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Space Nuts Episode #489: Meteorite Madness, Space Treaties, and Cosmic Connections
Join Andrew Dunkley and Professor Jonti Horner as they explore a whirlwind of cosmic topics in this exciting episode of Space Nuts. From a meteorite striking a Canadian doorstep to a deep dive into space treaties and panspermia, this episode is packed with fascinating insights and discussions that will leave you pondering the mysteries of the universe.
Episode Highlights:
- Meteorite Strike: Discover the incredible story of a meteorite captured on a doorbell camera as it strikes a home in Canada. Jonti shares the details of the event, the type of meteorite involved, and the unique audio captured during the impact.
- Space Treaties and Ownership: Andrew and Jonti discuss the implications of Donald Trump's inauguration speech regarding the U.S. claim to Mars. Explore the 1967 Space Treaty that prohibits ownership of celestial bodies and the challenges of enforcing such agreements in today's commercial space era.
- Panspermia Possibilities: Delve into the intriguing concept of panspermia, which suggests that life could be transferred between planets via meteorites. Jonti explains new research proposing that life in Venus's atmosphere might have originated from Earth, raising questions about our understanding of life in the solar system.
- SpaceX and Blue Origin Launches: Get the latest updates on recent rocket launches, including SpaceX's Starship test flight and Blue Origin's New Glenn. Learn about the successes and challenges faced by these companies as they continue to push the boundaries of space exploration.
For more Space Nuts, including our continually updating newsfeed and to listen to all our episodes, visit our website (https://www.spacenutspodcast.com/about)
Stay curious, keep looking up, and join us next time for more stellar insights and cosmic wonders. Until then, clear skies and happy stargazing.
00:00 - Andrew Dunkley introduces the episode's topics
02:15 - Discussion on the meteorite strike in Canada
06:50 - Analysis of Donald Trump's comments on space ownership
12:30 - Explanation of the Space Treaty and its implications
18:45 - Exploration of panspermia and its relevance to Venus
25:10 - Updates on SpaceX and Blue Origin launches
30:00 - Closing thoughts and upcoming celestial events
✍️ Episode References
Space Treaty 1967
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outer_Space_Treaty
Panspermia Theory
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panspermia
SpaceX Starship
https://www.spacex.com/vehicles/starship/
Blue Origin New Glenn
https://www.blueorigin.com/new-glenn
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/space-nuts--2631155/support (https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/space-nuts--2631155/support?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=rss) .
Episode link: https://play.headliner.app/episode/25221160?utm_source=youtube
00:00:00 --> 00:00:02 hi there thanks for joining us this is
00:00:02 --> 00:00:05 Space Nuts once again my name is Andrew
00:00:05 --> 00:00:07 Dunley it's great to have your company
00:00:07 --> 00:00:10 uh we have got a lot on this particular
00:00:11 --> 00:00:12 episode we're going to talk about
00:00:12 --> 00:00:13 something that was said during the
00:00:13 --> 00:00:16 inauguration speech of one Donald Trump
00:00:16 --> 00:00:19 we're going to listen to a meteorite
00:00:19 --> 00:00:22 striking somebody's front door in Canada
00:00:22 --> 00:00:24 or close enough and we're going to look
00:00:24 --> 00:00:26 at a couple of space launchers one that
00:00:26 --> 00:00:29 had a bit of a disassembly and one of
00:00:29 --> 00:00:31 them that successful although there was
00:00:31 --> 00:00:33 a bit of an issue with sticking the
00:00:33 --> 00:00:36 landing on that one as well pan spermia
00:00:36 --> 00:00:39 is in the news again and if we can fit
00:00:39 --> 00:00:41 anything else in we will that's all
00:00:41 --> 00:00:45 coming up on this edition of Space Nuts
00:00:45 --> 00:00:50 15 seconds guidance is internal 10 9
00:00:50 --> 00:00:54 ignition sequence start Space Nuts 5 4 3
00:00:55 --> 00:00:59 2 1 2 3 4 5 5 4 3 2 1 Space Nuts as the
00:00:59 --> 00:01:01 nuts report it meals
00:01:01 --> 00:01:04 good yes indeed and it is good to
00:01:04 --> 00:01:06 welcome again johy Horner professor of
00:01:06 --> 00:01:08 astrophysics at the University of
00:01:08 --> 00:01:10 Southern Queensland sitting in for Fred
00:01:10 --> 00:01:12 who's gallivanting around the Northern
00:01:12 --> 00:01:14 Hemisphere somewhere up in the uh in the
00:01:14 --> 00:01:19 Deep cold looking at stuff jonty hello
00:01:19 --> 00:01:20 hello and yeah I'm continuing to be the
00:01:20 --> 00:01:23 substitute yorman this week so that's
00:01:23 --> 00:01:25 it's good to be here it's great to have
00:01:25 --> 00:01:27 you you're doing a fabulous job and uh
00:01:27 --> 00:01:29 yeah we're really really pleased to have
00:01:29 --> 00:01:34 you you uh I wanted to start this week
00:01:34 --> 00:01:37 with uh the inauguration speech of one
00:01:37 --> 00:01:40 Donald Trump uh who um had select guests
00:01:40 --> 00:01:42 in his audience they had to actually
00:01:42 --> 00:01:44 move it for the first time in 40 years
00:01:44 --> 00:01:45 because it was so bitterly
00:01:45 --> 00:01:48 cold and so there was a a limited
00:01:48 --> 00:01:51 audience um one might do guy who was
00:01:51 --> 00:01:52 always talking about people being
00:01:52 --> 00:01:55 snowflakes out of um
00:01:56 --> 00:01:58 Poss and
00:01:58 --> 00:02:00 uh there's been a lot of reporting on
00:02:00 --> 00:02:03 some of the things that uh Donald Trump
00:02:03 --> 00:02:06 said in his uh opening speech uh his
00:02:06 --> 00:02:09 inauguration speech and one of them was
00:02:09 --> 00:02:13 we will pursue our Manifest Destiny to
00:02:13 --> 00:02:16 plant the stars and stripes on planet
00:02:16 --> 00:02:19 Mars now uh this this sort of follows on
00:02:20 --> 00:02:24 from his um his desire to increase US
00:02:24 --> 00:02:28 territory now isn't there some kind of
00:02:28 --> 00:02:32 uh space treaty that bans us owning
00:02:32 --> 00:02:35 anything off Planet there is this is the
00:02:35 --> 00:02:38 space treaty back in 1967 and it's an
00:02:38 --> 00:02:40 interesting one of how the world has
00:02:40 --> 00:02:41 changed because back then the only
00:02:41 --> 00:02:43 people really involved in doing anything
00:02:44 --> 00:02:46 in space were a few select nation states
00:02:46 --> 00:02:48 who were doing a lot of things as a way
00:02:48 --> 00:02:50 of proving that they were bigger and
00:02:50 --> 00:02:51 stronger than their rals as much as
00:02:51 --> 00:02:54 anything else but this was a un
00:02:54 --> 00:02:57 declaration that the US is a signator
00:02:57 --> 00:02:59 and one of the many things covered in
00:02:59 --> 00:03:01 the space is the fact that there is no
00:03:01 --> 00:03:03 ownership of things off the Earth the
00:03:03 --> 00:03:06 idea that things should be for everybody
00:03:06 --> 00:03:08 rather than for select States and that's
00:03:08 --> 00:03:10 never really been challenged because
00:03:10 --> 00:03:12 we've never had the wherewithal to
00:03:12 --> 00:03:15 occupy and take over things in space we
00:03:15 --> 00:03:17 can land there we can drive stuff around
00:03:17 --> 00:03:19 but it's like the moon you know the US
00:03:19 --> 00:03:20 can land on the moon but there's no way
00:03:20 --> 00:03:22 they can stop China Landing over on the
00:03:22 --> 00:03:25 moon they can claim things and protect
00:03:25 --> 00:03:28 them in any way now there's two sides to
00:03:28 --> 00:03:29 this Donald Trump thing on the one hand
00:03:29 --> 00:03:32 fabulous uh to some degree the support
00:03:32 --> 00:03:34 there for space exploration going
00:03:34 --> 00:03:35 forward and it does seem like it's been
00:03:35 --> 00:03:37 an ongoing tennis match for 60 years of
00:03:38 --> 00:03:39 one side saying we'll go to the Moon
00:03:39 --> 00:03:40 then four years later the other side
00:03:40 --> 00:03:42 next saying n we'll scrap going to the
00:03:42 --> 00:03:45 Moon we'll go to Mars and back and forth
00:03:45 --> 00:03:47 so it's really positive seeing some
00:03:47 --> 00:03:49 continued engagement with that side of
00:03:49 --> 00:03:50 space stuff on the flip side the
00:03:50 --> 00:03:52 language is a little concerning so I
00:03:52 --> 00:03:54 mean you know you get there you put the
00:03:54 --> 00:03:55 flag in to say we got here that's one
00:03:55 --> 00:03:58 thing if you're putting the flag in as a
00:03:58 --> 00:04:00 point of ownership then that's an
00:04:00 --> 00:04:01 entirely different thing and it'll be
00:04:01 --> 00:04:04 very interesting to see what that Sparks
00:04:04 --> 00:04:06 in terms of reaction from China for
00:04:06 --> 00:04:08 example who also have aspirations to go
00:04:08 --> 00:04:10 to Mars and whether any of this is
00:04:10 --> 00:04:12 enforceable now there's been a lot of
00:04:12 --> 00:04:14 discussion about the space treaty anyway
00:04:14 --> 00:04:17 in the context of the commercial use of
00:04:17 --> 00:04:18 space because like I said when it was
00:04:19 --> 00:04:21 put together very few nations were
00:04:21 --> 00:04:24 involved in space and it was a nation
00:04:25 --> 00:04:27 thing and now it's a commercial thing
00:04:27 --> 00:04:28 yeah the great bulk of launchers to
00:04:28 --> 00:04:30 space are no longer research missions
00:04:30 --> 00:04:33 launched by governments their commercial
00:04:33 --> 00:04:36 initiatives launched by companies and
00:04:36 --> 00:04:37 that's a very different way of doing
00:04:37 --> 00:04:39 things and legislation just hasn't kept
00:04:39 --> 00:04:41 up you know there's a lot of discussions
00:04:41 --> 00:04:44 about the likes of sty link and the
00:04:44 --> 00:04:45 proposed Amazon Mega constellation and
00:04:45 --> 00:04:48 many many others and what the legality
00:04:48 --> 00:04:50 of that is and should we be doing it all
00:04:50 --> 00:04:53 and how do people have a right to
00:04:53 --> 00:04:54 control what is put in the sky above
00:04:54 --> 00:04:57 them and none of that's really covered
00:04:57 --> 00:04:58 because the legislation hasn't kept up
00:04:58 --> 00:05:00 so is very much like the wild west and
00:05:01 --> 00:05:03 this is just yet another reflection of
00:05:03 --> 00:05:04 that in terms of it's all well and good
00:05:04 --> 00:05:06 having a treaty that is more than 60
00:05:06 --> 00:05:08 years old that says you can't ear things
00:05:08 --> 00:05:11 in space we can't build a presence there
00:05:11 --> 00:05:12 but the reality is if they go there and
00:05:12 --> 00:05:15 put the flag in and say this is ours now
00:05:15 --> 00:05:17 and they have the wherewithal to defend
00:05:17 --> 00:05:19 that claim which is another thing
00:05:19 --> 00:05:22 entirely who's going to stop them yeah
00:05:22 --> 00:05:25 well that's that yes that's The $64
00:05:25 --> 00:05:27 Question and his um his richest
00:05:27 --> 00:05:30 supporter wants to put a colony on Mars
00:05:30 --> 00:05:32 so there's every chance that they've had
00:05:32 --> 00:05:35 a bit of a chat about this pre speech
00:05:35 --> 00:05:38 too I remember many years ago Elon Elon
00:05:38 --> 00:05:40 the great what a wonderful character I I
00:05:40 --> 00:05:41 have opinions there which I probably
00:05:42 --> 00:05:44 shouldn't dig into too much but he said
00:05:44 --> 00:05:46 that he has this great aspiration that
00:05:46 --> 00:05:48 he should be the first person to die on
00:05:48 --> 00:05:51 Mars and I think if you talk to a lot of
00:05:51 --> 00:05:52 astronomers there's some interesting
00:05:52 --> 00:05:53 thoughts on whether that would be a good
00:05:53 --> 00:05:55 thing or
00:05:55 --> 00:05:59 not yes and uh yes there were a few
00:05:59 --> 00:06:00 other things things at the inauguration
00:06:00 --> 00:06:02 speech and the Afterparty if we can call
00:06:03 --> 00:06:05 it that that uh yeah we're not going to
00:06:05 --> 00:06:07 go into involving Elon but he got plenty
00:06:07 --> 00:06:10 of coverage on that in the news as well
00:06:10 --> 00:06:12 but yeah it's it's a really dicey one
00:06:12 --> 00:06:14 and one wonders what will happen going
00:06:14 --> 00:06:16 forward you mentioned China they were
00:06:16 --> 00:06:18 invited to the inauguration I think the
00:06:18 --> 00:06:21 vice president uh or the vice Premier or
00:06:21 --> 00:06:24 whatever the title is for China uh did
00:06:24 --> 00:06:27 go so um maybe that's a good sign that
00:06:27 --> 00:06:28 relations between the two countries
00:06:28 --> 00:06:31 might be um warming up a bit but we'll
00:06:31 --> 00:06:33 uh we'll have to wait and see it's early
00:06:33 --> 00:06:36 days uh but the next four years will be
00:06:36 --> 00:06:39 fascinating to say the least interesting
00:06:39 --> 00:06:42 to I think yes indeed uh let's move on
00:06:42 --> 00:06:44 uh to something uh as interesting but
00:06:44 --> 00:06:47 completely different and this this is
00:06:47 --> 00:06:50 where um household technology has become
00:06:50 --> 00:06:52 such an amazing thing I remember when I
00:06:52 --> 00:06:56 first got a camera at my front door at a
00:06:56 --> 00:06:58 house we used to live in it actually
00:06:58 --> 00:07:01 recorded a lightning strike uh which was
00:07:01 --> 00:07:04 amazing uh over in Canada the other day
00:07:04 --> 00:07:07 a meteorite strike was recorded by a
00:07:07 --> 00:07:10 door Cam and they not only got the
00:07:10 --> 00:07:12 vision of the thing hitting the
00:07:12 --> 00:07:15 porch uh they uh they got the audio and
00:07:15 --> 00:07:19 it sounded something like
00:07:19 --> 00:07:22 this that's a quite a record I think
00:07:23 --> 00:07:23 I've got it
00:07:24 --> 00:07:27 again there we go um that's fascinating
00:07:27 --> 00:07:30 JY isn't it oh it's just so awesome I
00:07:30 --> 00:07:32 mean one of the first things I thought
00:07:32 --> 00:07:33 about on this when I saw the photos and
00:07:33 --> 00:07:36 the footage was hang on this is Canada
00:07:36 --> 00:07:37 which is notoriously cold and snowy and
00:07:37 --> 00:07:40 all the footage is green and verdant
00:07:40 --> 00:07:41 turns out that this event actually
00:07:41 --> 00:07:43 happened in July last year but we're
00:07:43 --> 00:07:44 only now getting to hear about it
00:07:44 --> 00:07:46 because there's been an official naming
00:07:46 --> 00:07:48 of this mey right after the town that it
00:07:48 --> 00:07:50 landed in so it's a the Charlotte Town
00:07:50 --> 00:07:52 mey right now and that's why this has
00:07:52 --> 00:07:54 finally come out as a story so it's one
00:07:54 --> 00:07:56 of these interesting things with stories
00:07:56 --> 00:07:57 like this that you don't often hear
00:07:57 --> 00:07:59 about the news when it's new you some
00:07:59 --> 00:08:01 you have to he about it when something
00:08:01 --> 00:08:03 triggers that release but it's
00:08:03 --> 00:08:04 absolutely fabulous so there's actually
00:08:04 --> 00:08:06 a photograph I've got up on my other
00:08:06 --> 00:08:09 screen at the minute showing where this
00:08:09 --> 00:08:11 meteorite hit and it's hit on the
00:08:11 --> 00:08:13 Redstone driveway essentially which is
00:08:13 --> 00:08:15 why you hear that smashing shattering
00:08:15 --> 00:08:17 sound because this was a conric type
00:08:17 --> 00:08:20 meteorite so it was quite fragile Frable
00:08:20 --> 00:08:23 and so when it hit the ground and it hit
00:08:23 --> 00:08:25 the ground traveling at what you
00:08:25 --> 00:08:26 describe as terminal velocity so it
00:08:26 --> 00:08:28 wasn't coming in at kilometers a second
00:08:28 --> 00:08:30 at this point it's coming in a couple of
00:08:30 --> 00:08:33 hundred miles an hour ex that's the
00:08:33 --> 00:08:34 atmosphere had slowed it down
00:08:34 --> 00:08:36 essentially so it landed essentially
00:08:36 --> 00:08:38 like if you dropped a rock from a an
00:08:38 --> 00:08:40 aircraft or dropped a rock from a couple
00:08:40 --> 00:08:42 hundred meters up hit the ground the
00:08:42 --> 00:08:43 ground was harder and this thing
00:08:43 --> 00:08:45 shattered so the noise you're hearing is
00:08:45 --> 00:08:47 the initial impact and then all the bits
00:08:47 --> 00:08:48 scattering around this was a single
00:08:48 --> 00:08:50 impactor and you see this beautiful
00:08:51 --> 00:08:53 spray Distribution on the driveway on
00:08:53 --> 00:08:54 this Photograph that looks very much
00:08:54 --> 00:08:57 like a ray Creator on the moon very
00:08:57 --> 00:08:59 similar but also very reminiscent of the
00:08:59 --> 00:09:01 similar impact that happened in the UK
00:09:01 --> 00:09:03 just a couple of years ago that was also
00:09:03 --> 00:09:05 a conr that hit somebody's driveway and
00:09:06 --> 00:09:07 they did a really good job of collecting
00:09:07 --> 00:09:09 it so it's really nice to see the
00:09:09 --> 00:09:11 similarities and just looking at that
00:09:11 --> 00:09:13 debris and the scatter pattern you can
00:09:13 --> 00:09:15 tell that this isn't an iron meteorite
00:09:15 --> 00:09:17 that it was something quite light and
00:09:17 --> 00:09:19 fragile even before the bits got
00:09:19 --> 00:09:22 analyzed the fact that on the video feed
00:09:22 --> 00:09:25 from this you know doorbell camera you
00:09:25 --> 00:09:27 see as Freeze Frame and you can actually
00:09:27 --> 00:09:30 see the rock as it's coming in
00:09:30 --> 00:09:31 the frame rate was high enough that the
00:09:31 --> 00:09:33 frame before the impact happened there's
00:09:33 --> 00:09:35 this black Speck in front of the sky
00:09:35 --> 00:09:38 that is a rock just before impact and
00:09:38 --> 00:09:39 that has to be unique I don't think
00:09:39 --> 00:09:41 there's ever been any record like that
00:09:41 --> 00:09:44 of an impact as it happened when it
00:09:44 --> 00:09:47 happened from closeup we saw comic
00:09:47 --> 00:09:49 schumak le9 hit Jupiter but even then
00:09:49 --> 00:09:51 the impacts were around the back of that
00:09:51 --> 00:09:52 planet we've seen a few impacts on
00:09:52 --> 00:09:55 Jupiter's face since but that seeing an
00:09:55 --> 00:09:58 event at 600 million kilm separation is
00:09:58 --> 00:09:59 very different seeing a mobile camera
00:09:59 --> 00:10:01 showing a
00:10:01 --> 00:10:03 rock six foot above the ground that is
00:10:03 --> 00:10:05 about to hit that is a part of a
00:10:05 --> 00:10:08 celestial object that's just awesome it
00:10:08 --> 00:10:10 is awesome uh they collected some
00:10:10 --> 00:10:14 fragments and um that that sort of
00:10:14 --> 00:10:17 prompted you to think uh about how this
00:10:17 --> 00:10:19 should or shouldn't be done yeah there's
00:10:19 --> 00:10:21 some really good and really bad examples
00:10:21 --> 00:10:23 of what to do if you think you found a
00:10:23 --> 00:10:27 meteorite and this aside 99.9% of the
00:10:27 --> 00:10:28 time when people think they found a
00:10:28 --> 00:10:31 meteorite on the ground they haven't but
00:10:31 --> 00:10:34 a common thing people do is touch what
00:10:34 --> 00:10:36 they' found to a magnet because ion
00:10:36 --> 00:10:39 meteorites will be trapped to the magnet
00:10:40 --> 00:10:42 this is really bad so everybody I know
00:10:42 --> 00:10:45 who works in meteorite studies strongly
00:10:45 --> 00:10:46 strongly strongly says please please
00:10:46 --> 00:10:48 please do not bring magnets anywhere
00:10:48 --> 00:10:51 near them because one of the cool things
00:10:51 --> 00:10:52 about meteorites is they preserve the
00:10:52 --> 00:10:54 history of the early solar system are
00:10:54 --> 00:10:56 one of the things locked in them is any
00:10:56 --> 00:10:58 evidence of weak magnetic fields back
00:10:58 --> 00:11:00 then and if bring a magnet next to but
00:11:00 --> 00:11:02 you wipe all that history oh right I
00:11:02 --> 00:11:05 likeing a hard drive absolutely yeah
00:11:05 --> 00:11:07 it's a little bit a little bit sad the
00:11:07 --> 00:11:08 other thing I've seen that a couple of
00:11:08 --> 00:11:11 people have done that is really fabulous
00:11:11 --> 00:11:13 is if you get there very quickly when
00:11:13 --> 00:11:14 something's Fallen it's not going to be
00:11:14 --> 00:11:17 steaming hot boiling hot like you see in
00:11:17 --> 00:11:18 the movies it'll actually probably be
00:11:18 --> 00:11:21 CLA cold and water will be condensing on
00:11:21 --> 00:11:23 it but if you want to pick it up one of
00:11:23 --> 00:11:25 the things about freshly fallen
00:11:25 --> 00:11:27 meteorites that's exciting is they are
00:11:27 --> 00:11:29 preserving evidence of another the
00:11:29 --> 00:11:32 celestial body and people are interested
00:11:32 --> 00:11:34 in things like possible precursor
00:11:34 --> 00:11:36 compounds to Life Could there have been
00:11:36 --> 00:11:39 life there or protolife or things like
00:11:39 --> 00:11:41 that where does it have come from now if
00:11:41 --> 00:11:43 you go and grab it with your sweaty
00:11:43 --> 00:11:45 human hand covered with oils and all the
00:11:45 --> 00:11:47 rest of it you contaminate it now I've
00:11:47 --> 00:11:49 got a couple of dogs one of them is
00:11:49 --> 00:11:50 asleep here and when we take them for
00:11:50 --> 00:11:51 their walk they sometimes decide to do
00:11:51 --> 00:11:53 their business and we've got very
00:11:53 --> 00:11:54 skilled at getting these little plastic
00:11:55 --> 00:11:56 bags and putting the bag over our hand
00:11:56 --> 00:11:59 and then picking the unmentionables up
00:11:59 --> 00:12:01 and putting the bag over it so that
00:12:01 --> 00:12:03 there's no contact between human flesh
00:12:03 --> 00:12:06 and that which you wish to not touch in
00:12:06 --> 00:12:08 this case and the same kind of thing
00:12:08 --> 00:12:09 would work for meteorites so if you
00:12:09 --> 00:12:11 found If You observe this happen on your
00:12:11 --> 00:12:13 ring doorbell or other products are
00:12:13 --> 00:12:16 available you know see this happen don't
00:12:16 --> 00:12:18 go pick it up with your hand if you can
00:12:18 --> 00:12:20 bagg it as if it's dop seriously and
00:12:20 --> 00:12:23 then if you can store it in the freezer
00:12:23 --> 00:12:24 so there's a fabulous story of a
00:12:24 --> 00:12:27 meteorite that fell in Canada again that
00:12:27 --> 00:12:29 fell on a frozen lake in the the middle
00:12:29 --> 00:12:31 of winter and was recovered and they
00:12:31 --> 00:12:33 actually managed to bag baggy it and
00:12:33 --> 00:12:35 store it in the freezer and the people
00:12:35 --> 00:12:37 who did that the scientists are thrilled
00:12:37 --> 00:12:38 with them because it turned out that
00:12:39 --> 00:12:41 that meteorite was incredibly rare in
00:12:41 --> 00:12:43 that it is pretty much the only one we
00:12:43 --> 00:12:45 found with volatile material still in it
00:12:45 --> 00:12:47 and if it had fallen somewhere where it
00:12:47 --> 00:12:49 was above freezing that would have just
00:12:49 --> 00:12:51 melted and dribbled out of it but what
00:12:51 --> 00:12:52 it thought is that that may well have
00:12:52 --> 00:12:54 actually been more cometry material than
00:12:54 --> 00:12:56 asteroidal material and all the things
00:12:56 --> 00:12:58 that we were able to learn from it were
00:12:58 --> 00:13:00 ensured by the fact that the people who
00:13:00 --> 00:13:01 found it a it was preserved because it
00:13:01 --> 00:13:03 fell somewhere really Cur so it stayed
00:13:03 --> 00:13:06 Christine but then when it was collected
00:13:06 --> 00:13:08 they bagged it up the right way they put
00:13:08 --> 00:13:10 it in the freezer and they stored it now
00:13:10 --> 00:13:12 lot to remember and the odds are nobody
00:13:12 --> 00:13:13 listening to this will ever have the
00:13:13 --> 00:13:15 Good Fortune of having a meteor Outland
00:13:15 --> 00:13:17 on the driveway but if you ever do it's
00:13:17 --> 00:13:19 good to do the right thing because that
00:13:19 --> 00:13:20 makes something that's already very
00:13:20 --> 00:13:23 valuable even more precious to
00:13:23 --> 00:13:26 scientists yeah that that's good advice
00:13:26 --> 00:13:29 um and some more advice uh if you do
00:13:29 --> 00:13:31 um you know practice what you preach and
00:13:31 --> 00:13:34 pick up the dog poo don't put it in the
00:13:34 --> 00:13:36 freezer next to the sausages don't mix
00:13:36 --> 00:13:38 it up with the meteoro fragments because
00:13:38 --> 00:13:41 you know that could be very
00:13:41 --> 00:13:45 to um yeah but great story and quite
00:13:45 --> 00:13:46 amazing footage if you haven't seen it
00:13:46 --> 00:13:49 jump online and have a look for the um
00:13:49 --> 00:13:51 um I think it was a ring camera that
00:13:51 --> 00:13:53 they were us think it
00:13:53 --> 00:13:56 was okay this is Space Nuts Andrew
00:13:56 --> 00:14:00 Dunley here with Jodi horn
00:14:00 --> 00:14:02 let's take a little break from the show
00:14:02 --> 00:14:04 right now to tell you about our sponsor
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00:15:51 --> 00:15:54 docomo our sponsor now back to the
00:15:55 --> 00:16:02 show 3 2 1 SP nuts next story jonty
00:16:02 --> 00:16:06 involves uh Space X and this was a test
00:16:06 --> 00:16:10 flight of their um uh one of their uh
00:16:10 --> 00:16:13 Mega Rockets the Starship and and uh
00:16:14 --> 00:16:16 well things went well and not well I
00:16:16 --> 00:16:19 think they uh they got the um the big
00:16:19 --> 00:16:21 bit back with the with the Chopsticks
00:16:21 --> 00:16:23 but the other bit uh well it created
00:16:24 --> 00:16:27 quite a l show Absolutely and this came
00:16:27 --> 00:16:28 very quickly to my attention when I I
00:16:29 --> 00:16:30 got up that morning and looked on
00:16:30 --> 00:16:32 various platforms and there's the most
00:16:33 --> 00:16:35 astonishingly beautiful footage taken
00:16:35 --> 00:16:39 over the turken Kos islands of what it's
00:16:39 --> 00:16:40 clearly space junk so it's coming in
00:16:40 --> 00:16:44 much too slowly to be a meteorite or
00:16:44 --> 00:16:46 something from Beyond the Earth's
00:16:46 --> 00:16:47 immediate environment they come in much
00:16:47 --> 00:16:49 much quicker you've got this beautiful
00:16:49 --> 00:16:51 shower of Sparks moving slowly across
00:16:51 --> 00:16:53 the sky I mean slowly is a relative term
00:16:53 --> 00:16:55 slowly compared to when you've seen
00:16:55 --> 00:16:57 meteor showers and Fireballs fast
00:16:57 --> 00:17:00 compared to a helicopter an aircraft
00:17:00 --> 00:17:02 high up but incredibly multicolored
00:17:02 --> 00:17:04 incredibly bright visible during the
00:17:04 --> 00:17:08 daytime and it was very quickly make
00:17:08 --> 00:17:10 clear that this was the remnants of the
00:17:10 --> 00:17:13 upper stage of the Starship test launch
00:17:13 --> 00:17:15 so they launched this rocket that is 123
00:17:15 --> 00:17:18 M tall which boggles my mind to begin
00:17:18 --> 00:17:21 with yes after the first stage separated
00:17:21 --> 00:17:23 the lower stage which is the bigger bit
00:17:23 --> 00:17:24 successfully came back and landed which
00:17:24 --> 00:17:26 is an incredible achievement they
00:17:26 --> 00:17:28 captured it landed safely ready to reuse
00:17:28 --> 00:17:30 again
00:17:30 --> 00:17:31 but about 8 and a half minutes into the
00:17:31 --> 00:17:33 flight the upper stage encountered a
00:17:33 --> 00:17:36 problem and self-destructed it's what
00:17:36 --> 00:17:39 basex have coined a rapid unscheduled
00:17:39 --> 00:17:42 disassembly which I think is kind of
00:17:42 --> 00:17:45 whimsical but that's lovely and it it
00:17:45 --> 00:17:47 was exploded deliberately when something
00:17:47 --> 00:17:48 goes wrong you don't want it going out
00:17:48 --> 00:17:51 of control so things are terminated and
00:17:51 --> 00:17:53 then it fell back to her through the
00:17:53 --> 00:17:56 atmosphere and a blad burned up high in
00:17:56 --> 00:17:58 the sky putting on a spectacular show
00:17:58 --> 00:17:59 now
00:17:59 --> 00:18:01 a lot of people go oh no things have
00:18:01 --> 00:18:03 blown up that's terrible and SpaceX are
00:18:03 --> 00:18:06 fairly positive about it um because I
00:18:06 --> 00:18:08 guess with space flight the argument is
00:18:08 --> 00:18:09 you don't make an omelet without
00:18:09 --> 00:18:12 breaking eggs the entire history of
00:18:12 --> 00:18:15 space flight is Success built on failure
00:18:15 --> 00:18:17 and when something fails that's actually
00:18:17 --> 00:18:20 a real success in its own right because
00:18:20 --> 00:18:21 it allows you to identify something that
00:18:22 --> 00:18:24 could go wrong and fix it so that it
00:18:24 --> 00:18:26 never goes wrong again so this kind of
00:18:26 --> 00:18:28 thing has been a standard part of space
00:18:28 --> 00:18:30 EX history and their great success is
00:18:30 --> 00:18:32 that they accept these things and build
00:18:32 --> 00:18:34 on them it did have some interesting
00:18:34 --> 00:18:37 kind of side effects so I saw an
00:18:37 --> 00:18:40 interesting thread on Reddit um from a
00:18:40 --> 00:18:41 pilot who'd been in the air when this
00:18:41 --> 00:18:42 happened and they'd had to divert
00:18:43 --> 00:18:44 because obviously that shonfield where
00:18:44 --> 00:18:47 this is coming down has to become closed
00:18:47 --> 00:18:50 airspace for I think he said the the
00:18:50 --> 00:18:52 rules and regulations were 30 minutes
00:18:52 --> 00:18:53 after it
00:18:53 --> 00:18:55 finishes in order to be just in case
00:18:56 --> 00:18:57 just to be safe because the ODS of one
00:18:57 --> 00:18:58 of these fragments hitting in aircraft
00:18:58 --> 00:19:01 are vanishingly small but they're a lot
00:19:01 --> 00:19:02 higher than if there's not one of these
00:19:02 --> 00:19:05 events happening so it's a safety thing
00:19:05 --> 00:19:06 and it turns out that aircraft only have
00:19:06 --> 00:19:09 a relatively small margin of fuel error
00:19:09 --> 00:19:10 so a couple of the planes involved had
00:19:10 --> 00:19:12 to declare what they call a fuel
00:19:12 --> 00:19:14 emergency which isn't as bad as it
00:19:14 --> 00:19:16 sounds I found this really fascinating
00:19:16 --> 00:19:17 reading through it because he was very
00:19:18 --> 00:19:20 detailed in it a fuel emergency is not
00:19:20 --> 00:19:22 saying oh my God we're doomed it's
00:19:22 --> 00:19:24 saying we're now onto our backup fuel so
00:19:24 --> 00:19:25 you need to bump it up the landing
00:19:25 --> 00:19:28 shedule so it's not panic panic it's
00:19:28 --> 00:19:31 more give us a priority Landing but it's
00:19:31 --> 00:19:33 still really interesting that you don't
00:19:33 --> 00:19:35 necessarily connect immediately SpaceX
00:19:35 --> 00:19:37 doing a rocket launch and somebody on an
00:19:37 --> 00:19:40 aircraft having to divert or having to
00:19:40 --> 00:19:41 be delayed because the rocket launch
00:19:41 --> 00:19:44 went wrong and at the minute we have
00:19:44 --> 00:19:46 more rocket launchers happening per week
00:19:46 --> 00:19:48 per day than there has ever been before
00:19:48 --> 00:19:49 and that's only going to get more and
00:19:49 --> 00:19:51 more common as the commercial EAS space
00:19:51 --> 00:19:54 gets even more common so this kind of ss
00:19:54 --> 00:19:56 an interesting insight into how all this
00:19:56 --> 00:19:58 stuff plays together as well as putting
00:19:58 --> 00:20:01 on an incredibly spectacular lro I mean
00:20:01 --> 00:20:03 the footage is well worth going out and
00:20:03 --> 00:20:05 looking for it cuz it's so stunning it
00:20:05 --> 00:20:08 is it's quite extraordinary I I had to
00:20:08 --> 00:20:11 laugh though because um
00:20:11 --> 00:20:14 SpaceX has this this habit of um stating
00:20:14 --> 00:20:19 the bleeding the obvious so Starship is
00:20:19 --> 00:20:22 a Starship uh and and the upper stage
00:20:22 --> 00:20:25 that actually um they had to destroy is
00:20:25 --> 00:20:29 called ship yeah
00:20:29 --> 00:20:33 okay all right well I mean that's what
00:20:33 --> 00:20:35 it is uh it's a spaceship so they just
00:20:35 --> 00:20:39 called it ship um
00:20:39 --> 00:20:42 gosh do I guess it doesn't really matter
00:20:42 --> 00:20:44 what you call anything but uh you people
00:20:45 --> 00:20:46 look back in the future at the history
00:20:46 --> 00:20:51 of these pioneering events and go oh
00:20:51 --> 00:20:52 they really didn't put much thought into
00:20:52 --> 00:20:54 that did they I think they've actually
00:20:54 --> 00:20:58 done quite a good job about getting
00:20:58 --> 00:20:59 people on B and actually giving things
00:20:59 --> 00:21:02 Whimsical names you know things that
00:21:02 --> 00:21:04 stick in the mind so my memory is and
00:21:04 --> 00:21:06 you know feel free to correct me if I'm
00:21:06 --> 00:21:07 wrong here but my memory is that the
00:21:07 --> 00:21:10 platforms that they bring the spacecraft
00:21:10 --> 00:21:12 back to are named after some of the
00:21:12 --> 00:21:14 ships from the culture novels by inm
00:21:14 --> 00:21:17 Banks which are fabulous fabulous books
00:21:17 --> 00:21:18 and that's a Lely little touch because
00:21:18 --> 00:21:20 those names themselves are a little bit
00:21:20 --> 00:21:23 quirky and a little bit Whimsical and
00:21:23 --> 00:21:25 there's a a fairly good history of
00:21:25 --> 00:21:27 giving things quirky names and also kind
00:21:27 --> 00:21:29 of almost
00:21:29 --> 00:21:32 arzinger when they got their own Twitter
00:21:32 --> 00:21:34 accounts back in the day and people
00:21:34 --> 00:21:36 really got hooked into the human journey
00:21:36 --> 00:21:39 of this artificial Lander on Mars and I
00:21:39 --> 00:21:41 think companies are becoming aware of
00:21:41 --> 00:21:42 this and thinking it's a really good way
00:21:42 --> 00:21:44 of helping the public opinion and
00:21:44 --> 00:21:45 getting people more aware of what's
00:21:45 --> 00:21:47 going on and these things stick a lot
00:21:47 --> 00:21:50 better in your head than a
00:21:50 --> 00:21:52 barcod yeah absolutely I was just trying
00:21:52 --> 00:21:55 to look up some of the names of um the
00:21:55 --> 00:21:59 SpaceX landing pads but uh they are
00:21:59 --> 00:22:02 not jumping out in front of me but um
00:22:02 --> 00:22:04 yeah I've I've heard some of them and
00:22:04 --> 00:22:06 yeah you're right they are very very
00:22:06 --> 00:22:09 very unusual some of them um while we're
00:22:10 --> 00:22:14 talking about um the SpaceX disassembly
00:22:14 --> 00:22:17 uh we can't really go past uh blue
00:22:17 --> 00:22:19 origin which is probably going to become
00:22:20 --> 00:22:22 spacex's most direct competitor amongst
00:22:22 --> 00:22:25 others and they've had success with and
00:22:25 --> 00:22:28 here's another name um the launch of new
00:22:28 --> 00:22:29 Glenn
00:22:29 --> 00:22:31 yes and this is a been a long time
00:22:31 --> 00:22:33 coming it was initially meant to launch
00:22:33 --> 00:22:34 in about 2020 but they've taken it
00:22:34 --> 00:22:36 careful postponed improved popon
00:22:36 --> 00:22:39 improved now this was a smaller rocket
00:22:39 --> 00:22:40 and when I say a smaller I think it was
00:22:40 --> 00:22:44 only about 90 meters tall um but this is
00:22:44 --> 00:22:45 looking like it's going to be the big
00:22:46 --> 00:22:48 rival in long-term future to Sparx
00:22:48 --> 00:22:49 certainly in terms of competing for
00:22:49 --> 00:22:52 American grants and MAA
00:22:52 --> 00:22:54 opportunities blue origin have got
00:22:54 --> 00:22:56 interest just like Sparx in being
00:22:56 --> 00:22:59 involved in the you know ongoing emist
00:22:59 --> 00:23:01 stuff trying to get stuff to the Moon
00:23:01 --> 00:23:03 yeah and it's a really interesting
00:23:03 --> 00:23:05 mirror to the SpaceX launch because with
00:23:05 --> 00:23:07 the SpaceX launch the lower stage landed
00:23:07 --> 00:23:08 and was captured beautifully but the
00:23:08 --> 00:23:11 upper stage detonated with new Glenn
00:23:11 --> 00:23:13 their primary focus was to just get the
00:23:13 --> 00:23:15 rookie to orbit that was the goal it's
00:23:15 --> 00:23:17 the first ever test flight and that was
00:23:17 --> 00:23:20 achieved perfectly they had a secondary
00:23:20 --> 00:23:22 goal that was trying to land their main
00:23:22 --> 00:23:24 booster back on their launch pad and it
00:23:24 --> 00:23:27 didn't quite work so space has got the
00:23:27 --> 00:23:29 first part right blue origin got the
00:23:29 --> 00:23:32 second part right but it's a really nice
00:23:32 --> 00:23:34 bit of evidence that things are moving
00:23:34 --> 00:23:36 forward and again if we go back to when
00:23:36 --> 00:23:39 I was a teenager in the '90s
00:23:39 --> 00:23:41 if you told me then that you'd have had
00:23:41 --> 00:23:43 reusable launch vehicles that are a
00:23:43 --> 00:23:45 commercial thing that were doing this it
00:23:45 --> 00:23:47 blown me away and now it's become common
00:23:47 --> 00:23:50 place you know we have so many launches
00:23:50 --> 00:23:52 of satellites for commercial purposes
00:23:52 --> 00:23:54 going on that nobody ever hears about
00:23:54 --> 00:23:56 them unless they're really enthusiastic
00:23:56 --> 00:23:58 or something happens that shouldn't or
00:23:58 --> 00:24:00 something happens yeah it's that usual
00:24:00 --> 00:24:02 thing of nobody's interested in a news
00:24:02 --> 00:24:03 story saying that something happened and
00:24:03 --> 00:24:05 it went perfectly smoothly and it's
00:24:05 --> 00:24:07 perfectly mundan but when something goes
00:24:07 --> 00:24:11 wrong it's big news yeah yeah it is um
00:24:11 --> 00:24:14 so in both cases they had success and
00:24:14 --> 00:24:18 failure um and and both parties
00:24:18 --> 00:24:20 basically said no look this is good
00:24:20 --> 00:24:23 because we learn from these mistakes and
00:24:23 --> 00:24:25 uh and again you know you're looking at
00:24:25 --> 00:24:27 names I I I didn't look up what new
00:24:27 --> 00:24:29 Glenn
00:24:29 --> 00:24:31 stood for where it came from but uh it's
00:24:31 --> 00:24:33 an odd name for a
00:24:33 --> 00:24:35 spacecraft yes uh there's so many of
00:24:35 --> 00:24:37 these little things go around but it
00:24:37 --> 00:24:38 again it's six in the head it's better
00:24:39 --> 00:24:40 than rocket 11
00:24:40 --> 00:24:43 174b yeah true true I I found some of
00:24:43 --> 00:24:48 the names SpaceX uses for its um Landing
00:24:48 --> 00:24:50 sites the these were the barges I think
00:24:50 --> 00:24:52 that they were using that's right just
00:24:52 --> 00:24:54 read the instructions yeah uh of course
00:24:55 --> 00:24:57 I still love you and a short fall of
00:24:57 --> 00:25:01 Gravitas
00:25:01 --> 00:25:04 H God link back to these culture novels
00:25:04 --> 00:25:05 where I read them a long time ago and
00:25:06 --> 00:25:07 you've got this hyper Advanced future
00:25:07 --> 00:25:10 Society kind of thing where almost
00:25:10 --> 00:25:11 anything is possible and you've got
00:25:11 --> 00:25:14 these spits senent eyes that are far
00:25:14 --> 00:25:16 more intelligent than anything else but
00:25:16 --> 00:25:18 just kind of vaguely tolerate humans and
00:25:18 --> 00:25:20 all the other aliens as their passengers
00:25:20 --> 00:25:22 and have their own private inner lives
00:25:22 --> 00:25:25 and Communications with each other yeah
00:25:25 --> 00:25:27 they're quite heavy goinging boooks at
00:25:27 --> 00:25:28 times but that side of it it's just
00:25:28 --> 00:25:32 lovely yeah it is yeah well you know um
00:25:32 --> 00:25:36 I'm I'm a big believer in quirky so I I
00:25:36 --> 00:25:37 don't really have a problem with it but
00:25:37 --> 00:25:40 um yeah ship I think was probably you
00:25:40 --> 00:25:42 know that falls a bit
00:25:42 --> 00:25:45 short um yes but uh yeah uh if you want
00:25:45 --> 00:25:47 to chase up those stories you can read
00:25:47 --> 00:25:49 them on
00:25:49 --> 00:25:51 space.com this is Space Nuts with Andrew
00:25:51 --> 00:25:55 Dunley and Professor jonty
00:25:55 --> 00:25:58 hor okay we checked all four systems and
00:25:58 --> 00:26:03 Space Nuts now Johnny uh this this is um
00:26:03 --> 00:26:05 sort of a follow on story to something
00:26:05 --> 00:26:07 that Fred and I discussed more than once
00:26:07 --> 00:26:10 in recent times and that is uh looking
00:26:10 --> 00:26:12 at whether or not there might be life in
00:26:12 --> 00:26:16 the atmosphere of Venus uh and a new
00:26:16 --> 00:26:20 paper has been released that is
00:26:20 --> 00:26:24 actually suggesting that not only could
00:26:24 --> 00:26:27 there be life in the atmosphere of Venus
00:26:27 --> 00:26:29 and they're not saying there is is could
00:26:29 --> 00:26:32 be it may well have come from Earth yeah
00:26:32 --> 00:26:35 that's that's interesting in itself and
00:26:35 --> 00:26:38 and they've backed it up with some um
00:26:38 --> 00:26:41 well data that they believe suggests
00:26:41 --> 00:26:44 it's a it's a it's a possibility it is
00:26:44 --> 00:26:46 and this is all based on an idea called
00:26:46 --> 00:26:48 panspermia that when it was first
00:26:48 --> 00:26:51 proposed was firmly considered by The
00:26:51 --> 00:26:52 Establishment at the time to be in the
00:26:52 --> 00:26:55 crank box to be absolutely bunkers it
00:26:55 --> 00:26:58 couldn't work it's the idea that life
00:26:58 --> 00:26:59 can be transferred from one planet to
00:26:59 --> 00:27:02 another carried on the back of
00:27:02 --> 00:27:04 meteorites so you have a big impact on
00:27:04 --> 00:27:07 Earth digs up a load of rock fling some
00:27:07 --> 00:27:09 of that rock into space and eventually
00:27:09 --> 00:27:10 some of those rocks land on another
00:27:10 --> 00:27:13 planet and life spreads a bit like the
00:27:13 --> 00:27:16 common cold on a busy train you know
00:27:16 --> 00:27:17 that whole thing of don't G near Earth
00:27:17 --> 00:27:19 it's got humans their
00:27:19 --> 00:27:22 contagious and when this first came out
00:27:22 --> 00:27:24 everybody just s it sounding Bonkers
00:27:24 --> 00:27:27 because firstly life can't exist in
00:27:27 --> 00:27:30 space two hard not going to happen then
00:27:30 --> 00:27:32 you've got it would take millions of
00:27:32 --> 00:27:33 years on average for a bit to get from
00:27:33 --> 00:27:35 one place to another and that's too long
00:27:35 --> 00:27:37 so it couldn't happen and finally if a
00:27:37 --> 00:27:39 rock's ejected from a planet then it's
00:27:39 --> 00:27:41 been in a big impact and that should
00:27:41 --> 00:27:43 sterilize it so it should never happen
00:27:43 --> 00:27:46 but then as time's gone on all of those
00:27:46 --> 00:27:48 kind of conceits have fallen down a bit
00:27:49 --> 00:27:51 we found meteorites on Earth from the
00:27:51 --> 00:27:52 Moon we found them from Mars you know
00:27:52 --> 00:27:54 the Allen Hills meteorites one of the
00:27:54 --> 00:27:56 famous ones which led to claims of Life
00:27:56 --> 00:27:57 on Mars a couple of decades ago that
00:27:57 --> 00:28:00 were event shut down so we know that
00:28:00 --> 00:28:02 rocks get transferred from planet to
00:28:02 --> 00:28:03 planet fairly
00:28:03 --> 00:28:05 straightforwardly when I worked at the
00:28:05 --> 00:28:08 oen University this is from 2006 to 2009
00:28:09 --> 00:28:10 there were people there who were working
00:28:10 --> 00:28:13 on this kind of stuff looking into it
00:28:13 --> 00:28:14 and what it turns out is that when you
00:28:14 --> 00:28:17 get a fairly large impact up to the kind
00:28:17 --> 00:28:18 of dinosaur killing size impact but the
00:28:18 --> 00:28:20 kind of thing that forms a substantial
00:28:20 --> 00:28:22 crator on Earth the closer you are to
00:28:22 --> 00:28:24 the middle the more intense the shock
00:28:24 --> 00:28:25 wave and the more damaging it is and the
00:28:25 --> 00:28:27 further out you go the less intense it
00:28:27 --> 00:28:28 gets so the further away you are the
00:28:28 --> 00:28:31 less strong the shock is but that
00:28:31 --> 00:28:33 gradient is actually shallower the
00:28:33 --> 00:28:35 bigger the impact is it falls off more
00:28:35 --> 00:28:38 slowly what that leads to bizar is that
00:28:38 --> 00:28:40 there is a range of distances from the
00:28:40 --> 00:28:42 impact where that shock wave is strong
00:28:42 --> 00:28:44 enough to eject rocks from the surface
00:28:44 --> 00:28:47 of the Earth out of the atmosphere
00:28:47 --> 00:28:48 particularly given that the thing that's
00:28:48 --> 00:28:50 just hit us has created a hole in the
00:28:50 --> 00:28:52 atmosphere to make it a bit easier and
00:28:52 --> 00:28:54 that those rocks can be ejected intact
00:28:54 --> 00:28:57 and the shocks involved in the Rock are
00:28:57 --> 00:28:59 weaker than the amount of shock you'd
00:28:59 --> 00:29:01 need to sterilize it in other words
00:29:01 --> 00:29:03 bacteria could be ejected to space on
00:29:04 --> 00:29:05 the back of these rocks without being
00:29:05 --> 00:29:07 killed so that's another thing in its
00:29:07 --> 00:29:10 further and then you get studies that
00:29:10 --> 00:29:12 have looked into the viability of
00:29:12 --> 00:29:15 bacteria in the vacuum of space with UV
00:29:15 --> 00:29:17 radiation that suggests that they can
00:29:17 --> 00:29:19 remain viable for a much longer period
00:29:19 --> 00:29:20 of time than you think because when they
00:29:20 --> 00:29:22 go out into space they kind of go into
00:29:22 --> 00:29:26 this stasis Spore form and UV damage
00:29:26 --> 00:29:28 kills some of them I'm working with a
00:29:28 --> 00:29:32 PhD student down um in Victoria who's
00:29:32 --> 00:29:34 looking at this doing some experiments
00:29:34 --> 00:29:36 into the fact that the dead cells on the
00:29:36 --> 00:29:38 outside provide extra shielding and
00:29:38 --> 00:29:40 that's even before you consider that
00:29:40 --> 00:29:41 there can be bacteria on the inside of
00:29:41 --> 00:29:44 the rock where the rock Shields them and
00:29:44 --> 00:29:45 they did test they put bacteria on the
00:29:46 --> 00:29:47 outside of the space station left them a
00:29:47 --> 00:29:49 few months brought them back inside and
00:29:49 --> 00:29:51 they cultured them happily W the step
00:29:51 --> 00:29:53 seem to be that despite the fact this
00:29:53 --> 00:29:56 sounds a ridiculously outlandish idea
00:29:56 --> 00:29:58 it's perfectly reasonable to think that
00:29:58 --> 00:29:59 life could be passed around the solar
00:29:59 --> 00:30:01 system like a a tennis ball bouncing
00:30:01 --> 00:30:03 around at the Australian Earth and going
00:30:03 --> 00:30:06 from planet to planet so that's become
00:30:06 --> 00:30:07 an established
00:30:07 --> 00:30:09 possibility it's like to a lot of
00:30:09 --> 00:30:11 discussions there's interesting
00:30:11 --> 00:30:12 philosophical things if we ever find
00:30:12 --> 00:30:15 Life on Mars and that's still an if will
00:30:15 --> 00:30:17 it be life that has a separate origin to
00:30:17 --> 00:30:19 life on Earth or will it be life that
00:30:19 --> 00:30:21 shares An Origin with life on Earth and
00:30:21 --> 00:30:22 that's not necessarily saying life is
00:30:22 --> 00:30:24 out on Earth we could be martians you
00:30:24 --> 00:30:25 know life could have begun on Mars and
00:30:25 --> 00:30:27 been transferred to Earth yeah we've
00:30:27 --> 00:30:30 just done know but there are some
00:30:30 --> 00:30:31 predictions you can make and one of them
00:30:31 --> 00:30:33 is that if we ever find life on another
00:30:33 --> 00:30:35 body in the solar system there's a a
00:30:35 --> 00:30:37 good possibility that it will share a
00:30:37 --> 00:30:39 Heritage with us so that brings us after
00:30:39 --> 00:30:42 a lot of jonty waffle to this story
00:30:42 --> 00:30:45 about Venus and it's bringing together
00:30:45 --> 00:30:47 that other story which is the potential
00:30:47 --> 00:30:48 detection of this gas called phosphine
00:30:48 --> 00:30:51 in Venus which was quite controversial I
00:30:51 --> 00:30:53 know the lead scientists quite well who
00:30:53 --> 00:30:55 did that work and I felt very sad for
00:30:55 --> 00:30:57 her some of the abuse and vitriol that
00:30:57 --> 00:30:58 were directed to their team over the
00:30:58 --> 00:31:02 results yeah but it was a really
00:31:02 --> 00:31:04 interesting detection right at the edge
00:31:04 --> 00:31:06 of sensitivity for their inment and what
00:31:06 --> 00:31:07 they said was that we found this gas
00:31:08 --> 00:31:11 called phosphine on the Earth the only
00:31:11 --> 00:31:14 way that that is produced is through the
00:31:14 --> 00:31:16 action of life or through human industry
00:31:16 --> 00:31:18 there's no other chemical process on
00:31:18 --> 00:31:21 Earth we know of that can make this that
00:31:21 --> 00:31:22 doesn't mean that there aren't other
00:31:22 --> 00:31:23 possibilities it's just we don't know of
00:31:24 --> 00:31:26 them so there is a possibility that this
00:31:26 --> 00:31:28 could be being produced by life but it's
00:31:28 --> 00:31:31 not a detection of life and there was a
00:31:31 --> 00:31:34 whole Cavalcade of arguments and stories
00:31:34 --> 00:31:36 that followed on from that but inspired
00:31:36 --> 00:31:37 by that the team that have done this
00:31:37 --> 00:31:39 paper have looked at it to say if there
00:31:39 --> 00:31:40 is life in the Clouds of Venus in this
00:31:40 --> 00:31:43 temporal layer where the conditions are
00:31:43 --> 00:31:44 more similar to those on Earth than you
00:31:44 --> 00:31:46 would have on Venus's
00:31:46 --> 00:31:48 surface could that life actually be
00:31:48 --> 00:31:50 Earth Life Could It Be contamination
00:31:50 --> 00:31:52 from the earth with bacteria that have
00:31:52 --> 00:31:54 been transferred there through this pans
00:31:54 --> 00:31:57 spermia reat and they've done some
00:31:57 --> 00:31:59 calculations so there's a certain degree
00:31:59 --> 00:32:01 of speculation to try and figure out how
00:32:01 --> 00:32:03 much material is been ejected from the
00:32:03 --> 00:32:05 earth over the time how much it reaches
00:32:05 --> 00:32:07 Venus and to try and put that into a
00:32:07 --> 00:32:11 sense of how many discrete bacteria
00:32:11 --> 00:32:12 would reach Venus in a billion-year
00:32:12 --> 00:32:14 period and they've got this hand waving
00:32:14 --> 00:32:16 number of a billion bacteria in a
00:32:16 --> 00:32:19 billion years now that's showing you how
00:32:19 --> 00:32:21 big deep time is more than anything else
00:32:21 --> 00:32:22 and what they say is that doesn't mean
00:32:22 --> 00:32:24 there's one bacterium per year reaching
00:32:24 --> 00:32:26 Venus it'll be clumpy you'll get a rock
00:32:26 --> 00:32:29 delivering tens of thousands at a time
00:32:29 --> 00:32:31 but the idea is that if you've got that
00:32:31 --> 00:32:34 level of delivery going on all it takes
00:32:34 --> 00:32:36 is a very small number of them to be
00:32:36 --> 00:32:39 viable for life to suddenly become
00:32:39 --> 00:32:41 present there now you've then got all
00:32:41 --> 00:32:43 the additional challenges of how does it
00:32:43 --> 00:32:44 get into the atmosphere all the rest of
00:32:44 --> 00:32:47 it but this is just an interesting thing
00:32:47 --> 00:32:50 pointing out again that once you bring
00:32:50 --> 00:32:53 panspermia into the picture you can no
00:32:53 --> 00:32:54 longer say that when we found life
00:32:54 --> 00:32:56 elsewhere in the solar system that means
00:32:56 --> 00:32:59 we've shown that life originated there
00:32:59 --> 00:33:02 um also as a total side point it makes
00:33:02 --> 00:33:05 the efforts we go to in sterilizing our
00:33:05 --> 00:33:08 spacecraft seem less relevant because
00:33:08 --> 00:33:10 for example when we send spacecraft to
00:33:10 --> 00:33:11 Jupiter to the icy moons I can
00:33:11 --> 00:33:13 understand why we're sterilizing this
00:33:13 --> 00:33:15 planetary protection thing but material
00:33:15 --> 00:33:17 from Earth carrying bacteria has been
00:33:17 --> 00:33:19 bombarding those Moons for billions of
00:33:19 --> 00:33:21 years if Earth life is going to get
00:33:21 --> 00:33:23 there it's already there so there's a
00:33:23 --> 00:33:26 lot of interesting spins from this but
00:33:26 --> 00:33:28 it's interesting that an idea that again
00:33:28 --> 00:33:30 when I was young was viewed as being
00:33:30 --> 00:33:32 really stupid and you know extreme and
00:33:32 --> 00:33:35 only talked about by cracks is now
00:33:35 --> 00:33:37 sufficiently mainstream that this kind
00:33:37 --> 00:33:39 of research is going on to investigate
00:33:39 --> 00:33:41 the what ifs and to try and drive on
00:33:41 --> 00:33:44 from that to make predictions you know
00:33:44 --> 00:33:45 the ultimate extent of this is if we
00:33:45 --> 00:33:47 find Life on Mars if we find life on
00:33:47 --> 00:33:50 Venus and we're able to isolate a sample
00:33:50 --> 00:33:52 of it and study it the prediction from
00:33:52 --> 00:33:54 this is that we'd find that it shares a
00:33:54 --> 00:33:56 common Heritage with us a share shares a
00:33:56 --> 00:33:58 common Universal an drug
00:33:59 --> 00:34:02 ass fascinating yeah and uh what do you
00:34:02 --> 00:34:05 like Fred and I have often discussed
00:34:05 --> 00:34:08 this um do you think that day will come
00:34:08 --> 00:34:10 where we might find something and we'll
00:34:10 --> 00:34:12 be able to test whether or not it has a
00:34:12 --> 00:34:14 shared origin we I'm absolutely an
00:34:15 --> 00:34:17 optimist and I think um if there is life
00:34:17 --> 00:34:19 to be found in the solar system we will
00:34:19 --> 00:34:21 find it it's just a question of when
00:34:21 --> 00:34:23 rather than if that is the big question
00:34:23 --> 00:34:26 as if there is life there we've got
00:34:26 --> 00:34:28 places to look you know obviously
00:34:28 --> 00:34:30 with every decade that goes our Focus
00:34:30 --> 00:34:31 shifts a bit because we learn more so
00:34:31 --> 00:34:33 for example if we've been having this
00:34:33 --> 00:34:35 chat a decade ago we' have been talking
00:34:35 --> 00:34:36 about Mars we' have been talking about
00:34:36 --> 00:34:38 the equator of Mars and following what
00:34:38 --> 00:34:40 the wonderful Rover missions are doing
00:34:40 --> 00:34:42 there and then there was that
00:34:42 --> 00:34:44 astonishing discovery of liquid water in
00:34:44 --> 00:34:47 Marza South po C that um an Australian
00:34:47 --> 00:34:49 astronomer Professor gracial caparelli
00:34:49 --> 00:34:51 was very involved with with the Italian
00:34:51 --> 00:34:54 team that did the red ass of this and
00:34:54 --> 00:34:56 suddenly it's harder to get to Mara
00:34:56 --> 00:34:57 South Ball but suddenly that locks
00:34:57 --> 00:34:59 really promising place to go because on
00:34:59 --> 00:35:01 Earth if you drill down into Antarctica
00:35:01 --> 00:35:03 you find these Lakes of liquid water
00:35:03 --> 00:35:04 that have been separated from the rest
00:35:04 --> 00:35:06 of the Earth for ridiculous periods of
00:35:06 --> 00:35:09 time and they're still teaming with life
00:35:09 --> 00:35:11 if Mars ever had life maybe it's still
00:35:11 --> 00:35:13 there in The Waters at the South Pole so
00:35:13 --> 00:35:15 our Focus shifts a little bit we've also
00:35:15 --> 00:35:17 got the icy moons of Jupiter and Saturn
00:35:18 --> 00:35:19 and the more we look the more we realize
00:35:19 --> 00:35:21 there's a lot of places we could look
00:35:21 --> 00:35:24 for life and I'd love to think that 10
00:35:24 --> 00:35:26 years 20 years down the line in a future
00:35:26 --> 00:35:28 Space Nuts episode we'll be talking
00:35:28 --> 00:35:29 about the fact that we've definitely got
00:35:29 --> 00:35:31 some and people are playing with it and
00:35:31 --> 00:35:33 a p tradition to learn more about it
00:35:33 --> 00:35:36 yeah yeah and then it escapes and kills
00:35:36 --> 00:35:38 humans all over the planet yeah oh but
00:35:38 --> 00:35:39 they kill it with shampoo right that was
00:35:39 --> 00:35:41 the way the movie
00:35:41 --> 00:35:44 worked that's right yes just I know the
00:35:44 --> 00:35:49 one you're talking about um uh that
00:35:49 --> 00:35:51 was yeah silly silly film but such a
00:35:51 --> 00:35:54 good Evolution I think was called yeah
00:35:54 --> 00:35:57 that's a great film very funny uh yeah
00:35:57 --> 00:35:59 if you like to read up on Pan spermia
00:35:59 --> 00:36:01 and the uh the new paper that's been
00:36:01 --> 00:36:04 released um it is available online you
00:36:04 --> 00:36:08 can also read the preed version of it at
00:36:08 --> 00:36:10 space.com uh before we go jonty just
00:36:10 --> 00:36:13 quickly uh where are we up to with Comet
00:36:13 --> 00:36:19 2024 G3 AT Atlas is it still alive it is
00:36:19 --> 00:36:20 still alive
00:36:20 --> 00:36:22 fish I appreciate it's a wonderful
00:36:22 --> 00:36:24 non-answer I got some lovely photos of
00:36:24 --> 00:36:27 this Comet back on Sunday evening um
00:36:27 --> 00:36:29 which I'm really pleased with really
00:36:29 --> 00:36:30 happy with I went out last night and
00:36:30 --> 00:36:32 there was one cloud in the sky and it
00:36:32 --> 00:36:34 was right in front of the Comet oh was
00:36:34 --> 00:36:35 the way it goes so I'm going to keep try
00:36:35 --> 00:36:37 the next few nights it's still
00:36:37 --> 00:36:39 relatively easily visible with the naked
00:36:39 --> 00:36:41 eye from Southern Hemisphere locations
00:36:41 --> 00:36:43 but the photos of it people are turning
00:36:43 --> 00:36:46 up from around the globe now are looking
00:36:46 --> 00:36:48 interesting so there is a suggestion
00:36:48 --> 00:36:49 that the snowball at the heart of the
00:36:50 --> 00:36:52 comic the nucleus actually fell apart
00:36:52 --> 00:36:54 and fragmented about a week ago as we
00:36:54 --> 00:36:56 record this the 14th 15th of January
00:36:56 --> 00:36:59 released a ious amount of dust and
00:36:59 --> 00:37:02 because of the nature of how comets work
00:37:02 --> 00:37:04 that means that the comet hasn't really
00:37:04 --> 00:37:06 started to fade yet it's enhance the
00:37:06 --> 00:37:07 comet's tale possibly even making it a
00:37:07 --> 00:37:09 bit more spectacular for us now but
00:37:10 --> 00:37:11 we'll probably hasten the demise of the
00:37:11 --> 00:37:13 Comet and when we were talking about
00:37:13 --> 00:37:15 this previously talked about how if you
00:37:15 --> 00:37:17 managed to live for another 600
00:37:17 --> 00:37:19 years you'd see the comic return that's
00:37:19 --> 00:37:21 looking less likely now I think it's
00:37:21 --> 00:37:25 pretty much done and dusted probably um
00:37:25 --> 00:37:27 but we don't know for sure and we'll
00:37:27 --> 00:37:29 find find out more over the coming week
00:37:29 --> 00:37:30 but in the meantime get out there take
00:37:30 --> 00:37:33 photos because it's a spectacular object
00:37:33 --> 00:37:35 it is reasonably easily visible with the
00:37:35 --> 00:37:37 naked eye if you know where to look
00:37:37 --> 00:37:39 setting currently about an hour and a
00:37:39 --> 00:37:41 quarter hour and 20 minutes after sunset
00:37:41 --> 00:37:42 for those of us in the southern
00:37:42 --> 00:37:44 hemisphere Northern Hemisphere not so
00:37:44 --> 00:37:47 good you can't really see it but on
00:37:47 --> 00:37:49 photographs digital cameras are making a
00:37:49 --> 00:37:51 spectacular job of showing this and
00:37:51 --> 00:37:53 there's some gorgeous images out there
00:37:53 --> 00:37:56 yeah I've just looked at one on sky and
00:37:56 --> 00:38:00 telescope. org and yeah you can see how
00:38:00 --> 00:38:02 the uh the tail has become much more
00:38:02 --> 00:38:06 Vivid and spread out as a consequence of
00:38:06 --> 00:38:09 it's uh well impending demise I suppose
00:38:09 --> 00:38:11 it's an astonishing image on Astronomy
00:38:11 --> 00:38:12 Picture of the Day the wonderful NASA
00:38:12 --> 00:38:15 site for today the 20th of January as
00:38:15 --> 00:38:17 we're recording this showing the comet
00:38:17 --> 00:38:19 as it was going around the Sun through
00:38:19 --> 00:38:21 the lasar camera that somebody's put
00:38:21 --> 00:38:24 together using different filters from
00:38:24 --> 00:38:25 the lascar camera so you've got
00:38:25 --> 00:38:28 different color tales and there's one
00:38:28 --> 00:38:30 three four five six seven different tals
00:38:30 --> 00:38:33 on the comet which is just oh yeah yeah
00:38:34 --> 00:38:36 I can see that now I just got it up that
00:38:36 --> 00:38:37 was when it was only visible in the
00:38:37 --> 00:38:40 daylight sky but it shows you just how
00:38:40 --> 00:38:41 active this thing got because it was so
00:38:41 --> 00:38:43 close to the Sun and there are some
00:38:43 --> 00:38:44 discussions that because it was so
00:38:44 --> 00:38:47 incredibly close in a couple of those
00:38:47 --> 00:38:50 cells are actually probably sodium and
00:38:50 --> 00:38:52 iron how close it got that those kind of
00:38:52 --> 00:38:54 minerals those kind of materials were
00:38:54 --> 00:38:57 getting erupted from the surface from
00:38:57 --> 00:38:59 Tails not just water ice and a little
00:38:59 --> 00:39:02 bit of gas yeah fascinating I I had I
00:39:02 --> 00:39:04 tried to have a look yesterday but I
00:39:04 --> 00:39:07 think I was a bit too early but um I
00:39:07 --> 00:39:09 will make an effort and the other thing
00:39:09 --> 00:39:11 that people are getting excited about
00:39:11 --> 00:39:13 although you you're suggesting this is a
00:39:13 --> 00:39:16 bit premature is the um the upcoming
00:39:16 --> 00:39:17 planetary
00:39:17 --> 00:39:19 alignment yeah which is not something
00:39:19 --> 00:39:21 that is anywhere near as rare as a media
00:39:21 --> 00:39:24 is making it out to be but the idea here
00:39:24 --> 00:39:26 is the planets are lining so your first
00:39:26 --> 00:39:28 s is oh that's great if I got my
00:39:28 --> 00:39:29 binoculars I could see them all in the
00:39:29 --> 00:39:31 same field of view and what it actually
00:39:31 --> 00:39:33 is is that they're all in the same 180
00:39:33 --> 00:39:36 Dee Arc of the sky so if you were out a
00:39:36 --> 00:39:38 little bit after Sunset you could see
00:39:38 --> 00:39:40 all the naked eye planets and if you got
00:39:40 --> 00:39:42 your binoculars and a telescope out you
00:39:42 --> 00:39:44 could see your andron as well all at the
00:39:44 --> 00:39:47 same time what the coverage has left out
00:39:47 --> 00:39:49 is that mercury is actually not joining
00:39:49 --> 00:39:50 the party at the minute so this is
00:39:50 --> 00:39:51 viewed as being the evening Sky after
00:39:51 --> 00:39:53 Sunset the first thing you'll see is
00:39:53 --> 00:39:55 Venus Saturn's right next to it
00:39:55 --> 00:39:57 Jupiter's High to the northwards in the
00:39:57 --> 00:39:58 southern hemisphere to the South for
00:39:58 --> 00:40:00 those in the northern hemisphere Mars is
00:40:00 --> 00:40:03 rising over to the east it's just past
00:40:03 --> 00:40:05 opposition they're all there Uranus and
00:40:05 --> 00:40:07 neun are over roughly in the same part
00:40:07 --> 00:40:09 on the sky as Saturn and Venus so you
00:40:09 --> 00:40:10 can find them with binocular in the
00:40:10 --> 00:40:12 telescope but Mercury is currently
00:40:12 --> 00:40:14 visible in the morning sky for Mercury
00:40:14 --> 00:40:16 to join the party we've got to wait
00:40:16 --> 00:40:17 another month and that's going to be at
00:40:17 --> 00:40:20 the end of February so maybe if you you
00:40:20 --> 00:40:22 know Comet Atlas which is satellite of
00:40:22 --> 00:40:25 the Horizon is masquerading as mercury
00:40:25 --> 00:40:26 for the purposes of the current
00:40:26 --> 00:40:28 discussion I guess giving is a number of
00:40:29 --> 00:40:30 things to see but if you really want to
00:40:30 --> 00:40:32 see all of them at once you're going to
00:40:32 --> 00:40:35 have to wait till A month's time and at
00:40:35 --> 00:40:37 that point Saturn and Mercury and Venus
00:40:37 --> 00:40:39 will be a fair bit lower to the Horizon
00:40:39 --> 00:40:41 a little bit hard at the spot but then
00:40:41 --> 00:40:43 you will be able to see all the naked
00:40:43 --> 00:40:45 eye planets all at once in the sky at
00:40:45 --> 00:40:46 the same time and then you'll go well
00:40:46 --> 00:40:48 the spread out over 180 degrees isn't
00:40:48 --> 00:40:49 that
00:40:49 --> 00:40:52 pretty yeah I definitely want to have a
00:40:53 --> 00:40:55 look at that uh and uh yeah we got
00:40:55 --> 00:40:57 plenty of time to do it so absolutely
00:40:57 --> 00:40:59 yeah fantastic all right uh thank you
00:40:59 --> 00:41:01 Johny as always don't forget if you
00:41:01 --> 00:41:03 would like to follow up on those stories
00:41:03 --> 00:41:05 you can do that in our show notes don't
00:41:05 --> 00:41:07 forget to visit us online at SPAC nuts
00:41:07 --> 00:41:09 podcast.com or SPAC
00:41:09 --> 00:41:13 nuts.i and check out our various Pages
00:41:13 --> 00:41:15 including our shop which is full of um
00:41:15 --> 00:41:17 all sorts of junk uh stuff uh really
00:41:17 --> 00:41:20 good stuff um that you can um take a
00:41:20 --> 00:41:23 peek at uh thanks Johnny as always uh
00:41:23 --> 00:41:25 we'll catch you on the very next episode
00:41:25 --> 00:41:27 pleasure thanks for having me Johnny
00:41:27 --> 00:41:29 Horner professor of astrophysics
00:41:29 --> 00:41:32 standing in for Professor Fred Watson
00:41:32 --> 00:41:34 and thanks to here in the studio who
00:41:34 --> 00:41:36 didn't turn up today because he actually
00:41:36 --> 00:41:39 got a free ticket on a spacecraft called
00:41:39 --> 00:41:42 ship and for me Andrew Dunley thanks for
00:41:42 --> 00:41:45 your company we'll see you on the next
00:41:45 --> 00:41:48 episode of Space Nuts until then byebye
00:41:49 --> 00:41:51 Space Nuts you'll be listening to the
00:41:51 --> 00:41:53 Space Nuts
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