This episode is brought to by Incogni. ..removing your personal data online the easy and inexpensive way. To get the special Space Nuts listener deal with 30 day money back guarantee, go to www.incogni.com/spacenuts (https://www.incogni.com/spacenuts)
Exploring New Theories of the Big Bang and Beyond
In this episode of Space Nuts, host Andrew Dunkley is joined by the ever-knowledgeable Professor Fred Watson to discuss groundbreaking theories and discoveries in the realm of astronomy. They delve into a new hypothesis regarding the Big Bang, potential discoveries of outer planets, and the latest updates on space missions.
Episode Highlights:
- A New Perspective on the Big Bang: Andrew and Fred Watson dissect a provocative theory suggesting that instead of a singular Big Bang, there may have been multiple smaller bangs. This theory challenges existing notions about dark matter and dark energy, which have long puzzled cosmologists.
- The Search for Planet 8.5: The duo explores intriguing new data hinting at a potential outer planet, dubbed Planet 8.5, which may exist beyond the realm of the hypothesised Planet Nine. They discuss the implications of this discovery and what it could mean for our understanding of the solar system.
- Spacecraft News from the Past: A look back at the fate of Cosmos 482, a Russian spacecraft originally intended for Venus, which is now on a collision course back to Earth after 53 years in orbit. Andrew and Fred Watson discuss the unpredictable nature of space debris and the potential for dramatic re-entries.
- Updates on Artemis 2 and NASA Budget Cuts: The episode wraps up with exciting news about the completion of the Orion capsule for Artemis 2, set to carry astronauts on a lunar mission, juxtaposed with concerns over proposed budget cuts to NASA that could impact future space exploration efforts.
For more Space Nuts, including our continually updating newsfeed and to listen to all our episodes, visit our website. (https://www.spacenutspodcast.com/) Follow us on social media at SpaceNutsPod on Facebook, X, YouTube Music, Tumblr, Instagram, and TikTok. We love engaging with our community, so be sure to drop us a message or comment on your favourite platform.
If you’d like to help support Space Nuts and join our growing family of insiders for commercial-free episodes and more, visit spacenutspodcast.com/about (https://www.spacenutspodcast.com/about)
Stay curious, keep looking up, and join us next time for more stellar insights and cosmic wonders. Until then, clear skies and happy stargazing.
(00:00) Welcome to Space Nuts with Andrew Dunkley and Fred Watson Watson
(01:20) Discussion on a new theory regarding the Big Bang
(15:00) Exploring the potential discovery of Planet 8.5
(25:30) Fate of Cosmos 482 and space debris concerns
(35:00) Updates on Artemis 2 and NASA's budget challenges
For commercial-free versions of Space Nuts, join us on Patreon, Supercast, Apple Podcasts, or become a supporter here: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/space-nuts-astronomy-insights-cosmic-discoveries--2631155/support (https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/space-nuts-astronomy-insights-cosmic-discoveries--2631155/support?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=rss) .
Episode link: https://play.headliner.app/episode/27033979?utm_source=youtube
00:00:00 --> 00:00:02 Hi there. Thanks for joining us. This is
00:00:02 --> 00:00:04 Space Nuts. My name is Andrew Dunley.
00:00:04 --> 00:00:06 It's great to have your company yet
00:00:06 --> 00:00:09 again. Uh coming up on this episode, we
00:00:10 --> 00:00:12 will be looking at a new Big Bang
00:00:12 --> 00:00:15 theory, so to speak. Uh it's uh sort of
00:00:15 --> 00:00:17 wrapped up with dark matter and dark
00:00:17 --> 00:00:19 dark energy and all that dark and
00:00:19 --> 00:00:21 foroding stuff. So, we'll talk about
00:00:21 --> 00:00:25 that. Uh some other data is pointing to
00:00:25 --> 00:00:27 a potential outer planet and it may not
00:00:27 --> 00:00:30 be planet 9. or is it? We're not sure
00:00:30 --> 00:00:33 yet. We'll talk about that. And uh some
00:00:33 --> 00:00:35 space science stuff. Uh an old Russian
00:00:35 --> 00:00:38 spacecraft is headed back to Earth and
00:00:38 --> 00:00:39 unfortunately that's not where it was
00:00:40 --> 00:00:43 originally supposed to go back in 1972.
00:00:43 --> 00:00:46 Uh Artemus 2, an update on that. And a
00:00:46 --> 00:00:49 bit of a budget cut issue with NASA.
00:00:49 --> 00:00:51 That's all coming up on this episode of
00:00:51 --> 00:00:54 Space Nuts. 15 seconds. Guidance is
00:00:54 --> 00:00:59 internal. 10 9 ignition sequence start.
00:00:59 --> 00:01:05 Space nets 5 4 3 2 1 2 3 4 5 5 4 3 2 1
00:01:05 --> 00:01:08 Space Nuts astronauts report. It feels
00:01:08 --> 00:01:10 good. And it's good to see Professor
00:01:10 --> 00:01:12 Fred Watson again joining us on this
00:01:12 --> 00:01:14 episode of Space Nuts. Hi Fred. Hello
00:01:14 --> 00:01:17 Andrew. Very good to see you too. You're
00:01:17 --> 00:01:19 looking hail and hearty I have to say.
00:01:19 --> 00:01:20 Yes. I've got I've got a new background.
00:01:20 --> 00:01:23 You like my new office? I do. Yes. my
00:01:23 --> 00:01:26 new virtual office. It's um it's saying
00:01:26 --> 00:01:28 a lot of hell's at the moment. It is.
00:01:28 --> 00:01:31 It's got a hello. And if I put my hands
00:01:31 --> 00:01:33 in the right place, they're invisible.
00:01:33 --> 00:01:37 Yes. In fact, if I go Yeah. If I move
00:01:37 --> 00:01:39 around, I I go invisible. You do? Yes.
00:01:39 --> 00:01:41 Yes. You went invisible a minute or two
00:01:41 --> 00:01:42 ago, and I thought you'd rocketed into
00:01:42 --> 00:01:45 space. Never mind. Uh one day, no doubt
00:01:45 --> 00:01:48 you will. Now, you've been away, haven't
00:01:48 --> 00:01:51 you? We were over in Lord How Island uh
00:01:51 --> 00:01:54 which is an island uh some 150
00:01:54 --> 00:01:56 kilometers off of the coast of New South
00:01:56 --> 00:01:57 Wales. It's on the same latitude of Port
00:01:57 --> 00:02:00 McQuary. I used I used to
00:02:00 --> 00:02:03 broad island there. Yes. Yes, you did.
00:02:03 --> 00:02:06 Uh the the um I didn't actually have
00:02:06 --> 00:02:08 that much chance to talk to many of the
00:02:08 --> 00:02:09 locals in detail or else I would have
00:02:09 --> 00:02:11 asked them if they in fact I think I did
00:02:11 --> 00:02:12 ask one person whether they listened to
00:02:12 --> 00:02:15 you and they said yes. Uh but um yeah we
00:02:15 --> 00:02:17 we we were there for a dark sky
00:02:17 --> 00:02:21 festival. Uh uh Lord How is um working
00:02:22 --> 00:02:24 on the prospect of becoming Australia's
00:02:24 --> 00:02:27 first dark sky island. Uh which is like
00:02:27 --> 00:02:29 a dark sky park but it's an island. Uh
00:02:29 --> 00:02:31 I'm not giving away any secrets there
00:02:31 --> 00:02:33 but uh there are people working on that
00:02:33 --> 00:02:35 very enthusiastically and we wish them
00:02:35 --> 00:02:37 every success with it. Uh so one of this
00:02:37 --> 00:02:40 was a sort of kickoff festival with
00:02:40 --> 00:02:42 talks and presentations and um I took
00:02:42 --> 00:02:44 the old Gibson guitar and Money and I
00:02:44 --> 00:02:46 did a set in their music night. We did
00:02:46 --> 00:02:48 seven songs between us. That was Oh,
00:02:48 --> 00:02:50 cool. And I've done that for about 50
00:02:50 --> 00:02:54 years. And um and then um you know uh we
00:02:54 --> 00:02:57 did some uh experiments with a friend of
00:02:57 --> 00:03:00 ours uh uh Mariscaro uh launching
00:03:00 --> 00:03:03 rockets uh with which were fueled by
00:03:03 --> 00:03:06 vinegar and bicarbonate of soda. Um
00:03:06 --> 00:03:08 which meant we all ended up smelling of
00:03:08 --> 00:03:11 vinegar for the next four days. Uh and
00:03:11 --> 00:03:13 uh yeah, it went it went went very well.
00:03:13 --> 00:03:14 That was a a fun thing for the kids to
00:03:14 --> 00:03:16 do. So yeah, it was a good festival and
00:03:16 --> 00:03:18 it wound up on uh Thursday evening with
00:03:18 --> 00:03:21 a very nice meal uh cooked up by one of
00:03:21 --> 00:03:24 the top chefs on the island. So great.
00:03:24 --> 00:03:25 Fantastic. I haven't been to Lord How
00:03:25 --> 00:03:27 but we're going to going to have to get
00:03:27 --> 00:03:28 there. Yeah, you need to go. You do need
00:03:28 --> 00:03:32 to It's also uh the home of some unique
00:03:32 --> 00:03:35 wildlife. I believe there are. Yes. And
00:03:35 --> 00:03:38 particularly the Woodhen, uh which is
00:03:38 --> 00:03:40 ubiquitous. They had a program uh four
00:03:40 --> 00:03:42 or five years a three or four years ago
00:03:42 --> 00:03:44 I think it was to eliminate all the rats
00:03:44 --> 00:03:45 on the island which were eating the wood
00:03:46 --> 00:03:47 hens. Uh and that was quite
00:03:47 --> 00:03:49 controversial but it's worked and the
00:03:49 --> 00:03:54 wood hens are there in in remarkable uh
00:03:54 --> 00:03:58 uh prlivity. How's that? And they also
00:03:58 --> 00:04:00 have those quite rare stick insects on
00:04:00 --> 00:04:02 the is it on the spire? It's on balls
00:04:02 --> 00:04:04 pyramid. Gosh you're right there. Yeah,
00:04:04 --> 00:04:07 Ball's Pyramid 20 kilometers off Lord
00:04:07 --> 00:04:09 How. We had a very rough crossing to
00:04:09 --> 00:04:11 Ball's pyramid. We went cuz I always
00:04:11 --> 00:04:13 wanted to see it up close and personal.
00:04:13 --> 00:04:16 It's this stick of rock uh 500 m high.
00:04:16 --> 00:04:19 Uh and um remarkable and it, as you
00:04:19 --> 00:04:21 said, it does have I think it's the only
00:04:21 --> 00:04:24 place where these nocturnal stick
00:04:24 --> 00:04:25 insects are found. And they're actually
00:04:25 --> 00:04:28 quite big. I saw a photograph of one.
00:04:28 --> 00:04:29 Yeah, I remember that story breaking
00:04:30 --> 00:04:31 many years ago when they found them and
00:04:31 --> 00:04:34 they went, "Oh my goodness." Uh, didn't
00:04:34 --> 00:04:36 know they were here. That's right. Yeah.
00:04:36 --> 00:04:38 Incredible place. It is. It's amazing.
00:04:38 --> 00:04:40 So, um, what about you? How how's your
00:04:40 --> 00:04:42 week been? Uh, you're pretty quiet,
00:04:42 --> 00:04:44 actually. Just sort of settling back
00:04:44 --> 00:04:46 into normal life, even though that's
00:04:46 --> 00:04:47 going to be temporary. But I did want to
00:04:47 --> 00:04:49 show you something from our trip. Um, as
00:04:49 --> 00:04:51 you know, we went to San Francisco and
00:04:51 --> 00:04:54 San Francisco is the home of a big rock
00:04:54 --> 00:04:56 known as Alcatraz. Indeed. And you know,
00:04:56 --> 00:04:58 I like to collect souvenirs wherever I
00:04:58 --> 00:05:01 go, particularly particularly little
00:05:01 --> 00:05:03 rocks from different places. But this
00:05:03 --> 00:05:08 one's legal. There it is. Save the rock.
00:05:08 --> 00:05:11 Yeah. And inside that box, Yes. are two
00:05:11 --> 00:05:15 pieces two pieces of the cell block of
00:05:15 --> 00:05:17 Alcatraz, right? Cuz they're trying to
00:05:18 --> 00:05:20 do renovations to keep it going for
00:05:20 --> 00:05:22 future generations.
00:05:22 --> 00:05:24 And so as a part of the renovation
00:05:24 --> 00:05:27 process, they've had to demolish certain
00:05:27 --> 00:05:29 sections and um they're selling the rock
00:05:29 --> 00:05:31 to fund the renovations. The
00:05:31 --> 00:05:33 renovations. There you go. So I got two
00:05:33 --> 00:05:36 pieces of the cell wall from Alcatraz in
00:05:36 --> 00:05:37 my collection. You just can't see them
00:05:37 --> 00:05:41 as the uh the your your screen tries to
00:05:41 --> 00:05:42 wipe them out and make them part of the
00:05:42 --> 00:05:44 background. Yeah. If I tip it forward,
00:05:44 --> 00:05:47 it disappears. Can see them. So that's
00:05:47 --> 00:05:49 There they are. Oh, there they are. Yes.
00:05:49 --> 00:05:52 It's looking very uh very um penal penal
00:05:52 --> 00:05:55 connally. Yeah. This chunk of concrete,
00:05:55 --> 00:05:57 it says this chunk of concrete is a
00:05:57 --> 00:05:59 byproduct of a major rehabilitation
00:05:59 --> 00:06:02 effort now underway on the island. It's
00:06:02 --> 00:06:03 been inspected by park historic
00:06:03 --> 00:06:05 preservation specialists to be sure that
00:06:05 --> 00:06:08 it contains nothing of research
00:06:08 --> 00:06:11 potential. So, it's yeah, just looks
00:06:11 --> 00:06:12 like a piece of concrete, but it's
00:06:12 --> 00:06:14 actually a piece of Alcatraz and it's
00:06:14 --> 00:06:17 all mine. And uh interestingly um it's
00:06:18 --> 00:06:20 in the news at the moment, of course,
00:06:20 --> 00:06:22 because President Trump wants to
00:06:22 --> 00:06:25 reinstate it as a jail. Oh, does he? I
00:06:25 --> 00:06:28 didn't hear that one. Yeah. Uh it needs
00:06:28 --> 00:06:29 Well, I I'll tell him one thing for
00:06:29 --> 00:06:32 free. It needs work.
00:06:32 --> 00:06:35 It needs work. Um but it's only a
00:06:35 --> 00:06:37 15-minute trip to get over there. Yes,
00:06:37 --> 00:06:39 that's right. I haven't been to Pier 39.
00:06:39 --> 00:06:43 So, yeah, it's uh it's worth visiting,
00:06:43 --> 00:06:44 though. We better get down to the
00:06:44 --> 00:06:46 business of the day and that is
00:06:46 --> 00:06:48 astronomy and space science. And we'll
00:06:48 --> 00:06:50 start off with this story, Fred. A new
00:06:50 --> 00:06:54 theory on the Big Bang. Uh dark matter,
00:06:54 --> 00:06:56 dark energy, all of that stuff is rolled
00:06:56 --> 00:06:58 into this this uh paper that's been
00:06:58 --> 00:07:00 released uh through the University of
00:07:00 --> 00:07:04 Alabama in uh Huntsville. Um this is
00:07:04 --> 00:07:07 this is a a physics professor who's um
00:07:07 --> 00:07:08 come up with alternative theories in the
00:07:08 --> 00:07:10 past on other things.
00:07:10 --> 00:07:13 Um, this one though is probably going to
00:07:14 --> 00:07:16 get um pulled apart under the
00:07:16 --> 00:07:18 microscope. Uh, what he's suggesting is
00:07:18 --> 00:07:20 there might not have been one big bang,
00:07:20 --> 00:07:23 but lots of little bangs.
00:07:23 --> 00:07:27 That's right. Uh, exactly. And, um, uh,
00:07:27 --> 00:07:28 you know, you've you've described it
00:07:28 --> 00:07:31 perfectly. It's an a really interesting
00:07:31 --> 00:07:35 theory in that if you have lots of
00:07:35 --> 00:07:37 little bangs rather than one big one,
00:07:37 --> 00:07:39 apparently mathematically you can get
00:07:39 --> 00:07:41 rid of dark matter and dark energy which
00:07:41 --> 00:07:44 are of course the the two big problems
00:07:44 --> 00:07:47 in current cosmology. What are these? Um
00:07:47 --> 00:07:50 and just a bit of background there. Dark
00:07:50 --> 00:07:53 energy we think is the property of space
00:07:53 --> 00:07:56 uh that makes uh the expanding universe
00:07:56 --> 00:07:58 accelerate in its expansion. Uh although
00:07:58 --> 00:08:00 there's just we're just starting to see
00:08:00 --> 00:08:03 evidence that that might slow down that
00:08:03 --> 00:08:05 acceleration. Uh it looks as though it
00:08:05 --> 00:08:08 was uh more rapid uh five billion years
00:08:08 --> 00:08:11 ago than it is today. And that's you
00:08:11 --> 00:08:13 know new news I guess uh on the on the
00:08:13 --> 00:08:14 what you might call the conventional
00:08:14 --> 00:08:16 picture. And of course the other half of
00:08:16 --> 00:08:18 that is the dark matter which is
00:08:18 --> 00:08:19 something that we believe holds galaxies
00:08:19 --> 00:08:22 together and holds clusters of galaxies
00:08:22 --> 00:08:24 together uh which is invisible and
00:08:24 --> 00:08:27 undetectable except by its gravity. two
00:08:27 --> 00:08:30 big problems for modern cosmology. So,
00:08:30 --> 00:08:33 uh, Professor Leu thinks that he's
00:08:33 --> 00:08:36 solved both of these with a theory that,
00:08:36 --> 00:08:38 um, it's it's got a name. I can't
00:08:38 --> 00:08:42 remember what it is. Uh, it's his his
00:08:42 --> 00:08:45 paper, uh, is entitled, uh, I can't find
00:08:46 --> 00:08:48 the title of his paper. I, it's
00:08:48 --> 00:08:50 something like getting rid of dark
00:08:50 --> 00:08:52 matter and dark energy.
00:08:52 --> 00:08:56 Um it's um basically
00:08:56 --> 00:08:59 um uh the idea exactly as you've said is
00:08:59 --> 00:09:02 that you instead of having one big
00:09:02 --> 00:09:06 bang you you have several little ones
00:09:06 --> 00:09:10 that sort of um every time you get one
00:09:10 --> 00:09:13 they uh you know it sort of restarts
00:09:13 --> 00:09:16 things in a in a odd way and that's the
00:09:16 --> 00:09:18 bit of this that I I have to say I don't
00:09:18 --> 00:09:22 understand um because we have such great
00:09:22 --> 00:09:24 evidence that there's only been one big
00:09:24 --> 00:09:26 bang and that is the fact that we still
00:09:26 --> 00:09:28 see it the cosmic microwave background
00:09:28 --> 00:09:31 radiation. Yeah. Wouldn't that wouldn't
00:09:31 --> 00:09:33 that just wipe his theory out
00:09:33 --> 00:09:36 instantaneously? Well, and unless um he
00:09:36 --> 00:09:38 sus he suggests that you get a you know
00:09:38 --> 00:09:40 a new microwave background radiation
00:09:40 --> 00:09:41 every time there's one of these mini big
00:09:42 --> 00:09:45 bangs. But that that actually flies in
00:09:45 --> 00:09:49 the face of the uh research the
00:09:49 --> 00:09:51 observations that professor Leu is
00:09:51 --> 00:09:54 suggesting that we do to detect these
00:09:54 --> 00:09:58 multiple big bangs. Um I think uh the
00:09:58 --> 00:10:00 cosmic microwave background radiation is
00:10:00 --> 00:10:03 a showstopper for this. And the reason
00:10:03 --> 00:10:08 is um when we look out into space we see
00:10:08 --> 00:10:12 uh progressively uh objects most notably
00:10:12 --> 00:10:14 galaxies at different red shifts there
00:10:14 --> 00:10:16 increasing red shift. It's the red shift
00:10:16 --> 00:10:18 is the uh the move of the of the light
00:10:18 --> 00:10:21 to the red end of the spectrum. It's uh
00:10:21 --> 00:10:23 what we measure. We believe it's
00:10:23 --> 00:10:25 happening because space is expanding. Uh
00:10:26 --> 00:10:28 that stretches the light waves and gives
00:10:28 --> 00:10:30 you the red shift. And if you look at a
00:10:30 --> 00:10:32 high enough red shift, what do you see?
00:10:32 --> 00:10:35 You see the big bang. You see the cosmic
00:10:35 --> 00:10:37 microwave background radiation, the
00:10:37 --> 00:10:39 flash of the big bang, uh when it became
00:10:39 --> 00:10:41 from when the universe became
00:10:41 --> 00:10:43 transparent about 380 years after
00:10:43 --> 00:10:46 the big bang event. Now what professor
00:10:46 --> 00:10:49 Louu is saying is that you could test
00:10:49 --> 00:10:53 his theory by looking for as you look
00:10:53 --> 00:10:56 back in time in other words increasing
00:10:56 --> 00:11:00 red shifts look for jumps in red shift
00:11:00 --> 00:11:04 um which you know it might mean uh that
00:11:04 --> 00:11:06 that you if if you're looking along a
00:11:06 --> 00:11:08 particular line of sight you see all the
00:11:08 --> 00:11:11 galaxies along that line of sight you
00:11:11 --> 00:11:13 see them gradually increasing in red
00:11:13 --> 00:11:15 shift and then suddenly you see a jump
00:11:15 --> 00:11:18 in red shift uh which looks as though
00:11:18 --> 00:11:20 something's missing and what he's
00:11:20 --> 00:11:21 suggesting is that's where you get a
00:11:22 --> 00:11:26 mini big bang. Um but uh that as I said
00:11:26 --> 00:11:28 flies in the face of the cosmic micron
00:11:28 --> 00:11:29 radiation because that is at the most
00:11:29 --> 00:11:31 extreme red shift we can observe. It's
00:11:31 --> 00:11:34 at the red shift of about 1300. Uh uh
00:11:34 --> 00:11:36 because the universe has expanded by a
00:11:36 --> 00:11:39 factor similar to that in the time since
00:11:39 --> 00:11:42 since um since it became transparent
00:11:42 --> 00:11:45 which is what we can see. We can see the
00:11:45 --> 00:11:48 opaque universe at that great distance.
00:11:48 --> 00:11:50 So that's my take on it for what it's
00:11:50 --> 00:11:52 worth from a
00:11:52 --> 00:11:56 non-cossmologist. Uh but um it's causing
00:11:56 --> 00:12:01 interest. Um it's really um uh you know
00:12:01 --> 00:12:03 actually an interesting piece of work. I
00:12:04 --> 00:12:06 haven't looked at the original paper but
00:12:06 --> 00:12:08 um as you pointed out I think you found
00:12:08 --> 00:12:09 this one
00:12:09 --> 00:12:12 um Andrew uh this is on the the brighter
00:12:12 --> 00:12:15 side of news the website there's a
00:12:15 --> 00:12:18 lovely piece of pros at the end of that
00:12:18 --> 00:12:19 article which I'd love to read out to
00:12:19 --> 00:12:22 you uh quoting the brighter side of news
00:12:22 --> 00:12:24 instead of hunting for invisible
00:12:24 --> 00:12:26 ingredients i.e. dark matter and dark
00:12:26 --> 00:12:28 energy. Instead of hunting for invisible
00:12:28 --> 00:12:30 ingredients, scientists might start
00:12:30 --> 00:12:32 listening for the echoes of ancient
00:12:32 --> 00:12:35 unstoppable bursts, the hidden rhythms
00:12:35 --> 00:12:38 of a universe still in motion. Very
00:12:38 --> 00:12:41 poetic. Yeah. Very very uh I think the
00:12:41 --> 00:12:44 paper is titled are dark matter and dark
00:12:44 --> 00:12:48 energy omniresent. Yes, I I had that but
00:12:48 --> 00:12:50 I couldn't remember it. Yeah. Well,
00:12:50 --> 00:12:52 yeah. Why would you remember that? Yes.
00:12:52 --> 00:12:55 You know, so um watch this space. We'll
00:12:55 --> 00:12:59 um we'll see what other uh physicists
00:12:59 --> 00:13:01 and astronomers make of it. Uh and uh
00:13:01 --> 00:13:04 hopefully see a bit more. That's what I
00:13:04 --> 00:13:05 like about these papers is that
00:13:05 --> 00:13:07 everybody gets to read them and go,
00:13:07 --> 00:13:11 well, okay, I think that's wrong and
00:13:11 --> 00:13:13 this is why or I think that could be on
00:13:13 --> 00:13:15 the money and this is why, you know,
00:13:15 --> 00:13:18 everybody gets a say in it. So it gets
00:13:18 --> 00:13:20 bounced around like a Yes. Okay. Like a
00:13:20 --> 00:13:22 pinball
00:13:22 --> 00:13:24 until everyone seems to settle on some
00:13:24 --> 00:13:28 agreeable potential answer. Would that
00:13:28 --> 00:13:30 be right? Yeah, that's right. And it's a
00:13:30 --> 00:13:32 consensus. It's, you know, as as the
00:13:32 --> 00:13:34 scientific consensus emerges. Uh that's
00:13:34 --> 00:13:38 what we then regard as um as the
00:13:38 --> 00:13:39 standard model, if I can put it that
00:13:40 --> 00:13:44 way. Uh but but um often like some of
00:13:44 --> 00:13:46 the this this particular work is going
00:13:46 --> 00:13:49 to take a lot to verify it. um and
00:13:49 --> 00:13:52 looking for red shift steps might be uh
00:13:52 --> 00:13:55 one way of doing it. Uh and and in fact
00:13:55 --> 00:13:57 I was going to mention this that is not
00:13:57 --> 00:14:00 new. Um I remember back in the 70s uh
00:14:00 --> 00:14:02 when I was working at the Royal
00:14:02 --> 00:14:05 Observatory in Edinburgh uh one of my
00:14:05 --> 00:14:07 colleagues was looking for what he
00:14:07 --> 00:14:09 called quantized red shifts. Red shifts
00:14:09 --> 00:14:11 that appeared in groups among the
00:14:11 --> 00:14:15 galaxies. uh which which is the sort of
00:14:15 --> 00:14:16 thing that you might expect professor
00:14:16 --> 00:14:19 Lou's research to throw up. He didn't
00:14:19 --> 00:14:21 find them. The the person who was my
00:14:21 --> 00:14:23 colleague at Edinburgh, he did he never
00:14:23 --> 00:14:25 found them. So, but that was of course
00:14:25 --> 00:14:27 with 1970s technology. We have moved on
00:14:27 --> 00:14:30 a very very long way since then. Just a
00:14:30 --> 00:14:32 just a little bit. That's right. I'm
00:14:32 --> 00:14:34 sure we'll hear more about this story as
00:14:34 --> 00:14:36 people analyze his theory. So, we'll
00:14:36 --> 00:14:38 keep an eye on that. And as Fred said,
00:14:38 --> 00:14:41 it's available for you to read on the
00:14:41 --> 00:14:44 bright side. news
00:14:44 --> 00:14:46 website. Let me tell you a little bit
00:14:46 --> 00:14:49 about our sponsor, Incogn. And with so
00:14:49 --> 00:14:52 many scams available on the internet and
00:14:52 --> 00:14:54 so many people getting caught and so
00:14:54 --> 00:14:56 many hundreds of thousands of dollars
00:14:56 --> 00:14:59 being taken out of bank accounts and
00:14:59 --> 00:15:01 credit cards and who knows what, you
00:15:01 --> 00:15:04 really do want to be more v vigilant
00:15:04 --> 00:15:06 when you're online, especially with uh
00:15:06 --> 00:15:08 you know, private information. But how
00:15:08 --> 00:15:10 do you stop it from getting onto the
00:15:10 --> 00:15:12 dark web? How do you stop hackers from
00:15:12 --> 00:15:15 getting into your stuff? Well, uh the
00:15:15 --> 00:15:19 answer is incogn. And there's a special
00:15:19 --> 00:15:21 deal for you as a Space Nuts listener.
00:15:22 --> 00:15:24 Uh thanks to our sponsor, Incogn. Uh
00:15:24 --> 00:15:28 they're offering uh an exclusive 60%
00:15:28 --> 00:15:31 discount on Incogn. What will it do for
00:15:31 --> 00:15:33 you? Well, it'll reduce the amount of
00:15:33 --> 00:15:37 spam emails and spam calls that you get.
00:15:37 --> 00:15:39 It'll certainly lower the risk of
00:15:39 --> 00:15:41 identity theft and it will make your
00:15:41 --> 00:15:44 personal information much harder to find
00:15:44 --> 00:15:47 online. Uh, and they have a 30-day money
00:15:47 --> 00:15:50 back guarantee uh, with their product.
00:15:50 --> 00:15:53 And look, they do all the hard work for
00:15:53 --> 00:15:55 you. If you were to try and go online
00:15:55 --> 00:15:57 and clean out all your personal
00:15:57 --> 00:15:59 information, they reckon it would take
00:15:59 --> 00:16:01 you a couple of years. Why not just get
00:16:01 --> 00:16:04 someone else to do it for you? remove
00:16:04 --> 00:16:06 all your exposed personal information
00:16:06 --> 00:16:10 from anywhere uh Google results, public
00:16:10 --> 00:16:12 websites uh and companies who collect
00:16:12 --> 00:16:15 and sell data. You can do that and get
00:16:15 --> 00:16:18 rid of all of that with the incognit
00:16:18 --> 00:16:22 plan. They handle uh an unlimited amount
00:16:22 --> 00:16:23 of data removal requests for you,
00:16:23 --> 00:16:26 reclaiming your info even from the most
00:16:26 --> 00:16:29 challenging data broker uh through opt-
00:16:29 --> 00:16:32 out processes. So, uh you know, it's a
00:16:32 --> 00:16:34 great product. It's fabulous and all you
00:16:34 --> 00:16:38 have to do is go to a special URL and
00:16:38 --> 00:16:40 sign up and start removing yourself from
00:16:40 --> 00:16:43 the internet now or you know the places
00:16:43 --> 00:16:47 you don't want to be basically. So it's
00:16:47 --> 00:16:50 incogn.com/spacenuts
00:16:50 --> 00:16:52 incogn.com/spacenuts then just click on
00:16:52 --> 00:16:56 the button start removing now and you
00:16:56 --> 00:16:59 can check out all their plans. uh very
00:16:59 --> 00:17:02 very uh inexpensive uh you can do
00:17:02 --> 00:17:04 individual plans, unlimited plan of
00:17:04 --> 00:17:05 course which I've mentioned, standard
00:17:06 --> 00:17:10 plans, family plans um you know whatever
00:17:10 --> 00:17:12 suits you there'll be a uh an offer
00:17:12 --> 00:17:15 available as a space nuts listener
00:17:15 --> 00:17:18 through incogn and if you sign up for uh
00:17:18 --> 00:17:21 their annual package you'll save 60% and
00:17:21 --> 00:17:24 don't forget that 30day money back
00:17:24 --> 00:17:27 guarantee. It's
00:17:27 --> 00:17:29 incogn.com/spacenuts and you can cancel
00:17:29 --> 00:17:34 anytime. Don't forget that.
00:17:34 --> 00:17:36 incogn.com/spacenuts. Now, back to the
00:17:36 --> 00:17:40 show. G and I feel space nuts. Now,
00:17:40 --> 00:17:42 Fred, let's uh move on to another story
00:17:42 --> 00:17:46 that we've uh looked at uh many times
00:17:46 --> 00:17:48 and that is Planet 9. Although this is
00:17:48 --> 00:17:51 probably not about planet 9, but they
00:17:51 --> 00:17:55 have been looking at uh data that
00:17:55 --> 00:17:59 suggests there is an outer planet
00:17:59 --> 00:18:01 further out than they think where planet
00:18:01 --> 00:18:03 nine should be. So this could was this
00:18:03 --> 00:18:07 is this planet 10 or 9.5 or what? I
00:18:07 --> 00:18:08 think they're calling it 8 and a half.
00:18:08 --> 00:18:11 Um because we've got Yes, this is not
00:18:11 --> 00:18:14 planet 9. That's that that is planet
00:18:14 --> 00:18:18 8.5. Right. Okay. Um, so what's the
00:18:18 --> 00:18:21 story? So, um, well, let's scan
00:18:21 --> 00:18:27 backwards to, um, uh, 200 2016, I think
00:18:27 --> 00:18:29 it was. Yeah, 2016 when two US
00:18:29 --> 00:18:31 astronomers,
00:18:31 --> 00:18:35 uh, basically puts out a paper
00:18:35 --> 00:18:37 suggesting that the fact that we've got
00:18:37 --> 00:18:40 all these uh, um, distant asteroid
00:18:40 --> 00:18:42 orbits, these are objects, trans
00:18:42 --> 00:18:44 neptunian objects, objects that are
00:18:44 --> 00:18:46 beyond the orbit of Neptune. uh and in
00:18:46 --> 00:18:48 fact some of them are what called
00:18:48 --> 00:18:51 extreme trans neptunian objects objects
00:18:51 --> 00:18:53 a long way beyond the orbit of Neptune
00:18:53 --> 00:18:56 whose orbits are highly uh elliptical
00:18:56 --> 00:18:58 they're very very elongated but they
00:18:58 --> 00:19:01 seem to line up um the the you know the
00:19:01 --> 00:19:03 elongated orbits seem to line up and
00:19:03 --> 00:19:04 they suggested that was because there's
00:19:04 --> 00:19:06 a planet out there that we haven't
00:19:06 --> 00:19:08 found. They call it planet 9. They think
00:19:08 --> 00:19:10 it's probably 10 times the mass of the
00:19:10 --> 00:19:12 earth. Um what you might call a super
00:19:12 --> 00:19:15 earth or or a sub neptune. those are the
00:19:15 --> 00:19:18 planets that are kind of common in other
00:19:18 --> 00:19:20 solar systems but are missing in our
00:19:20 --> 00:19:22 solar system. Uh so it it sort of fit
00:19:22 --> 00:19:26 fit the bill. Uh lots of uh lots of
00:19:26 --> 00:19:29 enthusiasm for this but also again lots
00:19:29 --> 00:19:31 of controversy. Um I think I probably
00:19:31 --> 00:19:33 mentioned to you the beginning of last
00:19:34 --> 00:19:36 year was it? I think yes. Um when I was
00:19:36 --> 00:19:38 in Canada I spoke to a planetary
00:19:38 --> 00:19:40 scientist there who said planet 9 is
00:19:40 --> 00:19:43 rubbish. uh and uh that was somebody who
00:19:43 --> 00:19:46 was um well tuned with um you know with
00:19:46 --> 00:19:49 the uh with the with the the science. Uh
00:19:49 --> 00:19:54 anyway, we now have a uh a new theory or
00:19:54 --> 00:19:57 sorry some new observations uh which
00:19:57 --> 00:20:00 come from astronomers in Taiwan, Japan
00:20:00 --> 00:20:02 and here in Australia. Yeah. Uh and what
00:20:02 --> 00:20:05 they've done is they've looked through
00:20:05 --> 00:20:09 archival images from two infrared
00:20:09 --> 00:20:12 satellites. One was called IRAS which I
00:20:12 --> 00:20:15 remember well. It was a NASA uh
00:20:15 --> 00:20:17 Netherlands UK satellite dating from
00:20:17 --> 00:20:20 1983. Um a very very productive
00:20:20 --> 00:20:23 satellite, infrared astronomy satellite.
00:20:23 --> 00:20:26 That's what the the abbreviation was. Uh
00:20:26 --> 00:20:28 and Aari which was a kind of Japanese
00:20:28 --> 00:20:30 equivalent which was launched quite a
00:20:30 --> 00:20:34 long time later in 2006. And that that
00:20:34 --> 00:20:36 means excuse me both these satellites
00:20:36 --> 00:20:37 surveyed the
00:20:37 --> 00:20:42 sky. Excuse my frog in my throat. Um but
00:20:42 --> 00:20:45 um they are um you know they're doing it
00:20:45 --> 00:20:48 at two completely different times which
00:20:48 --> 00:20:52 are 25ish years apart. Yeah. And so what
00:20:52 --> 00:20:54 that means is that if there's something
00:20:54 --> 00:20:57 deep in the solar system that is slowly
00:20:57 --> 00:21:00 moving uh you will you might be able to
00:21:00 --> 00:21:03 pick it up pick up its motion on these
00:21:04 --> 00:21:06 sets of images that were taken so far
00:21:06 --> 00:21:09 apart in time. Uh that's what they
00:21:09 --> 00:21:11 found. They basically had two million
00:21:11 --> 00:21:14 objects in the two cataloges. Um and
00:21:14 --> 00:21:17 they they got down to I think it was 13
00:21:17 --> 00:21:21 candidates um of of objects that moved
00:21:21 --> 00:21:24 slowly across the sky in the time. Uh
00:21:24 --> 00:21:27 and then they looked at each one by eye.
00:21:27 --> 00:21:28 Some of them probably turned out to be
00:21:28 --> 00:21:30 flaws in the data and things of that
00:21:30 --> 00:21:35 sort. Yeah. But one of them uh actually
00:21:35 --> 00:21:37 looked very promising. Uh because the
00:21:37 --> 00:21:41 the two observations um the Iras and
00:21:41 --> 00:21:43 Nicari observations separated by 20 odd
00:21:43 --> 00:21:46 years uh showed an object that had
00:21:46 --> 00:21:50 moved. Um but its color and its
00:21:50 --> 00:21:53 brightness were the same in both images.
00:21:53 --> 00:21:56 And so they are suspecting that that
00:21:56 --> 00:21:58 makes it the same object rather than you
00:21:58 --> 00:22:01 know two bits of dub data or something
00:22:01 --> 00:22:08 like that. Um now it's it's actually
00:22:08 --> 00:22:11 um something different from what planet
00:22:11 --> 00:22:15 9 has been suspected. Uh first of all
00:22:15 --> 00:22:19 this object if it is real goes around
00:22:19 --> 00:22:21 the sun in the opposite direction from
00:22:21 --> 00:22:24 everything else. Okay. uh it's tilted
00:22:24 --> 00:22:28 way over its orbits tilted at 120° which
00:22:28 --> 00:22:29 because it's more than 90° means it's
00:22:29 --> 00:22:33 going the wrong way round whereas planet
00:22:33 --> 00:22:37 9 uh the theory that was built around
00:22:37 --> 00:22:40 these extreme trans neptunian objects um
00:22:40 --> 00:22:42 that you know provided a model for
00:22:42 --> 00:22:45 planet 9 that really needed a very low
00:22:45 --> 00:22:49 orbit tilt 15 degrees or so uh in in
00:22:49 --> 00:22:51 order to do the the the stretching of
00:22:51 --> 00:22:53 these orbits or the alignment into these
00:22:53 --> 00:22:57 orbits. So the two uh scientists who
00:22:57 --> 00:22:59 were the original proposers of planet 9,
00:22:59 --> 00:23:02 Mike Brown and Constantin Constantin
00:23:02 --> 00:23:05 Batigan, uh they say, well, whatever
00:23:05 --> 00:23:10 this is, it's not planet 9. Um and it's
00:23:10 --> 00:23:12 it's but it may be something else.
00:23:12 --> 00:23:15 That's the uh the the inference that
00:23:15 --> 00:23:19 this thing may be real. uh and it uh
00:23:19 --> 00:23:23 clearly needs more data uh to determine
00:23:23 --> 00:23:25 whether it's a real object. Uh if it is,
00:23:25 --> 00:23:27 it might as exactly as we were said
00:23:27 --> 00:23:29 before might be planet 8 and a half or 9
00:23:29 --> 00:23:32 and a half. Um I guess the best bet uh
00:23:32 --> 00:23:34 for finding it is going to be when we
00:23:34 --> 00:23:38 get the Ver Rubin Observatory online um
00:23:38 --> 00:23:40 which is going to be uh towards the end
00:23:40 --> 00:23:45 of this year. uh and that is going to be
00:23:45 --> 00:23:48 able to look at the uh the southern sky
00:23:48 --> 00:23:50 which I think is where this object is. I
00:23:50 --> 00:23:51 can't remember what constellation it was
00:23:52 --> 00:23:54 in. Um it it they're but it's going to
00:23:54 --> 00:23:56 be able to look at the southern sky in
00:23:56 --> 00:23:59 much detail and it may find planet 9 or
00:23:59 --> 00:24:02 it may confirm planet 8 and a half or it
00:24:02 --> 00:24:04 may just tell us there's nothing out
00:24:04 --> 00:24:06 there at all. Uh so this is something
00:24:06 --> 00:24:08 that we're we're going to look forward
00:24:08 --> 00:24:10 to and you and I will talk about it I'm
00:24:10 --> 00:24:12 sure. Yeah. And then this has also
00:24:12 --> 00:24:16 created another issue because uh if this
00:24:16 --> 00:24:19 is a planet um beyond where planet 9
00:24:19 --> 00:24:22 should be. There is another theory that
00:24:22 --> 00:24:25 suggests that it will um basically
00:24:25 --> 00:24:27 eliminate the potential existence of
00:24:27 --> 00:24:29 planet 9 because they would interfere
00:24:29 --> 00:24:31 with each other and that and that's not
00:24:31 --> 00:24:34 evident in this data. That's correct.
00:24:34 --> 00:24:36 That's right. So yeah, you picked up on
00:24:36 --> 00:24:38 something I'd forgotten when I read the
00:24:38 --> 00:24:40 um I read the piece. That's right. It's
00:24:40 --> 00:24:45 uh um if if this is a real object uh
00:24:45 --> 00:24:47 it's it would not be compatible with
00:24:47 --> 00:24:49 there being a planet 9 uh which would
00:24:49 --> 00:24:51 actually be much nearer than this. This
00:24:51 --> 00:24:54 is thing is a long long way away uh
00:24:54 --> 00:24:56 right on the edge of the solar system if
00:24:56 --> 00:24:58 it's real uh and it would conflict with
00:24:58 --> 00:25:00 the idea of a planet 9. Yes. So, so it
00:25:00 --> 00:25:03 may be uh that this will if it turns out
00:25:03 --> 00:25:05 to be the right thing, if it turns out
00:25:05 --> 00:25:07 to be a real thing, then it might knock
00:25:07 --> 00:25:09 the planet 9 theory on the head
00:25:09 --> 00:25:11 altogether. But it's still just as
00:25:11 --> 00:25:13 exciting because it's it's it's a
00:25:13 --> 00:25:15 planet. Yeah, it it could be a planet.
00:25:15 --> 00:25:16 That's right. Could be a planet
00:25:16 --> 00:25:19 regardless. So, yeah, forget planet 9.
00:25:19 --> 00:25:22 Yeah, yeah, I got this. Whatever. Yeah,
00:25:22 --> 00:25:24 whatever it is. Yeah. Well, hopefully we
00:25:24 --> 00:25:27 can uh we can find that one. Uh they
00:25:27 --> 00:25:29 might end up calling it Planet 9 anyway
00:25:29 --> 00:25:31 because Well, that's what it'll be.
00:25:31 --> 00:25:34 That's what it'll be. Exactly. Yeah.
00:25:34 --> 00:25:36 It's really interesting. This one just
00:25:36 --> 00:25:40 keeps coming up this keeps on giving.
00:25:40 --> 00:25:43 Yeah, it does. Yeah. I love it. If you
00:25:43 --> 00:25:45 would like to read up on that, it's been
00:25:45 --> 00:25:48 published uh on the website
00:25:48 --> 00:25:50 science.org. This is Space Nuts with
00:25:50 --> 00:25:55 Andrew Dunley and Professor Fred Watson.
00:25:55 --> 00:25:58 Roger. You're allowed to here also space
00:25:58 --> 00:26:01 nuts. Now Fred, uh a few quick stories
00:26:01 --> 00:26:03 about various things uh that are
00:26:03 --> 00:26:07 happening mainly involving spacecraft or
00:26:07 --> 00:26:10 uh space missions or or lack of although
00:26:10 --> 00:26:12 the last story is more of a budget cut
00:26:12 --> 00:26:14 issue. But uh let's let's go back to
00:26:14 --> 00:26:17 1972 when the Soviet Union and the
00:26:17 --> 00:26:20 United States were um you know very
00:26:20 --> 00:26:23 heavily involved in the space race and
00:26:23 --> 00:26:26 the Soviet Union launched a a a
00:26:26 --> 00:26:28 spacecraft that was supposed to send a
00:26:28 --> 00:26:30 lander to
00:26:30 --> 00:26:34 Venus didn't quite make it and now now
00:26:34 --> 00:26:36 it's going to it's probably going to
00:26:36 --> 00:26:38 crash back down to Earth. That's right.
00:26:38 --> 00:26:41 So Cosmos 482 uh was the name of the
00:26:41 --> 00:26:43 mission. Um, and it was on its way to
00:26:43 --> 00:26:46 Venus. You're absolutely right. Uh, but
00:26:46 --> 00:26:50 apparently, uh, one of the final stages
00:26:50 --> 00:26:53 in the rocket, the upper stage, uh, the
00:26:53 --> 00:26:57 the booster basically malfunctioned. Uh,
00:26:57 --> 00:27:00 and so the spacecraft, uh, went into
00:27:00 --> 00:27:01 orbit around the Earth. It's probably
00:27:01 --> 00:27:03 quite a big orbit. Not sure of its
00:27:03 --> 00:27:07 dimensions. Uh but um it's uh so it's
00:27:08 --> 00:27:09 been in orbit around the earth for the
00:27:10 --> 00:27:15 last 50 53 years. Yeah. Uh and that time
00:27:15 --> 00:27:18 has now come when its orbit is decaying.
00:27:18 --> 00:27:22 Uh and uh it looks as though uh it is
00:27:22 --> 00:27:26 going to re-enter uh the earth's um
00:27:26 --> 00:27:27 atmosphere.
00:27:27 --> 00:27:31 uh and with actually a prediction uh for
00:27:31 --> 00:27:34 its entry uh almost as soon as the end
00:27:34 --> 00:27:37 of this week. Yeah. Um it's and it
00:27:38 --> 00:27:40 that's very hard to predict because uh
00:27:40 --> 00:27:44 it is uh it's uncontrolled. It doesn't
00:27:44 --> 00:27:46 have uh you know it doesn't have any um
00:27:46 --> 00:27:49 any sort of way of being being directed
00:27:49 --> 00:27:51 as to where it will reenter the
00:27:51 --> 00:27:54 atmosphere. Uh so it'll come down uh in
00:27:54 --> 00:27:57 a random place and as you mentioned um
00:27:57 --> 00:28:01 uh earlier on it's uh it's dangerous in
00:28:01 --> 00:28:03 a sense because this spacecraft was
00:28:03 --> 00:28:06 designed to penetrate the atmosphere of
00:28:06 --> 00:28:09 Venus. Uh and Venus's atmosphere is much
00:28:09 --> 00:28:13 thicker than our atmosphere. Uh it's uh
00:28:13 --> 00:28:15 now it would have been a a controlled
00:28:15 --> 00:28:17 entry into the atmosphere of Venus. It
00:28:17 --> 00:28:18 would have had breaking rockets to slow
00:28:18 --> 00:28:20 it down. uh which it doesn't have coming
00:28:20 --> 00:28:22 into the Earth's atmosphere. But it does
00:28:22 --> 00:28:25 mean uh that there might be bits of this
00:28:25 --> 00:28:29 capsule uh which will actually survive
00:28:29 --> 00:28:32 re-entry and could land on the ground.
00:28:32 --> 00:28:36 Uh it's um it's one to watch, I think,
00:28:36 --> 00:28:39 is this because we could see a headline
00:28:39 --> 00:28:41 that this piece of ancient space junk
00:28:41 --> 00:28:43 has landed in somebody's paddock
00:28:43 --> 00:28:46 or still landed on somebody's house. uh
00:28:46 --> 00:28:49 and um and will will probably cause
00:28:49 --> 00:28:51 global news. So, look out for news on
00:28:51 --> 00:28:53 that within the next few days. It might
00:28:53 --> 00:28:56 create one heck of a fireball. It could.
00:28:56 --> 00:28:58 Yes, that's right. Yeah, it could as it
00:28:58 --> 00:29:01 comes down. But we don't know we we
00:29:01 --> 00:29:03 don't know where it might land at this
00:29:03 --> 00:29:07 stage. It's it's one of these um very
00:29:07 --> 00:29:09 unpredict unpredictable scenarios. So,
00:29:09 --> 00:29:12 it yeah, it could just land anywhere. I
00:29:12 --> 00:29:13 mean, odds are it's going to miss
00:29:13 --> 00:29:15 something significant. It's just
00:29:15 --> 00:29:18 probably going to land in probably water
00:29:18 --> 00:29:19 would be most likely one. Well, that
00:29:19 --> 00:29:22 that's correct because water is what
00:29:22 --> 00:29:25 covers most of the Earth. 70% or 75%.
00:29:26 --> 00:29:28 That's right. Uh and that's sort of
00:29:28 --> 00:29:30 tends to be what happens with
00:29:30 --> 00:29:32 re-entering space debris. Most of it
00:29:32 --> 00:29:35 goes into into the ocean. Yeah. But the
00:29:35 --> 00:29:37 they go on to say that the risk of
00:29:37 --> 00:29:38 something getting hit is not
00:29:38 --> 00:29:41 particularly high, but not zero. That's
00:29:41 --> 00:29:43 right. That's correct. But that I guess
00:29:43 --> 00:29:45 that's always the case with anything
00:29:45 --> 00:29:47 coming through the atmosphere. So yes,
00:29:47 --> 00:29:49 watch with interest. Keep your eye on
00:29:49 --> 00:29:52 the sky. Uh that story in
00:29:52 --> 00:29:55 spaceaily.com. Uh let's move on to our
00:29:55 --> 00:29:57 next story. This is really exciting
00:29:57 --> 00:30:00 news. Uh Loheed Martin has finished uh
00:30:00 --> 00:30:02 the Orion capsule which is going to be
00:30:02 --> 00:30:04 put on top of Arteimus
00:30:04 --> 00:30:08 2. Indeed. That's right. Uh for launch
00:30:08 --> 00:30:11 next year. And Artimus 2 will uh will
00:30:11 --> 00:30:14 carry four astronauts. Uh and in a in a
00:30:14 --> 00:30:18 repeat mission of Arteimus 1 uh which
00:30:18 --> 00:30:20 was um
00:30:20 --> 00:30:22 basically going to the moon and back
00:30:22 --> 00:30:24 going into a very elongated orbit around
00:30:24 --> 00:30:27 the moon and then coming back to earth
00:30:27 --> 00:30:29 re-entering and landing back on Earth.
00:30:29 --> 00:30:30 That was all done as a dress rehe dress
00:30:30 --> 00:30:32 rehearsal. It's I think it's two years
00:30:32 --> 00:30:35 ago now. Yeah, it would be time since um
00:30:35 --> 00:30:38 and uh it worked flawlessly actually.
00:30:38 --> 00:30:39 Everything worked very well after a few
00:30:39 --> 00:30:42 hiccups on the launch pad. Uh, so
00:30:42 --> 00:30:44 Artimus 2 is the same thing, but will
00:30:44 --> 00:30:47 carry a crew. I think the capsule has
00:30:47 --> 00:30:49 been I think it's had some upgrades from
00:30:49 --> 00:30:52 the original planned one. Yeah, I think
00:30:52 --> 00:30:55 they I think they put a toilet in it.
00:30:55 --> 00:30:58 That would be very good if they did. Um
00:30:58 --> 00:31:01 the these are well we've got a quote
00:31:01 --> 00:31:02 here that uh comes from one of the
00:31:02 --> 00:31:06 Loheed Martin uh techni uh engineers to
00:31:06 --> 00:31:07 support the health and safety of the
00:31:07 --> 00:31:09 crew. This new systems have been added
00:31:09 --> 00:31:12 which include life support air water
00:31:12 --> 00:31:14 thermal control waste management as you
00:31:14 --> 00:31:16 said uh displays and controls audio
00:31:16 --> 00:31:18 communications an exercise machine and a
00:31:18 --> 00:31:21 fully functional launch abort system uh
00:31:21 --> 00:31:24 and so and lots and lots of other bells
00:31:24 --> 00:31:27 and whistles on it. Um, and so there'll
00:31:27 --> 00:31:29 be a lot of work now to kind of get the
00:31:29 --> 00:31:32 thing ready for launch next year. But
00:31:32 --> 00:31:36 yes, Artimus is on track for Arteimus 2,
00:31:36 --> 00:31:39 uh, flying very soon. Yeah. And they
00:31:39 --> 00:31:41 will carry astronauts this time. This
00:31:41 --> 00:31:43 will be a human mission and they're
00:31:43 --> 00:31:46 going to go way past the moon like the
00:31:46 --> 00:31:48 first mission. Yes. Will this be a
00:31:48 --> 00:31:50 record as to the furthest people have
00:31:50 --> 00:31:53 been out? It will indeed. That's right.
00:31:53 --> 00:31:54 It's going to be the uh you know it's
00:31:54 --> 00:31:56 going to be the furthest from Earth that
00:31:56 --> 00:31:59 any human has ventured. So that's Yes.
00:31:59 --> 00:32:02 Yeah. At the moment I think that record
00:32:02 --> 00:32:04 is held by Michael Collins because he
00:32:04 --> 00:32:08 was by himself, wasn't he? In um uh the
00:32:08 --> 00:32:12 um Apollo 11 Apollo 11.
00:32:12 --> 00:32:14 Yeah. Uh that might be right. I mean all
00:32:14 --> 00:32:18 the Apollo astronauts the um the what
00:32:18 --> 00:32:20 was it? It was the capsule commander I
00:32:20 --> 00:32:24 think. uh were left in orbit around the
00:32:24 --> 00:32:27 moon. Uh I don't know. And so some of
00:32:27 --> 00:32:29 those orbits might have been higher than
00:32:29 --> 00:32:32 others. Yeah. But yeah, I just it rings
00:32:32 --> 00:32:33 a bell, I think. I think that's true,
00:32:34 --> 00:32:35 right? Yeah. I'm sure I'll be corrected.
00:32:35 --> 00:32:38 I could look it up, but um yeah, might
00:32:38 --> 00:32:40 bother. We've got Space Not listeners.
00:32:40 --> 00:32:42 That's right. They're very quick to
00:32:42 --> 00:32:44 correct us. Absolutely. But this is all
00:32:44 --> 00:32:46 exciting news and it looks Yeah, they're
00:32:46 --> 00:32:49 looking at uh was it April next year or
00:32:49 --> 00:32:51 launch?
00:32:51 --> 00:32:53 So everything on schedule at the moment
00:32:53 --> 00:32:56 but uh this is a another example of the
00:32:56 --> 00:32:58 collaborative effort to put these
00:32:58 --> 00:33:01 missions together. It's um uh you know
00:33:01 --> 00:33:04 Loheed Martin's just one company. Uh I
00:33:04 --> 00:33:07 think Airbus is involved in this as
00:33:07 --> 00:33:11 well. Uh and um so many others. So uh we
00:33:11 --> 00:33:13 will uh we'll watch watch with interest.
00:33:13 --> 00:33:14 I'm kind of glad they put that life
00:33:14 --> 00:33:16 support system in. That would probably
00:33:16 --> 00:33:19 be useful. It might be. Yes, it might be
00:33:19 --> 00:33:22 helpful. Indeed, you can find plenty of
00:33:22 --> 00:33:24 stories uh that talk about that
00:33:24 --> 00:33:26 particular mission online if you care to
00:33:26 --> 00:33:29 search. One final thing, Fred, and this
00:33:29 --> 00:33:33 is probably not good news, and that is a
00:33:33 --> 00:33:36 potential budget cuts uh that will hit
00:33:36 --> 00:33:39 NASA pretty hard. Very hard. Yeah. If
00:33:39 --> 00:33:42 it's So, this is the the White House's
00:33:42 --> 00:33:44 proposed federal spending budget for
00:33:44 --> 00:33:46 2026.
00:33:46 --> 00:33:50 uh and there's cuts in many many areas
00:33:50 --> 00:33:56 but uh NASA uh have actually taken the
00:33:56 --> 00:33:58 brunt of this with a cut facing a
00:33:58 --> 00:34:01 possible cut has to be has to be
00:34:01 --> 00:34:03 approved clearly uh but it's
00:34:03 --> 00:34:07 24.3% uh coming down from 24.8 billion
00:34:07 --> 00:34:10 uh in this financial year to 18.8 8
00:34:10 --> 00:34:13 billion in the next financial year. And
00:34:13 --> 00:34:15 of course, so many of NASA's programs
00:34:15 --> 00:34:18 are very very sensitive uh to funding.
00:34:18 --> 00:34:20 Many of them are on shoestring budgets,
00:34:20 --> 00:34:23 you know, like keeping the Voyagers uh
00:34:23 --> 00:34:27 uh in touch uh and the Deep Space
00:34:27 --> 00:34:29 programs, all of that, possible future
00:34:29 --> 00:34:34 missions for New Horizons. That's uh all
00:34:34 --> 00:34:36 you have to worry about the future of
00:34:36 --> 00:34:40 them. Uh what's perhaps more significant
00:34:40 --> 00:34:43 and uh and you know I can see sort of
00:34:43 --> 00:34:45 where this is going is we've just been
00:34:45 --> 00:34:47 talking about Artemis. Uh the current
00:34:47 --> 00:34:50 Arteimus program has I think five uh
00:34:50 --> 00:34:53 missions um which the last ones would
00:34:53 --> 00:34:56 have um you know would have the gateway
00:34:56 --> 00:35:00 uh the gateway um uh uh space station in
00:35:00 --> 00:35:03 orbit around the moon. uh the basically
00:35:03 --> 00:35:07 the uh the the cuts would bring the
00:35:07 --> 00:35:09 Arteimus mission to an end after
00:35:09 --> 00:35:12 Arteimus 3. Gateway would be cancelled
00:35:12 --> 00:35:15 uh and those later Arteimus landings
00:35:15 --> 00:35:20 would be cancelled as well. Uh and um
00:35:20 --> 00:35:24 the the the the sort of load on lunar
00:35:24 --> 00:35:27 exploration would then be taken by the
00:35:27 --> 00:35:29 private sector. That's the idea that you
00:35:29 --> 00:35:31 get the private sector to do it, which
00:35:31 --> 00:35:34 probably means SpaceX and Blue Origin
00:35:34 --> 00:35:38 and companies like that. Um, and so, uh,
00:35:38 --> 00:35:40 it's it would be a remarkably big change
00:35:40 --> 00:35:43 to what's currently planned. So, the
00:35:43 --> 00:35:47 the, uh, the launch vehicles for Artemis
00:35:47 --> 00:35:49 are the space launch system SLS, which
00:35:49 --> 00:35:53 uses recycled um shuttle components, uh,
00:35:53 --> 00:35:56 and the Orion capsule. Uh that's what
00:35:56 --> 00:35:57 we've just been talking about. The
00:35:57 --> 00:36:00 capsule will hold uh uh astronauts. Uh
00:36:00 --> 00:36:03 the idea would be to phase it out after
00:36:03 --> 00:36:06 the three flights after Artimus 3. So
00:36:06 --> 00:36:07 that includes the SLS as well. That
00:36:07 --> 00:36:11 would go Yeah. And what I found in
00:36:11 --> 00:36:14 regard like 24.3% funding cut that is a
00:36:14 --> 00:36:19 huge huge cut. It is. Um and and most of
00:36:19 --> 00:36:21 that will be felt in the space and earth
00:36:21 --> 00:36:23 science divisions of NASA. And when you
00:36:23 --> 00:36:25 look at what they do, space science
00:36:25 --> 00:36:27 division does helopysics, planetary
00:36:27 --> 00:36:29 science and astrophysics. And the earth
00:36:29 --> 00:36:32 science division uh looks at atmospheric
00:36:32 --> 00:36:34 sciences, oceanography, land sciences,
00:36:34 --> 00:36:37 cryossphere technology, biosphere
00:36:37 --> 00:36:39 technology. I would have thought they
00:36:39 --> 00:36:41 were pretty important areas, but yes.
00:36:41 --> 00:36:42 Yes, that's right. Yeah, they they could
00:36:42 --> 00:36:45 get hammered in this uh if this budget
00:36:45 --> 00:36:49 cut goes ahead. Uh do you think um Elon
00:36:49 --> 00:36:51 has sort of been saying to Mr. Trump,
00:36:51 --> 00:36:53 look, I can do this. You don't have to
00:36:53 --> 00:36:55 pay for that.
00:36:55 --> 00:36:57 I I couldn't possibly guess at the
00:36:57 --> 00:36:59 conversations that go between those two,
00:36:59 --> 00:37:02 but I wouldn't be surprised.
00:37:02 --> 00:37:04 Yeah, it's a it's a bit of a worry. I
00:37:04 --> 00:37:07 Someone else told me that um they've
00:37:07 --> 00:37:10 totally cut funding to um National
00:37:10 --> 00:37:13 Public Radio, NPS, which is that was the
00:37:13 --> 00:37:15 US equivalent to the ABC. So, I I heard
00:37:15 --> 00:37:18 that. Yeah. So, um that that's fairly
00:37:18 --> 00:37:20 tragic, I think, in the scheme of
00:37:20 --> 00:37:23 things. Yeah. So this this this these
00:37:23 --> 00:37:26 budget proposals uh have to go to the US
00:37:26 --> 00:37:29 Congress uh because they appropriate the
00:37:29 --> 00:37:33 funds um and it you know it's remains to
00:37:33 --> 00:37:35 be seen uh what happens after that. The
00:37:35 --> 00:37:38 Congress is fairly evenly balanced I
00:37:38 --> 00:37:40 think politically. So
00:37:40 --> 00:37:42 we'll see unlike unlike our new
00:37:42 --> 00:37:44 government that's just been elected
00:37:44 --> 00:37:46 because it's looking pretty lopsided at
00:37:46 --> 00:37:50 the moment. Uh yeah, quite a quite a
00:37:50 --> 00:37:53 quite a result that was. Um okay, thank
00:37:53 --> 00:37:55 you Fred. If you'd like to look into
00:37:55 --> 00:37:57 that story about the budget, potential
00:37:57 --> 00:38:00 budget cuts to NASA, spaceflight now.com
00:38:00 --> 00:38:03 is the website. Uh we're all done, Fred.
00:38:03 --> 00:38:05 Thank you. Uh it's been a pleasure. Uh
00:38:05 --> 00:38:08 always good to talk and uh to bring us
00:38:08 --> 00:38:10 ourselves up to date as well as
00:38:10 --> 00:38:11 everybody else on what's going on in the
00:38:11 --> 00:38:13 world of space and astronomy. Very true.
00:38:13 --> 00:38:15 All right. We'll catch you on the next
00:38:15 --> 00:38:17 episode. Thank you, Fred. Professor Fred
00:38:17 --> 00:38:19 Watson, astronomer at large. And uh we
00:38:19 --> 00:38:21 would say thanks to Hugh in the studio,
00:38:21 --> 00:38:24 but um he's not with us. Budget cuts and
00:38:24 --> 00:38:26 all. You know how it goes. Uh and don't
00:38:26 --> 00:38:27 forget to visit us on our website,
00:38:28 --> 00:38:30 social media, and please leave reviews
00:38:30 --> 00:38:33 on your favorite podcasting platform.
00:38:33 --> 00:38:35 Apparently, they're quite helpful. And
00:38:35 --> 00:38:36 from me, Andrew Dunley, thanks for your
00:38:36 --> 00:38:38 company. See you on the next episode of
00:38:38 --> 00:38:41 Space Nuts. Bye-bye. Space Nuts. You've
00:38:41 --> 00:38:45 been listening to the Space Nuts podcast
00:38:45 --> 00:38:48 available at Apple Podcasts, Spotify,
00:38:48 --> 00:38:50 iHeart Radio, or your favorite podcast
00:38:50 --> 00:38:53 player. You can also stream on demand at
00:38:53 --> 00:38:56 bytes.com. This has been another quality
00:38:56 --> 00:39:00 podcast production from byes.com.