
00:33:02 --> 00:33:03 what you do,
00:33:03 --> 00:33:06 >> among other things. Yeah. Uh but the um
00:33:06 --> 00:33:07 there is
00:33:07 --> 00:33:08 >> I wouldn't like I wouldn't like to play
00:33:08 --> 00:33:10 a Russian in a game of chess. That
00:33:10 --> 00:33:12 absolutely cream me. They're pretty good
00:33:12 --> 00:33:13 at that, are they?
00:33:13 --> 00:33:15 >> I think they are. Yes. That's where a
00:33:15 --> 00:33:17 lot of the world chess champions have
00:33:17 --> 00:33:20 come from indeed. Yes.
00:33:20 --> 00:33:24 Um the so the other side of the coin
00:33:24 --> 00:33:28 though is that something went wrong with
00:33:28 --> 00:33:31 the Soyets launch platform. Uh and
00:33:31 --> 00:33:35 apparently uh a service platform
00:33:35 --> 00:33:38 uh which uh is needed when you're
00:33:38 --> 00:33:41 preparing uh the spacecraft for launch
00:33:41 --> 00:33:43 was not properly stowed. This was about
00:33:43 --> 00:33:47 20 tons worth I think and that basically
00:33:47 --> 00:33:52 was blown down into the the flame trench
00:33:52 --> 00:33:54 which is underneath where the launch
00:33:54 --> 00:33:58 takes place and uh did a lot of damage.
00:33:58 --> 00:34:01 Uh so I think Ross Cosmos the Russian
00:34:01 --> 00:34:03 space agent is playing it down a bit and
00:34:03 --> 00:34:04 saying oh no we've got all the bits we
00:34:04 --> 00:34:05 need to mend this
00:34:05 --> 00:34:06 >> nothing to see here. Well, they've got
00:34:06 --> 00:34:08 all the bits. They're just absolutely
00:34:08 --> 00:34:10 shattered and burnt and
00:34:10 --> 00:34:12 >> Yeah. Well, stuck in a big pit. In a
00:34:12 --> 00:34:14 pit. Yeah.
00:34:14 --> 00:34:16 >> Yeah. I mean, this this is journalism
00:34:16 --> 00:34:18 oneonone, Fred. We've got everything. It
00:34:18 --> 00:34:20 It's all there.
00:34:20 --> 00:34:22 >> Yes.
00:34:22 --> 00:34:25 >> It's just in pieces, that's all. Um and
00:34:25 --> 00:34:29 some observers, some probably um Russian
00:34:29 --> 00:34:31 journalists have said, "Yeah, in your
00:34:31 --> 00:34:32 dreams, this is going to take two years
00:34:32 --> 00:34:33 to fix."
00:34:33 --> 00:34:33 >> Yeah.
00:34:33 --> 00:34:35 >> So, we don't know the answer. It's
00:34:35 --> 00:34:37 important because that is the only this
00:34:37 --> 00:34:39 is at Bikonor where the you know the
00:34:39 --> 00:34:43 main launch site is in Kazakhstan u the
00:34:43 --> 00:34:47 that is the only launchpad certified for
00:34:47 --> 00:34:50 uh crew carrying Soyots flights
00:34:50 --> 00:34:52 >> uh and I think the next crew carrying
00:34:52 --> 00:34:54 flight is scheduled for the middle of
00:34:54 --> 00:34:57 next year. So there will be a rush on to
00:34:57 --> 00:35:00 get that organized. I think the progress
00:35:00 --> 00:35:03 cargo modules have to be launched from
00:35:03 --> 00:35:04 there as well and I think there's one of
00:35:04 --> 00:35:05 those supposed to go up in a couple of
00:35:05 --> 00:35:08 months time. So there might be uh we
00:35:08 --> 00:35:10 might see some delays in the program.
00:35:10 --> 00:35:12 We'll have to watch how that goes. And
00:35:12 --> 00:35:14 it may even be that SpaceX could come to
00:35:14 --> 00:35:17 the rescue with with a Crew Dragon up
00:35:17 --> 00:35:19 there or one of their Dragon cargo
00:35:19 --> 00:35:21 modules. Let's see what happens.
00:35:21 --> 00:35:23 >> Wouldn't that be interesting? Yeah. Uh,
00:35:23 --> 00:35:25 I think they did have a an issue
00:35:25 --> 00:35:29 recently with some stranded Chinese
00:35:29 --> 00:35:30 >> That's right.
00:35:30 --> 00:35:32 >> Yeah. astronauts and and they're still
00:35:32 --> 00:35:33 up there. Yes.
00:35:33 --> 00:35:35 >> Yeah. And and now we've had this issue.
00:35:35 --> 00:35:37 Uh, and of course we've had issues in
00:35:37 --> 00:35:39 the past with stranded American
00:35:39 --> 00:35:41 astronauts and
00:35:41 --> 00:35:44 >> uh the Boeing Star Liner problem. And
00:35:44 --> 00:35:45 uh, look, these things are going to
00:35:45 --> 00:35:47 happen. That's that's the nature of
00:35:47 --> 00:35:50 space. It um, it's it's a high-risk
00:35:50 --> 00:35:53 environment. you're um
00:35:53 --> 00:35:55 you're you're playing against the odds a
00:35:55 --> 00:35:56 lot of the time and
00:35:56 --> 00:35:59 >> you know um lo losing a chunk of space
00:35:59 --> 00:36:02 pad's probably a small price to pay as
00:36:02 --> 00:36:04 you say it's it's a critical launchpad
00:36:04 --> 00:36:06 and and that that
00:36:06 --> 00:36:09 >> is the problem they now face getting it
00:36:09 --> 00:36:12 um back to operational status
00:36:12 --> 00:36:13 >> because it's the only one they can use
00:36:13 --> 00:36:17 for human launches but um yeah that's a
00:36:17 --> 00:36:18 it's an unfort you know the other
00:36:18 --> 00:36:20 interesting part of this story which is
00:36:20 --> 00:36:23 is not really about the story itself is
00:36:23 --> 00:36:25 that um you've got this cooperative
00:36:26 --> 00:36:28 approach between NASA and Ross Cosmos
00:36:28 --> 00:36:32 while the political arms of each country
00:36:32 --> 00:36:34 are at each other's heads over the war
00:36:34 --> 00:36:37 in Ukraine. So I mean this is just nuts
00:36:37 --> 00:36:40 isn't isn't that the weirdest thing
00:36:40 --> 00:36:42 about humanity?
00:36:42 --> 00:36:46 It is uh to me it it speaks of what can
00:36:46 --> 00:36:47 be achieved though.
00:36:47 --> 00:36:50 >> Yeah. You know, why aren't we doing this
00:36:50 --> 00:36:53 throughout the whole of the whole of uh
00:36:53 --> 00:36:56 humanity rather than like space in in a
00:36:56 --> 00:36:59 way has focused people on the absolute
00:37:00 --> 00:37:03 need to react as though we were one
00:37:03 --> 00:37:06 species and one, you know, one community
00:37:06 --> 00:37:08 because in space that's what it is.
00:37:08 --> 00:37:10 Space is hard. Exactly as you've just
00:37:10 --> 00:37:13 said. I I've just written 13 chapters of
00:37:13 --> 00:37:16 my new science fiction novel and um and
00:37:16 --> 00:37:19 and I go I go exactly with that point
00:37:19 --> 00:37:21 that humanity's had to put all of its
00:37:21 --> 00:37:23 differences aside because
00:37:23 --> 00:37:24 >> yeah,
00:37:24 --> 00:37:25 >> we've got a bigger problem to deal with
00:37:25 --> 00:37:27 and they're not here.
00:37:27 --> 00:37:29 >> Yeah, that's right. Well, I'm glad to
00:37:29 --> 00:37:30 hear that. It sounds like an interesting
00:37:30 --> 00:37:31 book.
00:37:31 --> 00:37:33 >> Um yeah, I'm having a lot of fun with
00:37:33 --> 00:37:34 it. It's I'm just letting my imagination
00:37:34 --> 00:37:37 run wild and I I you know, I write on
00:37:37 --> 00:37:39 the fly. I don't actually sit down with
00:37:39 --> 00:37:42 a plan or or a novel, you know, board
00:37:42 --> 00:37:45 with all the scenarios. I I just let my
00:37:45 --> 00:37:47 brain go, okay, where's this going to go
00:37:47 --> 00:37:49 next? And sometimes it takes me to some
00:37:49 --> 00:37:50 weird places. But I've developed this
00:37:50 --> 00:37:54 character. He's a bit of a uh he's in
00:37:54 --> 00:37:57 he's from Earth. But uh he's um Yeah,
00:37:57 --> 00:37:59 I'm having a lot of fun with him. Let's
00:37:59 --> 00:38:00 just
00:38:00 --> 00:38:01 >> He doesn't play golf, does he?
00:38:01 --> 00:38:03 >> No. No, but he's playing silly buggers,
00:38:03 --> 00:38:05 I think, this game. All right, to
00:38:05 --> 00:38:07 describe it.
00:38:07 --> 00:38:09 He's he's going I don't know where I'm
00:38:10 --> 00:38:11 going to take him, but um so far so
00:38:12 --> 00:38:14 good. Uh it's been it's been fun to
00:38:14 --> 00:38:16 write about, but uh I think I think the
00:38:16 --> 00:38:18 novel will be called The Orb.
00:38:18 --> 00:38:19 >> Oh,
00:38:19 --> 00:38:22 >> but um I don't
00:38:22 --> 00:38:23 that that's that's a working title. I
00:38:23 --> 00:38:26 might stick with that, but um we'll
00:38:26 --> 00:38:27 we'll see how it goes. But I don't know
00:38:28 --> 00:38:29 when that'll be finished. I I'm hoping
00:38:29 --> 00:38:31 to make it an epic. So it might be, you
00:38:31 --> 00:38:33 know, or maybe even 20 or 30 pages by
00:38:33 --> 00:38:37 the time
00:38:37 --> 00:38:38 Okay.
00:38:38 --> 00:38:40 >> See how it goes. One of your longer
00:38:40 --> 00:38:41 novels.
00:38:41 --> 00:38:44 >> Yes, indeed. Um, but yes, um,
00:38:44 --> 00:38:47 interesting times with cooperation in
00:38:47 --> 00:38:50 space and a certain lack of cooperation
00:38:50 --> 00:38:52 on the surface of the planet. So,
00:38:52 --> 00:38:54 hopefully they can get that Sawyer's uh,
00:38:54 --> 00:38:57 space or launchpad all fixed up. You can
00:38:57 --> 00:39:00 read about that. Uh, it's all over the
00:39:00 --> 00:39:02 news, but spacnews.com has a good story
00:39:02 --> 00:39:07 about it. Uh, Fred, I think we're done.
00:39:07 --> 00:39:08 >> Well, that went quickly.
00:39:08 --> 00:39:09 >> Did did Right.
00:39:09 --> 00:39:10 >> Just like one of your novels.
00:39:10 --> 00:39:13 >> Yeah. Well, yeah, that's right. Um, we
00:39:13 --> 00:39:16 we'll see. Um, but yes, thank you, Fred.
00:39:16 --> 00:39:18 It's a pleasure as always.
00:39:18 --> 00:39:20 >> We'll speak again soon. I hope
00:39:20 --> 00:39:21 >> we will. Professor Fred Watson,
00:39:21 --> 00:39:23 astronomer at large. Don't forget to
00:39:23 --> 00:39:25 visit us online. You can do that at
00:39:25 --> 00:39:28 various social media spots. Um,
00:39:28 --> 00:39:30 Facebook, where we have an official page
00:39:30 --> 00:39:34 and we have a uh a userenerated page.
00:39:34 --> 00:39:36 the Space Nuts podcast group. Always a
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00:40:01 --> 00:40:03 I love coffee. So, uh, you might want to
00:40:03 --> 00:40:07 look at that at spacenutspodcast.com.
00:40:07 --> 00:40:10 Uh, unfortunately, um, Hugh couldn't be
00:40:10 --> 00:40:13 with us today, um, because he ate
00:40:13 --> 00:40:15 something that didn't agree with him and
00:40:16 --> 00:40:18 he's, um, sort of acting like a cryo
00:40:18 --> 00:40:21 volcano. He's
00:40:21 --> 00:40:23 lots of crying and lots of volcano.
00:40:24 --> 00:40:25 Let's just leave it at that. And from
00:40:25 --> 00:40:27 me, Andrew Dunley,
00:40:27 --> 00:40:29 thanks for your company. We'll see you
00:40:29 --> 00:40:31 on the next episode of Space Nuts.
00:40:31 --> 00:40:32 Bye-bye. Space Nuts.
00:40:32 --> 00:40:35 >> You'll be listening to the Space Nuts
00:40:35 --> 00:40:37 podcast
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