00:00:00 --> 00:00:02 Hi there. Thanks for joining us. This is
00:00:02 --> 00:00:04 Space Nuts. My name is Andrew Dunley.
00:00:04 --> 00:00:06 It's great to have your company yet
00:00:06 --> 00:00:09 again. Uh coming up on this episode, we
00:00:10 --> 00:00:12 will be looking at a new Big Bang
00:00:12 --> 00:00:15 theory, so to speak. Uh it's uh sort of
00:00:15 --> 00:00:17 wrapped up with dark matter and dark
00:00:17 --> 00:00:19 dark energy and all that dark and
00:00:19 --> 00:00:21 foroding stuff. So, we'll talk about
00:00:21 --> 00:00:25 that. Uh some other data is pointing to
00:00:25 --> 00:00:27 a potential outer planet and it may not
00:00:27 --> 00:00:30 be planet 9. or is it? We're not sure
00:00:30 --> 00:00:33 yet. We'll talk about that. And uh some
00:00:33 --> 00:00:35 space science stuff. Uh an old Russian
00:00:35 --> 00:00:38 spacecraft is headed back to Earth and
00:00:38 --> 00:00:39 unfortunately that's not where it was
00:00:40 --> 00:00:43 originally supposed to go back in 1972.
00:00:43 --> 00:00:46 Uh Artemus 2, an update on that. And a
00:00:46 --> 00:00:49 bit of a budget cut issue with NASA.
00:00:49 --> 00:00:51 That's all coming up on this episode of
00:00:51 --> 00:00:54 Space Nuts. 15 seconds. Guidance is
00:00:54 --> 00:00:59 internal. 10 9 ignition sequence start.
00:00:59 --> 00:01:05 Space nets 5 4 3 2 1 2 3 4 5 5 4 3 2 1
00:01:05 --> 00:01:08 Space Nuts astronauts report. It feels
00:01:08 --> 00:01:10 good. And it's good to see Professor
00:01:10 --> 00:01:12 Fred Watson again joining us on this
00:01:12 --> 00:01:14 episode of Space Nuts. Hi Fred. Hello
00:01:14 --> 00:01:17 Andrew. Very good to see you too. You're
00:01:17 --> 00:01:19 looking hail and hearty I have to say.
00:01:19 --> 00:01:20 Yes. I've got I've got a new background.
00:01:20 --> 00:01:23 You like my new office? I do. Yes. my
00:01:23 --> 00:01:26 new virtual office. It's um it's saying
00:01:26 --> 00:01:28 a lot of hell's at the moment. It is.
00:01:28 --> 00:01:31 It's got a hello. And if I put my hands
00:01:31 --> 00:01:33 in the right place, they're invisible.
00:01:33 --> 00:01:37 Yes. In fact, if I go Yeah. If I move
00:01:37 --> 00:01:39 around, I I go invisible. You do? Yes.
00:01:39 --> 00:01:41 Yes. You went invisible a minute or two
00:01:41 --> 00:01:42 ago, and I thought you'd rocketed into
00:01:42 --> 00:01:45 space. Never mind. Uh one day, no doubt
00:01:45 --> 00:01:48 you will. Now, you've been away, haven't
00:01:48 --> 00:01:51 you? We were over in Lord How Island uh
00:01:51 --> 00:01:54 which is an island uh some 150
00:01:54 --> 00:01:56 kilometers off of the coast of New South
00:01:56 --> 00:01:57 Wales. It's on the same latitude of Port
00:01:57 --> 00:02:00 McQuary. I used I used to
00:02:00 --> 00:02:03 broad island there. Yes. Yes, you did.
00:02:03 --> 00:02:06 Uh the the um I didn't actually have
00:02:06 --> 00:02:08 that much chance to talk to many of the
00:02:08 --> 00:02:09 locals in detail or else I would have
00:02:09 --> 00:02:11 asked them if they in fact I think I did
00:02:11 --> 00:02:12 ask one person whether they listened to
00:02:12 --> 00:02:15 you and they said yes. Uh but um yeah we
00:02:15 --> 00:02:17 we we were there for a dark sky
00:02:17 --> 00:02:21 festival. Uh uh Lord How is um working
00:02:22 --> 00:02:24 on the prospect of becoming Australia's
00:02:24 --> 00:02:27 first dark sky island. Uh which is like
00:02:27 --> 00:02:29 a dark sky park but it's an island. Uh
00:02:29 --> 00:02:31 I'm not giving away any secrets there
00:02:31 --> 00:02:33 but uh there are people working on that
00:02:33 --> 00:02:35 very enthusiastically and we wish them
00:02:35 --> 00:02:37 every success with it. Uh so one of this
00:02:37 --> 00:02:40 was a sort of kickoff festival with
00:02:40 --> 00:02:42 talks and presentations and um I took
00:02:42 --> 00:02:44 the old Gibson guitar and Money and I
00:02:44 --> 00:02:46 did a set in their music night. We did
00:02:46 --> 00:02:48 seven songs between us. That was Oh,
00:02:48 --> 00:02:50 cool. And I've done that for about 50
00:02:50 --> 00:02:54 years. And um and then um you know uh we
00:02:54 --> 00:02:57 did some uh experiments with a friend of
00:02:57 --> 00:03:00 ours uh uh Mariscaro uh launching
00:03:00 --> 00:03:03 rockets uh with which were fueled by
00:03:03 --> 00:03:06 vinegar and bicarbonate of soda. Um
00:03:06 --> 00:03:08 which meant we all ended up smelling of
00:03:08 --> 00:03:11 vinegar for the next four days. Uh and
00:03:11 --> 00:03:13 uh yeah, it went it went went very well.
00:03:13 --> 00:03:14 That was a a fun thing for the kids to
00:03:14 --> 00:03:16 do. So yeah, it was a good festival and
00:03:16 --> 00:03:18 it wound up on uh Thursday evening with
00:03:18 --> 00:03:21 a very nice meal uh cooked up by one of
00:03:21 --> 00:03:24 the top chefs on the island. So great.
00:03:24 --> 00:03:25 Fantastic. I haven't been to Lord How
00:03:25 --> 00:03:27 but we're going to going to have to get
00:03:27 --> 00:03:28 there. Yeah, you need to go. You do need
00:03:28 --> 00:03:32 to It's also uh the home of some unique
00:03:32 --> 00:03:35 wildlife. I believe there are. Yes. And
00:03:35 --> 00:03:38 particularly the Woodhen, uh which is
00:03:38 --> 00:03:40 ubiquitous. They had a program uh four
00:03:40 --> 00:03:42 or five years a three or four years ago
00:03:42 --> 00:03:44 I think it was to eliminate all the rats
00:03:44 --> 00:03:45 on the island which were eating the wood
00:03:46 --> 00:03:47 hens. Uh and that was quite
00:03:47 --> 00:03:49 controversial but it's worked and the
00:03:49 --> 00:03:54 wood hens are there in in remarkable uh
00:03:54 --> 00:03:58 uh prlivity. How's that? And they also
00:03:58 --> 00:04:00 have those quite rare stick insects on
00:04:00 --> 00:04:02 the is it on the spire? It's on balls
00:04:02 --> 00:04:04 pyramid. Gosh you're right there. Yeah,
00:04:04 --> 00:04:07 Ball's Pyramid 20 kilometers off Lord
00:04:07 --> 00:04:09 How. We had a very rough crossing to
00:04:09 --> 00:04:11 Ball's pyramid. We went cuz I always
00:04:11 --> 00:04:13 wanted to see it up close and personal.
00:04:13 --> 00:04:16 It's this stick of rock uh 500 m high.
00:04:16 --> 00:04:19 Uh and um remarkable and it, as you
00:04:19 --> 00:04:21 said, it does have I think it's the only
00:04:21 --> 00:04:24 place where these nocturnal stick
00:04:24 --> 00:04:25 insects are found. And they're actually
00:04:25 --> 00:04:28 quite big. I saw a photograph of one.
00:04:28 --> 00:04:29 Yeah, I remember that story breaking
00:04:30 --> 00:04:31 many years ago when they found them and
00:04:31 --> 00:04:34 they went, "Oh my goodness." Uh, didn't
00:04:34 --> 00:04:36 know they were here. That's right. Yeah.
00:04:36 --> 00:04:38 Incredible place. It is. It's amazing.
00:04:38 --> 00:04:40 So, um, what about you? How how's your
00:04:40 --> 00:04:42 week been? Uh, you're pretty quiet,
00:04:42 --> 00:04:44 actually. Just sort of settling back
00:04:44 --> 00:04:46 into normal life, even though that's
00:04:46 --> 00:04:47 going to be temporary. But I did want to
00:04:47 --> 00:04:49 show you something from our trip. Um, as
00:04:49 --> 00:04:51 you know, we went to San Francisco and
00:04:51 --> 00:04:54 San Francisco is the home of a big rock
00:04:54 --> 00:04:56 known as Alcatraz. Indeed. And you know,
00:04:56 --> 00:04:58 I like to collect souvenirs wherever I
00:04:58 --> 00:05:01 go, particularly particularly little
00:05:01 --> 00:05:03 rocks from different places. But this
00:05:03 --> 00:05:08 one's legal. There it is. Save the rock.
00:05:08 --> 00:05:11 Yeah. And inside that box, Yes. are two
00:05:11 --> 00:05:15 pieces two pieces of the cell block of
00:05:15 --> 00:05:17 Alcatraz, right? Cuz they're trying to
00:05:18 --> 00:05:20 do renovations to keep it going for
00:05:20 --> 00:05:22 future generations.
00:05:22 --> 00:05:24 And so as a part of the renovation
00:05:24 --> 00:05:27 process, they've had to demolish certain
00:05:27 --> 00:05:29 sections and um they're selling the rock
00:05:29 --> 00:05:31 to fund the renovations. The
00:05:31 --> 00:05:33 renovations. There you go. So I got two
00:05:33 --> 00:05:36 pieces of the cell wall from Alcatraz in
00:05:36 --> 00:05:37 my collection. You just can't see them
00:05:37 --> 00:05:41 as the uh the your your screen tries to
00:05:41 --> 00:05:42 wipe them out and make them part of the
00:05:42 --> 00:05:44 background. Yeah. If I tip it forward,
00:05:44 --> 00:05:47 it disappears. Can see them. So that's
00:05:47 --> 00:05:49 There they are. Oh, there they are. Yes.
00:05:49 --> 00:05:52 It's looking very uh very um penal penal
00:05:52 --> 00:05:55 connally. Yeah. This chunk of concrete,
00:05:55 --> 00:05:57 it says this chunk of concrete is a
00:05:57 --> 00:05:59 byproduct of a major rehabilitation
00:05:59 --> 00:06:02 effort now underway on the island. It's
00:06:02 --> 00:06:03 been inspected by park historic
00:06:03 --> 00:06:05 preservation specialists to be sure that
00:06:05 --> 00:06:08 it contains nothing of research
00:06:08 --> 00:06:11 potential. So, it's yeah, just looks
00:06:11 --> 00:06:12 like a piece of concrete, but it's
00:06:12 --> 00:06:14 actually a piece of Alcatraz and it's
00:06:14 --> 00:06:17 all mine. And uh interestingly um it's
00:06:18 --> 00:06:20 in the news at the moment, of course,
00:06:20 --> 00:06:22 because President Trump wants to
00:06:22 --> 00:06:25 reinstate it as a jail. Oh, does he? I
00:06:25 --> 00:06:28 didn't hear that one. Yeah. Uh it needs
00:06:28 --> 00:06:29 Well, I I'll tell him one thing for
00:06:29 --> 00:06:32 free. It needs work.
00:06:32 --> 00:06:35 It needs work. Um but it's only a
00:06:35 --> 00:06:37 15-minute trip to get over there. Yes,
00:06:37 --> 00:06:39 that's right. I haven't been to Pier 39.
00:06:39 --> 00:06:43 So, yeah, it's uh it's worth visiting,
00:06:43 --> 00:06:44 though. We better get down to the
00:06:44 --> 00:06:46 business of the day and that is
00:06:46 --> 00:06:48 astronomy and space science. And we'll
00:06:48 --> 00:06:50 start off with this story, Fred. A new
00:06:50 --> 00:06:54 theory on the Big Bang. Uh dark matter,
00:06:54 --> 00:06:56 dark energy, all of that stuff is rolled
00:06:56 --> 00:06:58 into this this uh paper that's been
00:06:58 --> 00:07:00 released uh through the University of
00:07:00 --> 00:07:04 Alabama in uh Huntsville. Um this is
00:07:04 --> 00:07:07 this is a a physics professor who's um
00:07:07 --> 00:07:08 come up with alternative theories in the
00:07:08 --> 00:07:10 past on other things.
00:07:10 --> 00:07:13 Um, this one though is probably going to
00:07:14 --> 00:07:16 get um pulled apart under the
00:07:16 --> 00:07:18 microscope. Uh, what he's suggesting is
00:07:18 --> 00:07:20 there might not have been one big bang,
00:07:20 --> 00:07:23 but lots of little bangs.
00:07:23 --> 00:07:27 That's right. Uh, exactly. And, um, uh,
00:07:27 --> 00:07:28 you know, you've you've described it
00:07:28 --> 00:07:31 perfectly. It's an a really interesting
00:07:31 --> 00:07:35 theory in that if you have lots of
00:07:35 --> 00:07:37 little bangs rather than one big one,
00:07:37 --> 00:07:39 apparently mathematically you can get
00:07:39 --> 00:07:41 rid of dark matter and dark energy which
00:07:41 --> 00:07:44 are of course the the two big problems
00:07:44 --> 00:07:47 in current cosmology. What are these? Um
00:07:47 --> 00:07:50 and just a bit of background there. Dark
00:07:50 --> 00:07:53 energy we think is the property of space
00:07:53 --> 00:07:56 uh that makes uh the expanding universe
00:07:56 --> 00:07:58 accelerate in its expansion. Uh although
00:07:58 --> 00:08:00 there's just we're just starting to see
00:08:00 --> 00:08:03 evidence that that might slow down that
00:08:03 --> 00:08:05 acceleration. Uh it looks as though it
00:08:05 --> 00:08:08 was uh more rapid uh five billion years
00:08:08 --> 00:08:11 ago than it is today. And that's you
00:08:11 --> 00:08:13 know new news I guess uh on the on the
00:08:13 --> 00:08:14 what you might call the conventional
00:08:14 --> 00:08:16 picture. And of course the other half of
00:08:16 --> 00:08:18 that is the dark matter which is
00:08:18 --> 00:08:19 something that we believe holds galaxies
00:08:19 --> 00:08:22 together and holds clusters of galaxies
00:08:22 --> 00:08:24 together uh which is invisible and
00:08:24 --> 00:08:27 undetectable except by its gravity. two
00:08:27 --> 00:08:30 big problems for modern cosmology. So,
00:08:30 --> 00:08:33 uh, Professor Leu thinks that he's
00:08:33 --> 00:08:36 solved both of these with a theory that,
00:08:36 --> 00:08:38 um, it's it's got a name. I can't
00:08:38 --> 00:08:42 remember what it is. Uh, it's his his
00:08:42 --> 00:08:45 paper, uh, is entitled, uh, I can't find
00:08:46 --> 00:08:48 the title of his paper. I, it's
00:08:48 --> 00:08:50 something like getting rid of dark
00:08:50 --> 00:08:52 matter and dark energy.
00:08:52 --> 00:08:56 Um it's um basically
00:08:56 --> 00:08:59 um uh the idea exactly as you've said is
00:08:59 --> 00:09:02 that you instead of having one big
00:09:02 --> 00:09:06 bang you you have several little ones
00:09:06 --> 00:09:10 that sort of um every time you get one
00:09:10 --> 00:09:13 they uh you know it sort of restarts
00:09:13 --> 00:09:16 things in a in a odd way and that's the
00:09:16 --> 00:09:18 bit of this that I I have to say I don't
00:09:18 --> 00:09:22 understand um because we have such great
00:09:22 --> 00:09:24 evidence that there's only been one big
00:09:24 --> 00:09:26 bang and that is the fact that we still
00:09:26 --> 00:09:28 see it the cosmic microwave background
00:09:28 --> 00:09:31 radiation. Yeah. Wouldn't that wouldn't
00:09:31 --> 00:09:33 that just wipe his theory out
00:09:33 --> 00:09:36 instantaneously? Well, and unless um he
00:09:36 --> 00:09:38 sus he suggests that you get a you know
00:09:38 --> 00:09:40 a new microwave background radiation
00:09:40 --> 00:09:41 every time there's one of these mini big
00:09:42 --> 00:09:45 bangs. But that that actually flies in
00:09:45 --> 00:09:49 the face of the uh research the
00:09:49 --> 00:09:51 observations that professor Leu is
00:09:51 --> 00:09:54 suggesting that we do to detect these
00:09:54 --> 00:09:58 multiple big bangs. Um I think uh the
00:09:58 --> 00:10:00 cosmic microwave background radiation is
00:10:00 --> 00:10:03 a showstopper for this. And the reason
00:10:03 --> 00:10:08 is um when we look out into space we see
00:10:08 --> 00:10:12 uh progressively uh objects most notably
00:10:12 --> 00:10:14 galaxies at different red shifts there
00:10:14 --> 00:10:16 increasing red shift. It's the red shift
00:10:16 --> 00:10:18 is the uh the move of the of the light
00:10:18 --> 00:10:21 to the red end of the spectrum. It's uh
00:10:21 --> 00:10:23 what we measure. We believe it's
00:10:23 --> 00:10:25 happening because space is expanding. Uh
00:10:26 --> 00:10:28 that stretches the light waves and gives
00:10:28 --> 00:10:30 you the red shift. And if you look at a
00:10:30 --> 00:10:32 high enough red shift, what do you see?
00:10:32 --> 00:10:35 You see the big bang. You see the cosmic
00:10:35 --> 00:10:37 microwave background radiation, the
00:10:37 --> 00:10:39 flash of the big bang, uh when it became
00:10:39 --> 00:10:41 from when the universe became
00:10:41 --> 00:10:43 transparent about 380 years after
00:10:43 --> 00:10:46 the big bang event. Now what professor
00:10:46 --> 00:10:49 Louu is saying is that you could test
00:10:49 --> 00:10:53 his theory by looking for as you look
00:10:53 --> 00:10:56 back in time in other words increasing
00:10:56 --> 00:11:00 red shifts look for jumps in red shift
00:11:00 --> 00:11:04 um which you know it might mean uh that
00:11:04 --> 00:11:06 that you if if you're looking along a
00:11:06 --> 00:11:08 particular line of sight you see all the
00:11:08 --> 00:11:11 galaxies along that line of sight you
00:11:11 --> 00:11:13 see them gradually increasing in red
00:11:13 --> 00:11:15 shift and then suddenly you see a jump
00:11:15 --> 00:11:18 in red shift uh which looks as though
00:11:18 --> 00:11:20 something's missing and what he's
00:11:20 --> 00:11:21 suggesting is that's where you get a
00:11:22 --> 00:11:26 mini big bang. Um but uh that as I said
00:11:26 --> 00:11:28 flies in the face of the cosmic micron
00:11:28 --> 00:11:29 radiation because that is at the most
00:11:29 --> 00:11:31 extreme red shift we can observe. It's
00:11:31 --> 00:11:34 at the red shift of about 1300. Uh uh
00:11:34 --> 00:11:36 because the universe has expanded by a
00:11:36 --> 00:11:39 factor similar to that in the time since
00:11:39 --> 00:11:42 since um since it became transparent
00:11:42 --> 00:11:45 which is what we can see. We can see the
00:11:45 --> 00:11:48 opaque universe at that great distance.
00:11:48 --> 00:11:50 So that's my take on it for what it's
00:11:50 --> 00:11:52 worth from a
00:11:52 --> 00:11:56 non-cossmologist. Uh but um it's causing
00:11:56 --> 00:12:01 interest. Um it's really um uh you know
00:12:01 --> 00:12:03 actually an interesting piece of work. I
00:12:04 --> 00:12:06 haven't looked at the original paper but
00:12:06 --> 00:12:08 um as you pointed out I think you found
00:12:08 --> 00:12:09 this one
00:12:09 --> 00:12:12 um Andrew uh this is on the the brighter
00:12:12 --> 00:12:15 side of news the website there's a
00:12:15 --> 00:12:18 lovely piece of pros at the end of that
00:12:18 --> 00:12:19 article which I'd love to read out to
00:12:19 --> 00:12:22 you uh quoting the brighter side of news
00:12:22 --> 00:12:24 instead of hunting for invisible
00:12:24 --> 00:12:26 ingredients i.e. dark matter and dark
00:12:26 --> 00:12:28 energy. Instead of hunting for invisible
00:12:28 --> 00:12:30 ingredients, scientists might start
00:12:30 --> 00:12:32 listening for the echoes of ancient
00:12:32 --> 00:12:35 unstoppable bursts, the hidden rhythms
00:12:35 --> 00:12:38 of a universe still in motion. Very
00:12:38 --> 00:12:41 poetic. Yeah. Very very uh I think the
00:12:41 --> 00:12:44 paper is titled are dark matter and dark
00:12:44 --> 00:12:48 energy omniresent. Yes, I I had that but
00:12:48 --> 00:12:50 I couldn't remember it. Yeah. Well,
00:12:50 --> 00:12:52 yeah. Why would you remember that? Yes.
00:12:52 --> 00:12:55 You know, so um watch this space. We'll
00:12:55 --> 00:12:59 um we'll see what other uh physicists
00:12:59 --> 00:13:01 and astronomers make of it. Uh and uh
00:13:01 --> 00:13:04 hopefully see a bit more. That's what I
00:13:04 --> 00:13:05 like about these papers is that
00:13:05 --> 00:13:07 everybody gets to read them and go,
00:13:07 --> 00:13:11 well, okay, I think that's wrong and
00:13:11 --> 00:13:13 this is why or I think that could be on
00:13:13 --> 00:13:15 the money and this is why, you know,
00:13:15 --> 00:13:18 everybody gets a say in it. So it gets
00:13:18 --> 00:13:20 bounced around like a Yes. Okay. Like a
00:13:20 --> 00:13:22 pinball
00:13:22 --> 00:13:24 until everyone seems to settle on some
00:13:24 --> 00:13:28 agreeable potential answer. Would that
00:13:28 --> 00:13:30 be right? Yeah, that's right. And it's a
00:13:30 --> 00:13:32 consensus. It's, you know, as as the
00:13:32 --> 00:13:34 scientific consensus emerges. Uh that's
00:13:34 --> 00:13:38 what we then regard as um as the
00:13:38 --> 00:13:39 standard model, if I can put it that
00:13:40 --> 00:13:44 way. Uh but but um often like some of
00:13:44 --> 00:13:46 the this this particular work is going
00:13:46 --> 00:13:49 to take a lot to verify it. um and
00:13:49 --> 00:13:52 looking for red shift steps might be uh
00:13:52 --> 00:13:55 one way of doing it. Uh and and in fact
00:13:55 --> 00:13:57 I was going to mention this that is not
00:13:57 --> 00:14:00 new. Um I remember back in the 70s uh
00:14:00 --> 00:14:02 when I was working at the Royal
00:14:02 --> 00:14:05 Observatory in Edinburgh uh one of my
00:14:05 --> 00:14:07 colleagues was looking for what he
00:14:07 --> 00:14:09 called quantized red shifts. Red shifts
00:14:09 --> 00:14:11 that appeared in groups among the
00:14:11 --> 00:14:15 galaxies. uh which which is the sort of
00:14:15 --> 00:14:16 thing that you might expect professor
00:14:16 --> 00:14:19 Lou's research to throw up. He didn't
00:14:19 --> 00:14:21 find them. The the person who was my
00:14:21 --> 00:14:23 colleague at Edinburgh, he did he never
00:14:23 --> 00:14:25 found them. So, but that was of course
00:14:25 --> 00:14:27 with 1970s technology. We have moved on
00:14:27 --> 00:14:30 a very very long way since then. Just a
00:14:30 --> 00:14:32 just a little bit. That's right. I'm
00:14:32 --> 00:14:34 sure we'll hear more about this story as
00:14:34 --> 00:14:36 people analyze his theory. So, we'll
00:14:36 --> 00:14:38 keep an eye on that. And as Fred said,
00:14:38 --> 00:14:41 it's available for you to read on the
00:14:41 --> 00:14:44 bright side. news
00:14:44 --> 00:14:46 website. Let me tell you a little bit
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00:16:04 --> 00:16:06 all your exposed personal information
00:16:06 --> 00:16:10 from anywhere uh Google results, public
00:16:10 --> 00:16:12 websites uh and companies who collect
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00:16:23 --> 00:16:26 reclaiming your info even from the most
00:16:26 --> 00:16:29 challenging data broker uh through opt-
00:16:29 --> 00:16:32 out processes. So, uh you know, it's a
00:16:32 --> 00:16:34 great product. It's fabulous and all you
00:16:34 --> 00:16:38 have to do is go to a special URL and
00:16:38 --> 00:16:40 sign up and start removing yourself from
00:16:40 --> 00:16:43 the internet now or you know the places
00:16:43 --> 00:16:47 you don't want to be basically. So it's
00:16:47 --> 00:16:50 incogn.com/spacenuts
00:16:50 --> 00:16:52 incogn.com/spacenuts then just click on
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00:17:15 --> 00:17:18 through incogn and if you sign up for uh
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00:17:21 --> 00:17:24 don't forget that 30day money back
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00:17:29 --> 00:17:34 anytime. Don't forget that.
00:17:34 --> 00:17:36 incogn.com/spacenuts. Now, back to the
00:17:36 --> 00:17:40 show. G and I feel space nuts. Now,
00:17:40 --> 00:17:42 Fred, let's uh move on to another story
00:17:42 --> 00:17:46 that we've uh looked at uh many times
00:17:46 --> 00:17:48 and that is Planet 9. Although this is
00:17:48 --> 00:17:51 probably not about planet 9, but they
00:17:51 --> 00:17:55 have been looking at uh data that
00:17:55 --> 00:17:59 suggests there is an outer planet
00:17:59 --> 00:18:01 further out than they think where planet
00:18:01 --> 00:18:03 nine should be. So this could was this
00:18:03 --> 00:18:07 is this planet 10 or 9.5 or what? I
00:18:07 --> 00:18:08 think they're calling it 8 and a half.
00:18:08 --> 00:18:11 Um because we've got Yes, this is not
00:18:11 --> 00:18:14 planet 9. That's that that is planet
00:18:14 --> 00:18:18 8.5. Right. Okay. Um, so what's the
00:18:18 --> 00:18:21 story? So, um, well, let's scan
00:18:21 --> 00:18:27 backwards to, um, uh, 200 2016, I think
00:18:27 --> 00:18:29 it was. Yeah, 2016 when two US
00:18:29 --> 00:18:31 astronomers,
00:18:31 --> 00:18:35 uh, basically puts out a paper
00:18:35 --> 00:18:37 suggesting that the fact that we've got
00:18:37 --> 00:18:40 all these uh, um, distant asteroid
00:18:40 --> 00:18:42 orbits, these are objects, trans
00:18:42 --> 00:18:44 neptunian objects, objects that are
00:18:44 --> 00:18:46 beyond the orbit of Neptune. uh and in
00:18:46 --> 00:18:48 fact some of them are what called
00:18:48 --> 00:18:51 extreme trans neptunian objects objects
00:18:51 --> 00:18:53 a long way beyond the orbit of Neptune
00:18:53 --> 00:18:56 whose orbits are highly uh elliptical
00:18:56 --> 00:18:58 they're very very elongated but they
00:18:58 --> 00:19:01 seem to line up um the the you know the
00:19:01 --> 00:19:03 elongated orbits seem to line up and
00:19:03 --> 00:19:04 they suggested that was because there's
00:19:04 --> 00:19:06 a planet out there that we haven't
00:19:06 --> 00:19:08 found. They call it planet 9. They think
00:19:08 --> 00:19:10 it's probably 10 times the mass of the
00:19:10 --> 00:19:12 earth. Um what you might call a super
00:19:12 --> 00:19:15 earth or or a sub neptune. those are the
00:19:15 --> 00:19:18 planets that are kind of common in other
00:19:18 --> 00:19:20 solar systems but are missing in our
00:19:20 --> 00:19:22 solar system. Uh so it it sort of fit
00:19:22 --> 00:19:26 fit the bill. Uh lots of uh lots of
00:19:26 --> 00:19:29 enthusiasm for this but also again lots
00:19:29 --> 00:19:31 of controversy. Um I think I probably
00:19:31 --> 00:19:33 mentioned to you the beginning of last
00:19:34 --> 00:19:36 year was it? I think yes. Um when I was
00:19:36 --> 00:19:38 in Canada I spoke to a planetary
00:19:38 --> 00:19:40 scientist there who said planet 9 is
00:19:40 --> 00:19:43 rubbish. uh and uh that was somebody who
00:19:43 --> 00:19:46 was um well tuned with um you know with
00:19:46 --> 00:19:49 the uh with the with the the science. Uh
00:19:49 --> 00:19:54 anyway, we now have a uh a new theory or
00:19:54 --> 00:19:57 sorry some new observations uh which
00:19:57 --> 00:20:00 come from astronomers in Taiwan, Japan
00:20:00 --> 00:20:02 and here in Australia. Yeah. Uh and what
00:20:02 --> 00:20:05 they've done is they've looked through
00:20:05 --> 00:20:09 archival images from two infrared
00:20:09 --> 00:20:12 satellites. One was called IRAS which I
00:20:12 --> 00:20:15 remember well. It was a NASA uh
00:20:15 --> 00:20:17 Netherlands UK satellite dating from
00:20:17 --> 00:20:20 1983. Um a very very productive
00:20:20 --> 00:20:23 satellite, infrared astronomy satellite.
00:20:23 --> 00:20:26 That's what the the abbreviation was. Uh
00:20:26 --> 00:20:28 and Aari which was a kind of Japanese
00:20:28 --> 00:20:30 equivalent which was launched quite a
00:20:30 --> 00:20:34 long time later in 2006. And that that
00:20:34 --> 00:20:36 means excuse me both these satellites
00:20:36 --> 00:20:37 surveyed the
00:20:37 --> 00:20:42 sky. Excuse my frog in my throat. Um but
00:20:42 --> 00:20:45 um they are um you know they're doing it
00:20:45 --> 00:20:48 at two completely different times which
00:20:48 --> 00:20:52 are 25ish years apart. Yeah. And so what
00:20:52 --> 00:20:54 that means is that if there's something
00:20:54 --> 00:20:57 deep in the solar system that is slowly
00:20:57 --> 00:21:00 moving uh you will you might be able to
00:21:00 --> 00:21:03 pick it up pick up its motion on these
00:21:04 --> 00:21:06 sets of images that were taken so far
00:21:06 --> 00:21:09 apart in time. Uh that's what they
00:21:09 --> 00:21:11 found. They basically had two million
00:21:11 --> 00:21:14 objects in the two cataloges. Um and
00:21:14 --> 00:21:17 they they got down to I think it was 13
00:21:17 --> 00:21:21 candidates um of of objects that moved
00:21:21 --> 00:21:24 slowly across the sky in the time. Uh
00:21:24 --> 00:21:27 and then they looked at each one by eye.
00:21:27 --> 00:21:28 Some of them probably turned out to be
00:21:28 --> 00:21:30 flaws in the data and things of that
00:21:30 --> 00:21:35 sort. Yeah. But one of them uh actually
00:21:35 --> 00:21:37 looked very promising. Uh because the
00:21:37 --> 00:21:41 the two observations um the Iras and
00:21:41 --> 00:21:43 Nicari observations separated by 20 odd
00:21:43 --> 00:21:46 years uh showed an object that had
00:21:46 --> 00:21:50 moved. Um but its color and its
00:21:50 --> 00:21:53 brightness were the same in both images.
00:21:53 --> 00:21:56 And so they are suspecting that that
00:21:56 --> 00:21:58 makes it the same object rather than you
00:21:58 --> 00:22:01 know two bits of dub data or something
00:22:01 --> 00:22:08 like that. Um now it's it's actually
00:22:08 --> 00:22:11 um something different from what planet
00:22:11 --> 00:22:15 9 has been suspected. Uh first of all
00:22:15 --> 00:22:19 this object if it is real goes around
00:22:19 --> 00:22:21 the sun in the opposite direction from
00:22:21 --> 00:22:24 everything else. Okay. uh it's tilted
00:22:24 --> 00:22:28 way over its orbits tilted at 120° which
00:22:28 --> 00:22:29 because it's more than 90° means it's
00:22:29 --> 00:22:33 going the wrong way round whereas planet
00:22:33 --> 00:22:37 9 uh the theory that was built around
00:22:37 --> 00:22:40 these extreme trans neptunian objects um
00:22:40 --> 00:22:42 that you know provided a model for
00:22:42 --> 00:22:45 planet 9 that really needed a very low
00:22:45 --> 00:22:49 orbit tilt 15 degrees or so uh in in
00:22:49 --> 00:22:51 order to do the the the stretching of
00:22:51 --> 00:22:53 these orbits or the alignment into these
00:22:53 --> 00:22:57 orbits. So the two uh scientists who
00:22:57 --> 00:22:59 were the original proposers of planet 9,
00:22:59 --> 00:23:02 Mike Brown and Constantin Constantin
00:23:02 --> 00:23:05 Batigan, uh they say, well, whatever
00:23:05 --> 00:23:10 this is, it's not planet 9. Um and it's
00:23:10 --> 00:23:12 it's but it may be something else.
00:23:12 --> 00:23:15 That's the uh the the inference that
00:23:15 --> 00:23:19 this thing may be real. uh and it uh
00:23:19 --> 00:23:23 clearly needs more data uh to determine
00:23:23 --> 00:23:25 whether it's a real object. Uh if it is,
00:23:25 --> 00:23:27 it might as exactly as we were said
00:23:27 --> 00:23:29 before might be planet 8 and a half or 9
00:23:29 --> 00:23:32 and a half. Um I guess the best bet uh
00:23:32 --> 00:23:34 for finding it is going to be when we
00:23:34 --> 00:23:38 get the Ver Rubin Observatory online um
00:23:38 --> 00:23:40 which is going to be uh towards the end
00:23:40 --> 00:23:45 of this year. uh and that is going to be
00:23:45 --> 00:23:48 able to look at the uh the southern sky
00:23:48 --> 00:23:50 which I think is where this object is. I
00:23:50 --> 00:23:51 can't remember what constellation it was
00:23:52 --> 00:23:54 in. Um it it they're but it's going to
00:23:54 --> 00:23:56 be able to look at the southern sky in
00:23:56 --> 00:23:59 much detail and it may find planet 9 or
00:23:59 --> 00:24:02 it may confirm planet 8 and a half or it
00:24:02 --> 00:24:04 may just tell us there's nothing out
00:24:04 --> 00:24:06 there at all. Uh so this is something
00:24:06 --> 00:24:08 that we're we're going to look forward
00:24:08 --> 00:24:10 to and you and I will talk about it I'm
00:24:10 --> 00:24:12 sure. Yeah. And then this has also
00:24:12 --> 00:24:16 created another issue because uh if this
00:24:16 --> 00:24:19 is a planet um beyond where planet 9
00:24:19 --> 00:24:22 should be. There is another theory that
00:24:22 --> 00:24:25 suggests that it will um basically
00:24:25 --> 00:24:27 eliminate the potential existence of
00:24:27 --> 00:24:29 planet 9 because they would interfere
00:24:29 --> 00:24:31 with each other and that and that's not
00:24:31 --> 00:24:34 evident in this data. That's correct.
00:24:34 --> 00:24:36 That's right. So yeah, you picked up on
00:24:36 --> 00:24:38 something I'd forgotten when I read the
00:24:38 --> 00:24:40 um I read the piece. That's right. It's
00:24:40 --> 00:24:45 uh um if if this is a real object uh
00:24:45 --> 00:24:47 it's it would not be compatible with
00:24:47 --> 00:24:49 there being a planet 9 uh which would
00:24:49 --> 00:24:51 actually be much nearer than this. This
00:24:51 --> 00:24:54 is thing is a long long way away uh
00:24:54 --> 00:24:56 right on the edge of the solar system if
00:24:56 --> 00:24:58 it's real uh and it would conflict with
00:24:58 --> 00:25:00 the idea of a planet 9. Yes. So, so it
00:25:00 --> 00:25:03 may be uh that this will if it turns out
00:25:03 --> 00:25:05 to be the right thing, if it turns out
00:25:05 --> 00:25:07 to be a real thing, then it might knock
00:25:07 --> 00:25:09 the planet 9 theory on the head
00:25:09 --> 00:25:11 altogether. But it's still just as
00:25:11 --> 00:25:13 exciting because it's it's it's a
00:25:13 --> 00:25:15 planet. Yeah, it it could be a planet.
00:25:15 --> 00:25:16 That's right. Could be a planet
00:25:16 --> 00:25:19 regardless. So, yeah, forget planet 9.
00:25:19 --> 00:25:22 Yeah, yeah, I got this. Whatever. Yeah,
00:25:22 --> 00:25:24 whatever it is. Yeah. Well, hopefully we
00:25:24 --> 00:25:27 can uh we can find that one. Uh they
00:25:27 --> 00:25:29 might end up calling it Planet 9 anyway
00:25:29 --> 00:25:31 because Well, that's what it'll be.
00:25:31 --> 00:25:34 That's what it'll be. Exactly. Yeah.
00:25:34 --> 00:25:36 It's really interesting. This one just
00:25:36 --> 00:25:40 keeps coming up this keeps on giving.
00:25:40 --> 00:25:43 Yeah, it does. Yeah. I love it. If you
00:25:43 --> 00:25:45 would like to read up on that, it's been
00:25:45 --> 00:25:48 published uh on the website
00:25:48 --> 00:25:50 science.org. This is Space Nuts with
00:25:50 --> 00:25:55 Andrew Dunley and Professor Fred Watson.
00:25:55 --> 00:25:58 Roger. You're allowed to here also space
00:25:58 --> 00:26:01 nuts. Now Fred, uh a few quick stories
00:26:01 --> 00:26:03 about various things uh that are
00:26:03 --> 00:26:07 happening mainly involving spacecraft or
00:26:07 --> 00:26:10 uh space missions or or lack of although
00:26:10 --> 00:26:12 the last story is more of a budget cut
00:26:12 --> 00:26:14 issue. But uh let's let's go back to
00:26:14 --> 00:26:17 1972 when the Soviet Union and the
00:26:17 --> 00:26:20 United States were um you know very
00:26:20 --> 00:26:23 heavily involved in the space race and
00:26:23 --> 00:26:26 the Soviet Union launched a a a
00:26:26 --> 00:26:28 spacecraft that was supposed to send a
00:26:28 --> 00:26:30 lander to
00:26:30 --> 00:26:34 Venus didn't quite make it and now now
00:26:34 --> 00:26:36 it's going to it's probably going to
00:26:36 --> 00:26:38 crash back down to Earth. That's right.
00:26:38 --> 00:26:41 So Cosmos 482 uh was the name of the
00:26:41 --> 00:26:43 mission. Um, and it was on its way to
00:26:43 --> 00:26:46 Venus. You're absolutely right. Uh, but
00:26:46 --> 00:26:50 apparently, uh, one of the final stages
00:26:50 --> 00:26:53 in the rocket, the upper stage, uh, the
00:26:53 --> 00:26:57 the booster basically malfunctioned. Uh,
00:26:57 --> 00:27:00 and so the spacecraft, uh, went into
00:27:00 --> 00:27:01 orbit around the Earth. It's probably
00:27:01 --> 00:27:03 quite a big orbit. Not sure of its
00:27:03 --> 00:27:07 dimensions. Uh but um it's uh so it's
00:27:08 --> 00:27:09 been in orbit around the earth for the
00:27:10 --> 00:27:15 last 50 53 years. Yeah. Uh and that time
00:27:15 --> 00:27:18 has now come when its orbit is decaying.
00:27:18 --> 00:27:22 Uh and uh it looks as though uh it is
00:27:22 --> 00:27:26 going to re-enter uh the earth's um
00:27:26 --> 00:27:27 atmosphere.
00:27:27 --> 00:27:31 uh and with actually a prediction uh for
00:27:31 --> 00:27:34 its entry uh almost as soon as the end
00:27:34 --> 00:27:37 of this week. Yeah. Um it's and it
00:27:38 --> 00:27:40 that's very hard to predict because uh
00:27:40 --> 00:27:44 it is uh it's uncontrolled. It doesn't
00:27:44 --> 00:27:46 have uh you know it doesn't have any um
00:27:46 --> 00:27:49 any sort of way of being being directed
00:27:49 --> 00:27:51 as to where it will reenter the
00:27:51 --> 00:27:54 atmosphere. Uh so it'll come down uh in
00:27:54 --> 00:27:57 a random place and as you mentioned um
00:27:57 --> 00:28:01 uh earlier on it's uh it's dangerous in
00:28:01 --> 00:28:03 a sense because this spacecraft was
00:28:03 --> 00:28:06 designed to penetrate the atmosphere of
00:28:06 --> 00:28:09 Venus. Uh and Venus's atmosphere is much
00:28:09 --> 00:28:13 thicker than our atmosphere. Uh it's uh
00:28:13 --> 00:28:15 now it would have been a a controlled
00:28:15 --> 00:28:17 entry into the atmosphere of Venus. It
00:28:17 --> 00:28:18 would have had breaking rockets to slow
00:28:18 --> 00:28:20 it down. uh which it doesn't have coming
00:28:20 --> 00:28:22 into the Earth's atmosphere. But it does
00:28:22 --> 00:28:25 mean uh that there might be bits of this
00:28:25 --> 00:28:29 capsule uh which will actually survive
00:28:29 --> 00:28:32 re-entry and could land on the ground.
00:28:32 --> 00:28:36 Uh it's um it's one to watch, I think,
00:28:36 --> 00:28:39 is this because we could see a headline
00:28:39 --> 00:28:41 that this piece of ancient space junk
00:28:41 --> 00:28:43 has landed in somebody's paddock
00:28:43 --> 00:28:46 or still landed on somebody's house. uh
00:28:46 --> 00:28:49 and um and will will probably cause
00:28:49 --> 00:28:51 global news. So, look out for news on
00:28:51 --> 00:28:53 that within the next few days. It might
00:28:53 --> 00:28:56 create one heck of a fireball. It could.
00:28:56 --> 00:28:58 Yes, that's right. Yeah, it could as it
00:28:58 --> 00:29:01 comes down. But we don't know we we
00:29:01 --> 00:29:03 don't know where it might land at this
00:29:03 --> 00:29:07 stage. It's it's one of these um very
00:29:07 --> 00:29:09 unpredict unpredictable scenarios. So,
00:29:09 --> 00:29:12 it yeah, it could just land anywhere. I
00:29:12 --> 00:29:13 mean, odds are it's going to miss
00:29:13 --> 00:29:15 something significant. It's just
00:29:15 --> 00:29:18 probably going to land in probably water
00:29:18 --> 00:29:19 would be most likely one. Well, that
00:29:19 --> 00:29:22 that's correct because water is what
00:29:22 --> 00:29:25 covers most of the Earth. 70% or 75%.
00:29:26 --> 00:29:28 That's right. Uh and that's sort of
00:29:28 --> 00:29:30 tends to be what happens with
00:29:30 --> 00:29:32 re-entering space debris. Most of it
00:29:32 --> 00:29:35 goes into into the ocean. Yeah. But the
00:29:35 --> 00:29:37 they go on to say that the risk of
00:29:37 --> 00:29:38 something getting hit is not
00:29:38 --> 00:29:41 particularly high, but not zero. That's
00:29:41 --> 00:29:43 right. That's correct. But that I guess
00:29:43 --> 00:29:45 that's always the case with anything
00:29:45 --> 00:29:47 coming through the atmosphere. So yes,
00:29:47 --> 00:29:49 watch with interest. Keep your eye on
00:29:49 --> 00:29:52 the sky. Uh that story in
00:29:52 --> 00:29:55 spaceaily.com. Uh let's move on to our
00:29:55 --> 00:29:57 next story. This is really exciting
00:29:57 --> 00:30:00 news. Uh Loheed Martin has finished uh
00:30:00 --> 00:30:02 the Orion capsule which is going to be
00:30:02 --> 00:30:04 put on top of Arteimus
00:30:04 --> 00:30:08 2. Indeed. That's right. Uh for launch
00:30:08 --> 00:30:11 next year. And Artimus 2 will uh will
00:30:11 --> 00:30:14 carry four astronauts. Uh and in a in a
00:30:14 --> 00:30:18 repeat mission of Arteimus 1 uh which
00:30:18 --> 00:30:20 was um
00:30:20 --> 00:30:22 basically going to the moon and back
00:30:22 --> 00:30:24 going into a very elongated orbit around
00:30:24 --> 00:30:27 the moon and then coming back to earth
00:30:27 --> 00:30:29 re-entering and landing back on Earth.
00:30:29 --> 00:30:30 That was all done as a dress rehe dress
00:30:30 --> 00:30:32 rehearsal. It's I think it's two years
00:30:32 --> 00:30:35 ago now. Yeah, it would be time since um
00:30:35 --> 00:30:38 and uh it worked flawlessly actually.
00:30:38 --> 00:30:39 Everything worked very well after a few
00:30:39 --> 00:30:42 hiccups on the launch pad. Uh, so
00:30:42 --> 00:30:44 Artimus 2 is the same thing, but will
00:30:44 --> 00:30:47 carry a crew. I think the capsule has
00:30:47 --> 00:30:49 been I think it's had some upgrades from
00:30:49 --> 00:30:52 the original planned one. Yeah, I think
00:30:52 --> 00:30:55 they I think they put a toilet in it.
00:30:55 --> 00:30:58 That would be very good if they did. Um
00:30:58 --> 00:31:01 the these are well we've got a quote
00:31:01 --> 00:31:02 here that uh comes from one of the
00:31:02 --> 00:31:06 Loheed Martin uh techni uh engineers to
00:31:06 --> 00:31:07 support the health and safety of the
00:31:07 --> 00:31:09 crew. This new systems have been added
00:31:09 --> 00:31:12 which include life support air water
00:31:12 --> 00:31:14 thermal control waste management as you
00:31:14 --> 00:31:16 said uh displays and controls audio
00:31:16 --> 00:31:18 communications an exercise machine and a
00:31:18 --> 00:31:21 fully functional launch abort system uh
00:31:21 --> 00:31:24 and so and lots and lots of other bells
00:31:24 --> 00:31:27 and whistles on it. Um, and so there'll
00:31:27 --> 00:31:29 be a lot of work now to kind of get the
00:31:29 --> 00:31:32 thing ready for launch next year. But
00:31:32 --> 00:31:36 yes, Artimus is on track for Arteimus 2,
00:31:36 --> 00:31:39 uh, flying very soon. Yeah. And they
00:31:39 --> 00:31:41 will carry astronauts this time. This
00:31:41 --> 00:31:43 will be a human mission and they're
00:31:43 --> 00:31:46 going to go way past the moon like the
00:31:46 --> 00:31:48 first mission. Yes. Will this be a
00:31:48 --> 00:31:50 record as to the furthest people have
00:31:50 --> 00:31:53 been out? It will indeed. That's right.
00:31:53 --> 00:31:54 It's going to be the uh you know it's
00:31:54 --> 00:31:56 going to be the furthest from Earth that
00:31:56 --> 00:31:59 any human has ventured. So that's Yes.
00:31:59 --> 00:32:02 Yeah. At the moment I think that record
00:32:02 --> 00:32:04 is held by Michael Collins because he
00:32:04 --> 00:32:08 was by himself, wasn't he? In um uh the
00:32:08 --> 00:32:12 um Apollo 11 Apollo 11.
00:32:12 --> 00:32:14 Yeah. Uh that might be right. I mean all
00:32:14 --> 00:32:18 the Apollo astronauts the um the what
00:32:18 --> 00:32:20 was it? It was the capsule commander I
00:32:20 --> 00:32:24 think. uh were left in orbit around the
00:32:24 --> 00:32:27 moon. Uh I don't know. And so some of
00:32:27 --> 00:32:29 those orbits might have been higher than
00:32:29 --> 00:32:32 others. Yeah. But yeah, I just it rings
00:32:32 --> 00:32:33 a bell, I think. I think that's true,
00:32:34 --> 00:32:35 right? Yeah. I'm sure I'll be corrected.
00:32:35 --> 00:32:38 I could look it up, but um yeah, might
00:32:38 --> 00:32:40 bother. We've got Space Not listeners.
00:32:40 --> 00:32:42 That's right. They're very quick to
00:32:42 --> 00:32:44 correct us. Absolutely. But this is all
00:32:44 --> 00:32:46 exciting news and it looks Yeah, they're
00:32:46 --> 00:32:49 looking at uh was it April next year or
00:32:49 --> 00:32:51 launch?
00:32:51 --> 00:32:53 So everything on schedule at the moment
00:32:53 --> 00:32:56 but uh this is a another example of the
00:32:56 --> 00:32:58 collaborative effort to put these
00:32:58 --> 00:33:01 missions together. It's um uh you know
00:33:01 --> 00:33:04 Loheed Martin's just one company. Uh I
00:33:04 --> 00:33:07 think Airbus is involved in this as
00:33:07 --> 00:33:11 well. Uh and um so many others. So uh we
00:33:11 --> 00:33:13 will uh we'll watch watch with interest.
00:33:13 --> 00:33:14 I'm kind of glad they put that life
00:33:14 --> 00:33:16 support system in. That would probably
00:33:16 --> 00:33:19 be useful. It might be. Yes, it might be
00:33:19 --> 00:33:22 helpful. Indeed, you can find plenty of
00:33:22 --> 00:33:24 stories uh that talk about that
00:33:24 --> 00:33:26 particular mission online if you care to
00:33:26 --> 00:33:29 search. One final thing, Fred, and this
00:33:29 --> 00:33:33 is probably not good news, and that is a
00:33:33 --> 00:33:36 potential budget cuts uh that will hit
00:33:36 --> 00:33:39 NASA pretty hard. Very hard. Yeah. If
00:33:39 --> 00:33:42 it's So, this is the the White House's
00:33:42 --> 00:33:44 proposed federal spending budget for
00:33:44 --> 00:33:46 2026.
00:33:46 --> 00:33:50 uh and there's cuts in many many areas
00:33:50 --> 00:33:56 but uh NASA uh have actually taken the
00:33:56 --> 00:33:58 brunt of this with a cut facing a
00:33:58 --> 00:34:01 possible cut has to be has to be
00:34:01 --> 00:34:03 approved clearly uh but it's
00:34:03 --> 00:34:07 24.3% uh coming down from 24.8 billion
00:34:07 --> 00:34:10 uh in this financial year to 18.8 8
00:34:10 --> 00:34:13 billion in the next financial year. And
00:34:13 --> 00:34:15 of course, so many of NASA's programs
00:34:15 --> 00:34:18 are very very sensitive uh to funding.
00:34:18 --> 00:34:20 Many of them are on shoestring budgets,
00:34:20 --> 00:34:23 you know, like keeping the Voyagers uh
00:34:23 --> 00:34:27 uh in touch uh and the Deep Space
00:34:27 --> 00:34:29 programs, all of that, possible future
00:34:29 --> 00:34:34 missions for New Horizons. That's uh all
00:34:34 --> 00:34:36 you have to worry about the future of
00:34:36 --> 00:34:40 them. Uh what's perhaps more significant
00:34:40 --> 00:34:43 and uh and you know I can see sort of
00:34:43 --> 00:34:45 where this is going is we've just been
00:34:45 --> 00:34:47 talking about Artemis. Uh the current
00:34:47 --> 00:34:50 Arteimus program has I think five uh
00:34:50 --> 00:34:53 missions um which the last ones would
00:34:53 --> 00:34:56 have um you know would have the gateway
00:34:56 --> 00:35:00 uh the gateway um uh uh space station in
00:35:00 --> 00:35:03 orbit around the moon. uh the basically
00:35:03 --> 00:35:07 the uh the the cuts would bring the
00:35:07 --> 00:35:09 Arteimus mission to an end after
00:35:09 --> 00:35:12 Arteimus 3. Gateway would be cancelled
00:35:12 --> 00:35:15 uh and those later Arteimus landings
00:35:15 --> 00:35:20 would be cancelled as well. Uh and um
00:35:20 --> 00:35:24 the the the the sort of load on lunar
00:35:24 --> 00:35:27 exploration would then be taken by the
00:35:27 --> 00:35:29 private sector. That's the idea that you
00:35:29 --> 00:35:31 get the private sector to do it, which
00:35:31 --> 00:35:34 probably means SpaceX and Blue Origin
00:35:34 --> 00:35:38 and companies like that. Um, and so, uh,
00:35:38 --> 00:35:40 it's it would be a remarkably big change
00:35:40 --> 00:35:43 to what's currently planned. So, the
00:35:43 --> 00:35:47 the, uh, the launch vehicles for Artemis
00:35:47 --> 00:35:49 are the space launch system SLS, which
00:35:49 --> 00:35:53 uses recycled um shuttle components, uh,
00:35:53 --> 00:35:56 and the Orion capsule. Uh that's what
00:35:56 --> 00:35:57 we've just been talking about. The
00:35:57 --> 00:36:00 capsule will hold uh uh astronauts. Uh
00:36:00 --> 00:36:03 the idea would be to phase it out after
00:36:03 --> 00:36:06 the three flights after Artimus 3. So
00:36:06 --> 00:36:07 that includes the SLS as well. That
00:36:07 --> 00:36:11 would go Yeah. And what I found in
00:36:11 --> 00:36:14 regard like 24.3% funding cut that is a
00:36:14 --> 00:36:19 huge huge cut. It is. Um and and most of
00:36:19 --> 00:36:21 that will be felt in the space and earth
00:36:21 --> 00:36:23 science divisions of NASA. And when you
00:36:23 --> 00:36:25 look at what they do, space science
00:36:25 --> 00:36:27 division does helopysics, planetary
00:36:27 --> 00:36:29 science and astrophysics. And the earth
00:36:29 --> 00:36:32 science division uh looks at atmospheric
00:36:32 --> 00:36:34 sciences, oceanography, land sciences,
00:36:34 --> 00:36:37 cryossphere technology, biosphere
00:36:37 --> 00:36:39 technology. I would have thought they
00:36:39 --> 00:36:41 were pretty important areas, but yes.
00:36:41 --> 00:36:42 Yes, that's right. Yeah, they they could
00:36:42 --> 00:36:45 get hammered in this uh if this budget
00:36:45 --> 00:36:49 cut goes ahead. Uh do you think um Elon
00:36:49 --> 00:36:51 has sort of been saying to Mr. Trump,
00:36:51 --> 00:36:53 look, I can do this. You don't have to
00:36:53 --> 00:36:55 pay for that.
00:36:55 --> 00:36:57 I I couldn't possibly guess at the
00:36:57 --> 00:36:59 conversations that go between those two,
00:36:59 --> 00:37:02 but I wouldn't be surprised.
00:37:02 --> 00:37:04 Yeah, it's a it's a bit of a worry. I
00:37:04 --> 00:37:07 Someone else told me that um they've
00:37:07 --> 00:37:10 totally cut funding to um National
00:37:10 --> 00:37:13 Public Radio, NPS, which is that was the
00:37:13 --> 00:37:15 US equivalent to the ABC. So, I I heard
00:37:15 --> 00:37:18 that. Yeah. So, um that that's fairly
00:37:18 --> 00:37:20 tragic, I think, in the scheme of
00:37:20 --> 00:37:23 things. Yeah. So this this this these
00:37:23 --> 00:37:26 budget proposals uh have to go to the US
00:37:26 --> 00:37:29 Congress uh because they appropriate the
00:37:29 --> 00:37:33 funds um and it you know it's remains to
00:37:33 --> 00:37:35 be seen uh what happens after that. The
00:37:35 --> 00:37:38 Congress is fairly evenly balanced I
00:37:38 --> 00:37:40 think politically. So
00:37:40 --> 00:37:42 we'll see unlike unlike our new
00:37:42 --> 00:37:44 government that's just been elected
00:37:44 --> 00:37:46 because it's looking pretty lopsided at
00:37:46 --> 00:37:50 the moment. Uh yeah, quite a quite a
00:37:50 --> 00:37:53 quite a result that was. Um okay, thank
00:37:53 --> 00:37:55 you Fred. If you'd like to look into
00:37:55 --> 00:37:57 that story about the budget, potential
00:37:57 --> 00:38:00 budget cuts to NASA, spaceflight now.com
00:38:00 --> 00:38:03 is the website. Uh we're all done, Fred.
00:38:03 --> 00:38:05 Thank you. Uh it's been a pleasure. Uh
00:38:05 --> 00:38:08 always good to talk and uh to bring us
00:38:08 --> 00:38:10 ourselves up to date as well as
00:38:10 --> 00:38:11 everybody else on what's going on in the
00:38:11 --> 00:38:13 world of space and astronomy. Very true.
00:38:13 --> 00:38:15 All right. We'll catch you on the next
00:38:15 --> 00:38:17 episode. Thank you, Fred. Professor Fred
00:38:17 --> 00:38:19 Watson, astronomer at large. And uh we
00:38:19 --> 00:38:21 would say thanks to Hugh in the studio,
00:38:21 --> 00:38:24 but um he's not with us. Budget cuts and
00:38:24 --> 00:38:26 all. You know how it goes. Uh and don't
00:38:26 --> 00:38:27 forget to visit us on our website,
00:38:28 --> 00:38:30 social media, and please leave reviews
00:38:30 --> 00:38:33 on your favorite podcasting platform.
00:38:33 --> 00:38:35 Apparently, they're quite helpful. And
00:38:35 --> 00:38:36 from me, Andrew Dunley, thanks for your
00:38:36 --> 00:38:38 company. See you on the next episode of
00:38:38 --> 00:38:41 Space Nuts. Bye-bye. Space Nuts. You've
00:38:41 --> 00:38:45 been listening to the Space Nuts podcast
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