00:00:00 --> 00:00:02 Hello again, Andrew Dunley here from
00:00:02 --> 00:00:04 Space Nuts, where we talk astronomy and
00:00:04 --> 00:00:06 space science. Good to have your
00:00:06 --> 00:00:08 company. Coming up on this episode, we
00:00:08 --> 00:00:10 are going to talk about the moon. It's
00:00:10 --> 00:00:12 got a near side, it's got a far side,
00:00:12 --> 00:00:14 but we're going to talk about the
00:00:14 --> 00:00:17 inside. Uh, it's the discovery of the
00:00:17 --> 00:00:20 Grail mission. Uh, which means what
00:00:20 --> 00:00:23 we're talking about is a flesh wound.
00:00:23 --> 00:00:25 Uh, another Hubble tension, think about
00:00:25 --> 00:00:27 it, another Hubble tension theory, and
00:00:27 --> 00:00:30 we're talking evolution this time. And a
00:00:30 --> 00:00:33 triple system in the Kyper belt. So,
00:00:33 --> 00:00:36 buckle up for this episode of Space
00:00:36 --> 00:00:39 Nuts. 15 seconds. Guidance is internal.
00:00:39 --> 00:00:43 10 9 Ignition sequence start. Space
00:00:43 --> 00:00:50 Nuts. 5 4 3 2 1 2 3 4 5 2 1 Space Nuts.
00:00:50 --> 00:00:53 Astronauts report. It feels good. And
00:00:53 --> 00:00:55 back with us again is Professor Fred
00:00:55 --> 00:00:57 Watson, astronomer at large. Hello,
00:00:57 --> 00:01:00 Fred. Hello, Andrew. Hello. It took me a
00:01:00 --> 00:01:02 couple couple of seconds, but I did get
00:01:02 --> 00:01:04 the to get the um flesh flesh wound.
00:01:04 --> 00:01:06 Flesh wound the grail mission. It's only
00:01:06 --> 00:01:08 a flesh wound. It's only a flesh wound.
00:01:08 --> 00:01:12 That's right. Oh dear. No arms, no legs,
00:01:12 --> 00:01:14 but nothing flesh wound. That's a flesh
00:01:14 --> 00:01:18 wound. Um so yes, that I I can't help
00:01:18 --> 00:01:23 dad jokes and and and that I I when I do
00:01:23 --> 00:01:25 the presentations at golf on Fridays,
00:01:25 --> 00:01:28 which has become my job somehow, um I
00:01:28 --> 00:01:30 always have to finish on a dad joke.
00:01:30 --> 00:01:33 It's just become a thing. Yes. So, yes,
00:01:33 --> 00:01:35 I'm sure it has. The reputation
00:01:35 --> 00:01:37 continues to spread. Uh we'll be talking
00:01:37 --> 00:01:41 dad jokes in our next episode, our Q&A
00:01:41 --> 00:01:44 episode as well. Uh we should begin with
00:01:44 --> 00:01:47 this um Grail mission and the findings
00:01:47 --> 00:01:51 of the moon's unusual interior. This uh
00:01:51 --> 00:01:53 might come as a surprise to some
00:01:53 --> 00:01:56 people. Well, I think it does. Excuse
00:01:56 --> 00:01:58 me. I think it did come as a surprise
00:01:58 --> 00:01:59 when the discovery was made as well.
00:01:59 --> 00:02:02 These are um scientists from NASA and
00:02:02 --> 00:02:03 other
00:02:03 --> 00:02:06 institutions. Um yeah, let's do the dad
00:02:06 --> 00:02:09 joke first. The uh it's not Montipython
00:02:09 --> 00:02:11 and the Holy Grail.
00:02:11 --> 00:02:15 Uh GRA stands for gravity recovery and
00:02:15 --> 00:02:17 interior laboratory. Uh and it was a
00:02:17 --> 00:02:20 mission uh which I guess it was more
00:02:20 --> 00:02:23 than it's probably a decade ago. Um uh
00:02:23 --> 00:02:27 it's a very very neat uh piece of
00:02:27 --> 00:02:29 research and NASA you know the clever
00:02:29 --> 00:02:31 stuff that they do is just unbelievable.
00:02:31 --> 00:02:34 Uh so what do you do if you want to
00:02:34 --> 00:02:37 sense the gravity of um a planet that
00:02:38 --> 00:02:39 you're flying over? you want to map out
00:02:39 --> 00:02:43 the gravitational details and by doing
00:02:43 --> 00:02:44 that you can work out what's underneath
00:02:44 --> 00:02:47 the surface uh because that's usually
00:02:47 --> 00:02:49 what affects the gravity above the
00:02:49 --> 00:02:52 surface of a of a of a planet and I'm
00:02:52 --> 00:02:54 talking now about you know really minor
00:02:54 --> 00:02:58 minor um um differences and
00:02:58 --> 00:03:01 discrepancies in in gravity uh how the
00:03:01 --> 00:03:04 Grail mission worked uh and I'm kind of
00:03:04 --> 00:03:07 casting my memory back now um two
00:03:07 --> 00:03:11 spacecraft uh in orbit around the moon
00:03:11 --> 00:03:13 separate in the same they're both in the
00:03:13 --> 00:03:15 same orbit. They were separated I think
00:03:15 --> 00:03:18 by about 200 kilometers one in front of
00:03:18 --> 00:03:23 the other but the distance between them
00:03:23 --> 00:03:25 could be detected by microwave
00:03:25 --> 00:03:28 transmission to well under a millimeter.
00:03:28 --> 00:03:30 I can't remember what it was. It was a
00:03:30 --> 00:03:33 few microns I think. Uh but this tiny
00:03:33 --> 00:03:36 tiny difference between the position of
00:03:36 --> 00:03:38 the two spacecraft, you can measure it
00:03:38 --> 00:03:41 uh by these microwave signals. And so as
00:03:41 --> 00:03:44 the two spacecraft go around the moon,
00:03:44 --> 00:03:47 their separation changes slightly as a
00:03:47 --> 00:03:49 result of the gravitational
00:03:49 --> 00:03:51 gravitational pull of the terrain
00:03:51 --> 00:03:56 beneath them. Uh and it actually is uh
00:03:56 --> 00:03:58 uh a really very sensitive way. I love
00:03:58 --> 00:04:01 the fact that they rediscovered uh
00:04:01 --> 00:04:03 something that we talked about in the
00:04:03 --> 00:04:05 very earliest uh history of moon
00:04:05 --> 00:04:07 exploration back in the uh Geminy and
00:04:07 --> 00:04:11 Apollo era back in the 19 uh60s uh
00:04:11 --> 00:04:14 masscons which were mass concentrations
00:04:14 --> 00:04:15 concentrations of mass that were
00:04:15 --> 00:04:17 unexpected underneath the moon's
00:04:17 --> 00:04:19 surface. They were actually measured
00:04:19 --> 00:04:21 just by spacecraft that were orbiting
00:04:21 --> 00:04:24 single spacecraft orbiting uh the moon.
00:04:24 --> 00:04:26 Uh but uh Gra actually mapped them out
00:04:26 --> 00:04:28 in much more detail. We know a lot more
00:04:28 --> 00:04:30 about these maskons now than we did
00:04:30 --> 00:04:34 before. Uh but what has happened uh uh
00:04:34 --> 00:04:36 and by the way I should just mention one
00:04:36 --> 00:04:39 uh I should have put this in as a as a
00:04:39 --> 00:04:41 quirky factoid, shouldn't I? Philippant
00:04:41 --> 00:04:45 factoid that the two uh spacecraft, the
00:04:45 --> 00:04:46 two components of Grail, do you remember
00:04:46 --> 00:04:49 what they were called?
00:04:49 --> 00:04:54 Oh no. Eb and flow. Uh, and it ca I
00:04:54 --> 00:04:56 think it was school kids who did that.
00:04:56 --> 00:04:58 If I remember rightly, NASA sent out a
00:04:58 --> 00:04:59 competition saying we've got two
00:05:00 --> 00:05:01 spacecraft in orbit around the moon.
00:05:01 --> 00:05:02 What do you want to call them? And they
00:05:02 --> 00:05:05 were called eb and flow. Uh, which is
00:05:05 --> 00:05:08 very very nice indeed. Anyway, eb and
00:05:08 --> 00:05:13 flow uh in combination uh measured uh
00:05:13 --> 00:05:15 virtually the gravitational map of the
00:05:15 --> 00:05:19 whole moon. But what has come to light
00:05:19 --> 00:05:22 is something a little bit more subtle.
00:05:22 --> 00:05:25 uh these uh researchers who've now used
00:05:25 --> 00:05:29 these NASA data to deduce that there's a
00:05:29 --> 00:05:30 2 to
00:05:30 --> 00:05:36 3% difference in the ability of the
00:05:36 --> 00:05:38 lunar mantle. Now that's the layer below
00:05:38 --> 00:05:40 the crust. That's the layer that
00:05:40 --> 00:05:42 surrounds the core of the moon. The
00:05:42 --> 00:05:48 ability of the mantle to deform. So what
00:05:48 --> 00:05:50 you're saying is there's a difference in
00:05:50 --> 00:05:53 sort of flexibility from one side of the
00:05:53 --> 00:05:55 moon to the other. And remember as we
00:05:55 --> 00:05:57 know the moon always faces the same side
00:05:57 --> 00:06:00 to earth. Uh and so that's you know
00:06:00 --> 00:06:01 there's a different gravitational pull
00:06:01 --> 00:06:03 on one side from what there is on the
00:06:03 --> 00:06:05 other. Um but what they've interpreted
00:06:05 --> 00:06:09 this difference as being they say it's
00:06:09 --> 00:06:11 symptomatic. the fact that there's this
00:06:11 --> 00:06:14 difference in the moon's mantle's
00:06:14 --> 00:06:17 ability to to deform, to change its
00:06:17 --> 00:06:20 shape. Uh they say that is best
00:06:20 --> 00:06:25 explained by the temperature inside the
00:06:25 --> 00:06:29 mantle on the near side being as much as
00:06:29 --> 00:06:33 170° C hotter than what it is on the
00:06:33 --> 00:06:36 other side. Wow. The side facing us.
00:06:36 --> 00:06:37 Yeah, it is. It's not a small amount.
00:06:37 --> 00:06:40 It's not a few degrees. It's a lot. Um,
00:06:40 --> 00:06:42 and and it's enough to change the
00:06:42 --> 00:06:44 viscosity of the mantle. Uh, how
00:06:44 --> 00:06:48 flexible it is. Uh, and so that's the
00:06:48 --> 00:06:51 new finding that's come from Eb and
00:06:51 --> 00:06:52 flow. And I think what they're saying is
00:06:52 --> 00:06:55 that the spacecraft was in orbit for
00:06:55 --> 00:06:57 long enough that it could detect
00:06:57 --> 00:06:59 differences in the gravitational pull.
00:07:00 --> 00:07:01 As it flew over the same part of the
00:07:02 --> 00:07:03 moon more than once, it could see a
00:07:03 --> 00:07:05 difference in the gravitational pull
00:07:05 --> 00:07:07 from one trip to another. So there's a
00:07:07 --> 00:07:09 time dependent thing on it and that's
00:07:09 --> 00:07:12 how they know about the moon's ability
00:07:12 --> 00:07:14 to deform. I'm actually interpreting
00:07:14 --> 00:07:17 that in my own way. This there's a a
00:07:17 --> 00:07:20 nice paper in Nature magazine perhaps
00:07:20 --> 00:07:22 the one of the two leading journals for
00:07:22 --> 00:07:24 science in the world which has the title
00:07:24 --> 00:07:27 of thermal asymmetry in the moon's
00:07:27 --> 00:07:29 mantle inferred from monthly tidal
00:07:29 --> 00:07:33 response. Okay. So my question straight
00:07:33 --> 00:07:37 up is could that explain or does that
00:07:37 --> 00:07:40 explain why the near side and the far
00:07:40 --> 00:07:43 side of the moon are so very different
00:07:43 --> 00:07:45 uh when you're talking topography? Yeah,
00:07:45 --> 00:07:47 I I think it's the other way around. I
00:07:47 --> 00:07:51 suspect the difference in topography is
00:07:51 --> 00:07:53 uh what causes the difference. Although
00:07:53 --> 00:07:57 they're probably all mish mish mashed up
00:07:57 --> 00:07:59 um
00:07:59 --> 00:08:02 into the same sort of thing, but the the
00:08:02 --> 00:08:06 moon's near side um I think you probably
00:08:06 --> 00:08:08 the way you've put it actually Andrew is
00:08:08 --> 00:08:09 probably more correct. The moon's near
00:08:09 --> 00:08:13 side uh has had much more volcanic
00:08:13 --> 00:08:16 activity than the far side. This is
00:08:16 --> 00:08:17 between three and four billion years
00:08:17 --> 00:08:19 ago. It was highly volcanically active,
00:08:19 --> 00:08:21 which is why we've got all these lava
00:08:21 --> 00:08:23 flows on the near side, which we see as
00:08:23 --> 00:08:25 the maria, the gray the gray patches on
00:08:25 --> 00:08:29 the moon. Um, but the the details of
00:08:29 --> 00:08:32 what these researchers think con
00:08:32 --> 00:08:35 contributes to the the difference in
00:08:35 --> 00:08:38 temperature. Uh, they suggest I might
00:08:38 --> 00:08:40 actually I think this is nature's press
00:08:40 --> 00:08:42 release, so I might just read straight
00:08:42 --> 00:08:47 from it. Um uh they hypothesize that
00:08:47 --> 00:08:49 this thermal difference could be
00:08:49 --> 00:08:51 sustained by radioactive decay of
00:08:51 --> 00:08:54 thorium and titanium within the moon's
00:08:54 --> 00:08:57 near side which could be a remnant of
00:08:57 --> 00:08:59 the volcanic activity that formed the
00:08:59 --> 00:09:01 near side surface 3 to four billion
00:09:01 --> 00:09:03 years ago.
00:09:03 --> 00:09:06 That is really interesting. Yeah, it's I
00:09:06 --> 00:09:09 I'm fascinated fascinated by a couple of
00:09:09 --> 00:09:11 things that we're using old data to make
00:09:11 --> 00:09:13 new discoveries. We've talked about that
00:09:13 --> 00:09:16 in other uh studies that have or papers
00:09:16 --> 00:09:19 that have been released in recent years.
00:09:19 --> 00:09:22 Uh also the fact that um there's effects
00:09:22 --> 00:09:25 on the moon that we see in other parts
00:09:25 --> 00:09:28 of the solar system um with with
00:09:28 --> 00:09:33 variations in uh the way the moons uh
00:09:33 --> 00:09:35 interact with their host planet for
00:09:35 --> 00:09:38 example. I suppose it's a similar
00:09:38 --> 00:09:40 situation is it not? Yes, that's right.
00:09:40 --> 00:09:43 So you've got um and in fact most of
00:09:43 --> 00:09:45 these moons around the certainly the
00:09:45 --> 00:09:48 giant planets are uh which is where most
00:09:48 --> 00:09:50 of the moons in the solar system are u
00:09:50 --> 00:09:52 there's only three on the in the inner
00:09:52 --> 00:09:54 solar system ours and Mars is two little
00:09:54 --> 00:09:57 little satellites but places like
00:09:57 --> 00:10:00 Enceladus Ganymede perhaps Kalisto uh
00:10:00 --> 00:10:02 Europa around Jupiter perhaps Titan as
00:10:02 --> 00:10:07 well um they they
00:10:07 --> 00:10:12 uh could do use this technology ology to
00:10:12 --> 00:10:15 actually interpret what's going on
00:10:15 --> 00:10:17 inside these worlds without having to
00:10:17 --> 00:10:19 land a spacecraft on the surface. That's
00:10:19 --> 00:10:22 the that's the the great thing because
00:10:22 --> 00:10:23 putting something into orbit around
00:10:23 --> 00:10:27 Enceladus for example um would be much
00:10:27 --> 00:10:30 more straightforward, much less energy
00:10:30 --> 00:10:32 hungry than putting a spacecraft down
00:10:32 --> 00:10:34 onto the surface where you've got all
00:10:34 --> 00:10:37 the risks of collisions and tipping over
00:10:37 --> 00:10:39 like several of the Luna probes have
00:10:39 --> 00:10:41 done. They've fallen over. Yeah. Uh all
00:10:42 --> 00:10:44 of that is the hazard when you're
00:10:44 --> 00:10:46 landing something on the surface. So
00:10:46 --> 00:10:48 yeah, I um I think it's a it's got a
00:10:48 --> 00:10:52 future now. Um you can as I kind of
00:10:52 --> 00:10:53 mentioned earlier, you can do some of
00:10:54 --> 00:10:56 this kind of work with a single
00:10:56 --> 00:10:58 spacecraft, but if you can launch two
00:10:58 --> 00:11:00 with this microwave microwave bridge
00:11:00 --> 00:11:02 between them, then you can do much much
00:11:02 --> 00:11:06 more as as the the Grail spacecraft
00:11:06 --> 00:11:09 demonstrated. Okay. So um yeah, the moon
00:11:09 --> 00:11:11 is not as it seems, at least on not on
00:11:11 --> 00:11:14 the inside. Well, no, that's right. Or
00:11:14 --> 00:11:17 maybe maybe it is as it seems because
00:11:17 --> 00:11:19 the two sides are so different when you
00:11:19 --> 00:11:21 look at them. As you said, the top the
00:11:21 --> 00:11:23 topography is quite different from one
00:11:23 --> 00:11:25 side to the other. Yeah, it's a great
00:11:25 --> 00:11:27 story. If you'd like to read up on that,
00:11:27 --> 00:11:29 uh you can well you can go find the
00:11:29 --> 00:11:30 paper if you can remember the title of
00:11:30 --> 00:11:32 it cuz it's got more more than three
00:11:32 --> 00:11:34 words in it. So I'm stuffed. But uh
00:11:34 --> 00:11:37 yeah, daily galaxy.com is the website.
00:11:37 --> 00:11:39 daily
00:11:39 --> 00:11:41 galaxy.com. This is Space Nuts with
00:11:41 --> 00:11:47 Andrew Dunley and Professor Fred Watson.
00:11:47 --> 00:11:52 Three, two, one. Space Nuts. Um, Fred, I
00:11:52 --> 00:11:55 neglected to mention my office
00:11:55 --> 00:11:57 background at the beginning. Uh, if I
00:11:57 --> 00:11:59 just put my thumb over the camera,
00:11:59 --> 00:12:02 people on YouTube will see a massive
00:12:02 --> 00:12:04 mountain there. That's the Fugo volcano
00:12:04 --> 00:12:06 in Guatemala. I took that photo on the
00:12:06 --> 00:12:10 7th of April. And uh Judy and I have a
00:12:10 --> 00:12:12 history of visiting volcanoes, getting
00:12:12 --> 00:12:13 home, and then finding out they started
00:12:13 --> 00:12:15 erupting. And that's exactly what's
00:12:15 --> 00:12:17 happened with Fugo. So if you're on
00:12:17 --> 00:12:19 YouTube and you're watching us when
00:12:19 --> 00:12:21 we're finished, go and have a look at
00:12:21 --> 00:12:23 some of the eruption footage from the
00:12:23 --> 00:12:25 Fugo volcano in Guatemala at the moment.
00:12:25 --> 00:12:28 It is spectacular. We had to drive
00:12:28 --> 00:12:31 between three volcanoes to get to the
00:12:31 --> 00:12:34 township of Antigua. And you could see
00:12:34 --> 00:12:37 these things for miles. I mean, they're
00:12:37 --> 00:12:39 strata volcanoes. They are absolutely
00:12:39 --> 00:12:43 enormous. They're around 12, 13 ft
00:12:43 --> 00:12:47 at the peak above sea level. Um, and
00:12:47 --> 00:12:49 they are spectacular. And we literally
00:12:49 --> 00:12:51 had to drive between two of them to get
00:12:51 --> 00:12:54 to the town. That one was on our left
00:12:54 --> 00:12:57 and the Awa volcano was on our right.
00:12:57 --> 00:12:59 Uh, and the town is in the foothills of
00:12:59 --> 00:13:03 the um the two nearest volcanoes. And
00:13:03 --> 00:13:06 it's just an awe inspiring site. But um
00:13:06 --> 00:13:08 I just thought it was funny that um well
00:13:08 --> 00:13:10 maybe not funny haha but funny that we
00:13:10 --> 00:13:13 went to Hawaii got home and Kilawea
00:13:13 --> 00:13:15 erupted. Happens a lot. Uh went to
00:13:15 --> 00:13:18 Vanuatu Mount Yasa got home it erupted
00:13:18 --> 00:13:20 and stopped air traffic for a couple of
00:13:20 --> 00:13:22 weeks and now this one's erupting a
00:13:22 --> 00:13:25 month after we were there. So we're not
00:13:25 --> 00:13:26 going to be invited back I don't think.
00:13:26 --> 00:13:30 But uh Fugo's got a history though. It
00:13:30 --> 00:13:32 erupts quite often. But I just thought
00:13:32 --> 00:13:33 people would be interested to see a
00:13:33 --> 00:13:35 photo of it. Uh, as you know, I'm a
00:13:36 --> 00:13:38 volcano junkie.
00:13:38 --> 00:13:40 So, when we were in Iceland earlier in
00:13:40 --> 00:13:43 the year, uh, the Rakenis Peninsula had
00:13:43 --> 00:13:46 just erupted as well. Yeah. Well, here
00:13:46 --> 00:13:48 there was a lot of steam coming up from
00:13:48 --> 00:13:49 uh from the, you know, the fishes in the
00:13:50 --> 00:13:52 ground. Yeah. In the next few months,
00:13:52 --> 00:13:55 we'll be v visiting the Canary Islands.
00:13:55 --> 00:13:58 Ah, so yeah. So, that one's got an
00:13:58 --> 00:14:00 active volcano. And we're visiting
00:14:00 --> 00:14:04 Iceland as well. Um, yeah. could could
00:14:04 --> 00:14:07 have some stories to tell. Yeah, could.
00:14:07 --> 00:14:09 Okay, Fred, let's move on to our next
00:14:09 --> 00:14:13 story. And this one is about yet again
00:14:13 --> 00:14:17 uh the Hubble tension, the the quirk of
00:14:17 --> 00:14:20 uh space that we can't quite get our
00:14:20 --> 00:14:22 heads around. We can't solve the
00:14:22 --> 00:14:24 differentials or the problems. Many are
00:14:24 --> 00:14:27 saying, look, it's it's natural, but uh
00:14:27 --> 00:14:30 now another another Hubble tension
00:14:30 --> 00:14:33 theory. G, that's hard to say. um is uh
00:14:33 --> 00:14:36 is making its way into various papers.
00:14:36 --> 00:14:38 Uh one in particular, I suspect because
00:14:38 --> 00:14:42 um now they're talking about um
00:14:42 --> 00:14:46 evolution in dark matter. This sounds
00:14:46 --> 00:14:49 like pie in the sky type stuff, but um
00:14:50 --> 00:14:51 we've got to we've got to come up with
00:14:51 --> 00:14:53 answers. The only way is is to publish
00:14:53 --> 00:14:57 papers with theories and, you know, toss
00:14:57 --> 00:14:59 it around.
00:14:59 --> 00:15:02 Indeed. That's right. like like a salad.
00:15:02 --> 00:15:04 A space
00:15:04 --> 00:15:05 salad.
00:15:05 --> 00:15:08 Um yeah, I've just um I'm I'm hesitating
00:15:08 --> 00:15:10 because I've just seen who one of the
00:15:10 --> 00:15:13 authors of this paper is.
00:15:13 --> 00:15:16 Uh it's a scientist who's known for
00:15:16 --> 00:15:20 provocative papers. He's Avi Lurb and
00:15:20 --> 00:15:23 he's at Harvard Smithsonian
00:15:23 --> 00:15:27 uh um center for astrophysics. So, uh,
00:15:27 --> 00:15:29 the the paper that we're talking about
00:15:29 --> 00:15:31 is called evolving dark energy or
00:15:31 --> 00:15:33 evolving dark
00:15:33 --> 00:15:36 matter. Um, and, uh, it is, this is
00:15:36 --> 00:15:39 really esoteric stuff, Andrew. We're
00:15:39 --> 00:15:40 always when we're talking about this
00:15:40 --> 00:15:44 stuff, we're we're just glossing over uh
00:15:44 --> 00:15:48 a lot of really detailed
00:15:48 --> 00:15:51 uh science that uh it goes into realms
00:15:51 --> 00:15:54 that um even I struggle with and I'm not
00:15:54 --> 00:15:57 actually a cosmologist, which is why,
00:15:57 --> 00:15:58 but I'm supposed to know my way around
00:15:58 --> 00:16:01 some of these topics uh better than
00:16:01 --> 00:16:05 perhaps the person in the street is. Um
00:16:06 --> 00:16:09 and it's uh it's this comes down to
00:16:09 --> 00:16:11 something called the equation of state
00:16:11 --> 00:16:13 which you and I haven't talked about but
00:16:13 --> 00:16:16 the equation of state is a parameter in
00:16:16 --> 00:16:18 the universe or it's a parameter
00:16:18 --> 00:16:21 generally it comes from thermodynamics
00:16:21 --> 00:16:25 uh where which essentially um
00:16:25 --> 00:16:28 characterizes as the name almost implies
00:16:28 --> 00:16:31 it characterizes the overall behavior of
00:16:31 --> 00:16:33 the universe the equation of state okay
00:16:33 --> 00:16:36 symbolized by the the character
00:16:36 --> 00:16:37 W.
00:16:37 --> 00:16:42 Um, so, uh, the the the work that's
00:16:42 --> 00:16:45 being reported here, uh, and as I've
00:16:45 --> 00:16:49 said, it's on a on a there's a there's a
00:16:49 --> 00:16:52 basically a a pre-print, as we used to
00:16:52 --> 00:16:55 call them. Uh this is a a paper that's
00:16:55 --> 00:16:59 not yet been refereed uh which is going
00:16:59 --> 00:17:02 to go into I can't see what journal it's
00:17:02 --> 00:17:08 aiming for but uh it is called uh
00:17:08 --> 00:17:10 essentially the the title of the paper
00:17:10 --> 00:17:12 evolving dark energy or evolving dark
00:17:12 --> 00:17:14 matter. I'm going to read you the the
00:17:14 --> 00:17:18 abstract. Okay. um because that kind of
00:17:18 --> 00:17:20 tells the story even if you don't know
00:17:20 --> 00:17:24 what the details are. We show that the
00:17:24 --> 00:17:26 latest empirical constraints on
00:17:26 --> 00:17:30 cosmology and by that they mean measured
00:17:30 --> 00:17:32 uh from a combination of DESI that's the
00:17:32 --> 00:17:35 dark energy survey instrument CMBB
00:17:35 --> 00:17:37 that's the cosmic microwave background
00:17:37 --> 00:17:40 and supernova data that's exploding
00:17:40 --> 00:17:42 stars they've taken all this data
00:17:42 --> 00:17:44 together the empirical constraints on
00:17:44 --> 00:17:47 cosmology from that combination can be
00:17:47 --> 00:17:50 accounted for if a small component of
00:17:50 --> 00:17:54 dark matter has an evolving and
00:17:54 --> 00:17:57 oscillating equation of state within the
00:17:57 --> 00:17:59 range minus one is greater than less
00:18:00 --> 00:18:02 than w which is less than one. That's
00:18:02 --> 00:18:05 the range minus1 to 1 is somewhere where
00:18:05 --> 00:18:08 this equation of state parameter w lies.
00:18:08 --> 00:18:10 From a fundamental physics perspective,
00:18:10 --> 00:18:13 this interpretation is more appealing
00:18:13 --> 00:18:15 than an evolving phantom dark energy
00:18:15 --> 00:18:18 with w less than minus one which
00:18:18 --> 00:18:22 violates the null energy condition. So
00:18:22 --> 00:18:25 the in a sense this paper is kind of in
00:18:25 --> 00:18:28 response to what we're seeing from the
00:18:28 --> 00:18:31 latest data actually from DESI the dark
00:18:31 --> 00:18:36 energy survey um which suggests that
00:18:36 --> 00:18:40 dark energy is uh getting less or at
00:18:40 --> 00:18:41 least what it suggests is the
00:18:42 --> 00:18:44 acceleration of the universe's expansion
00:18:44 --> 00:18:47 is getting less. In other words, the
00:18:47 --> 00:18:49 expansion, which we know is accelerating
00:18:49 --> 00:18:51 because that's been well measured, but
00:18:51 --> 00:18:54 the suggestion is that that acceleration
00:18:54 --> 00:18:57 is slowing down. So, as time goes on, it
00:18:57 --> 00:19:00 will be accelerating at a lower rate.
00:19:00 --> 00:19:02 What they're saying is uh when you look
00:19:02 --> 00:19:05 at the sort of theory that doesn't make
00:19:05 --> 00:19:08 sense, but it makes more sense if
00:19:08 --> 00:19:12 something is going on with dark matter.
00:19:12 --> 00:19:16 that dark matter is um is it self
00:19:16 --> 00:19:20 evolving. Now that suggests and they
00:19:20 --> 00:19:22 apparently explore this in the paper. I
00:19:22 --> 00:19:24 haven't read the paper but they they
00:19:24 --> 00:19:26 explore this that suggests that dark
00:19:26 --> 00:19:29 matter is something different from what
00:19:29 --> 00:19:31 we think it is because we imagine dark
00:19:31 --> 00:19:34 matter as being some subatomic particle
00:19:34 --> 00:19:37 uh which is as yet unknown which does
00:19:37 --> 00:19:39 not interact with normal matter at all
00:19:39 --> 00:19:42 which is why we can't see it. uh and all
00:19:42 --> 00:19:44 it reveals itself by is its gravity.
00:19:44 --> 00:19:46 That's that's the parameters that we
00:19:46 --> 00:19:48 understand dark matter to be. But what
00:19:48 --> 00:19:52 they're suggestion suggesting is that
00:19:52 --> 00:19:55 this is something even more exotic than
00:19:55 --> 00:19:57 we have been imagining
00:19:57 --> 00:20:01 uh because its parameters change its
00:20:01 --> 00:20:04 phenomena change uh and that leads to a
00:20:04 --> 00:20:07 changed equation of state the the W
00:20:07 --> 00:20:09 parameter.
00:20:09 --> 00:20:14 So, and and they they actually uh
00:20:14 --> 00:20:16 suggest that actually there's there's
00:20:16 --> 00:20:18 some sort of oscillation going on in it
00:20:18 --> 00:20:20 as well, not just dark matter. Uh
00:20:20 --> 00:20:22 there's a very nice article on
00:20:22 --> 00:20:24 physicsf.org
00:20:24 --> 00:20:28 uh by Brian Kerbaline. Uh I'm going to
00:20:28 --> 00:20:32 read a par a paragraph for it.
00:20:32 --> 00:20:34 Um in fact, I'm going to read a couple.
00:20:34 --> 00:20:37 Let me just uh let me just read from
00:20:38 --> 00:20:39 this because I think that's going to
00:20:39 --> 00:20:42 explain it better than me waffling on.
00:20:42 --> 00:20:44 Uh in work published on the archive
00:20:44 --> 00:20:46 preprint server, the authors look at
00:20:46 --> 00:20:48 both evolving dark energy and evolving
00:20:48 --> 00:20:51 dark matter and argue that the latter is
00:20:51 --> 00:20:52 a much better fit to the observational
00:20:52 --> 00:20:54 data. The first thing they note is that
00:20:54 --> 00:20:56 the two models are somewhat related
00:20:56 --> 00:20:58 since the evolution of the cosmos
00:20:58 --> 00:21:00 depends in part on the ratio of dark
00:21:00 --> 00:21:03 energy to matter density. A model with
00:21:03 --> 00:21:05 constant dark matter, which is what we
00:21:05 --> 00:21:07 have at the moment, an evolving dark
00:21:07 --> 00:21:10 energy, uh, will always appear similar
00:21:10 --> 00:21:13 to a model with evolving dark matter and
00:21:13 --> 00:21:15 a constant dark energy. It's a good
00:21:15 --> 00:21:17 point. They then go on to explore the
00:21:17 --> 00:21:19 idea of some kind of exotic dark matter,
00:21:19 --> 00:21:21 one that has a changeable equation of
00:21:21 --> 00:21:23 state. To match observation, the dark
00:21:23 --> 00:21:26 matter equation of state must oscillate
00:21:26 --> 00:21:29 in time. This isn't an outlandish
00:21:29 --> 00:21:31 notion.
00:21:31 --> 00:21:32 I think they're trying to convince us
00:21:32 --> 00:21:35 here in space.org. Yeah. Neutrinos have
00:21:35 --> 00:21:37 mass and don't interact strongly with
00:21:37 --> 00:21:39 light. While they can't account for all
00:21:39 --> 00:21:41 the dark matter in the universe, they
00:21:41 --> 00:21:43 are a form of hot dark matter and
00:21:43 --> 00:21:47 neutrinos undergo mass oscillation.
00:21:47 --> 00:21:49 Perhaps cold and dark matter particles
00:21:49 --> 00:21:51 undergo sorry perhaps cold dark matter
00:21:51 --> 00:21:54 particles undergo a similar
00:21:54 --> 00:21:58 oilitary effect. The authors find that
00:21:58 --> 00:22:00 the best fit to observational data is a
00:22:00 --> 00:22:02 universe where about 15% of the cold
00:22:02 --> 00:22:05 dark matter is oscillatory and the
00:22:05 --> 00:22:09 remaining 85% is standard dark matter.
00:22:09 --> 00:22:11 This would allow for the Hubble tension
00:22:11 --> 00:22:14 to be covered while still matching the
00:22:14 --> 00:22:17 dark matter observations we have. And I
00:22:17 --> 00:22:19 love the last paragraph. Yeah, I do too.
00:22:19 --> 00:22:21 I was just reading it. It should be
00:22:21 --> 00:22:24 stressed that this work presents a toy
00:22:24 --> 00:22:26 model. As the authors themselves note,
00:22:26 --> 00:22:28 the work is a broad concept that does
00:22:28 --> 00:22:30 not pin down specific constraints for
00:22:30 --> 00:22:31 dark matter particles, but the work does
00:22:31 --> 00:22:33 open the door to a broader range of dark
00:22:33 --> 00:22:35 matter models. At this point, evolving
00:22:36 --> 00:22:37 dark matter is worth considering. Well,
00:22:37 --> 00:22:39 I agree with that. I think everything's
00:22:39 --> 00:22:41 worth calling. I was going to ask you
00:22:41 --> 00:22:43 where you stand on this, and if it's
00:22:43 --> 00:22:45 worth considering, then obviously it is.
00:22:45 --> 00:22:49 But uh it just adds another
00:22:49 --> 00:22:52 potential explanation of something we
00:22:52 --> 00:22:55 know very little about and Yep. And we
00:22:55 --> 00:22:58 worry about a lot especially on space
00:22:58 --> 00:23:00 nuts. Yes. Yes. And we get a lot of
00:23:00 --> 00:23:02 questions about it and so a lot of
00:23:02 --> 00:23:05 people thinking about this stuff if it's
00:23:05 --> 00:23:08 if it's in fact stuff. Yes. Well, yes,
00:23:08 --> 00:23:09 that's right. It could could be
00:23:09 --> 00:23:11 something other than stuff. Yes. Yes. So
00:23:11 --> 00:23:14 um yeah, it's a a really interesting
00:23:14 --> 00:23:17 idea and well I suppose uh it'll get
00:23:17 --> 00:23:19 tossed around and people will come up
00:23:19 --> 00:23:21 with other explanations. But the thing
00:23:21 --> 00:23:24 is a paper like this even if it's wrong
00:23:24 --> 00:23:27 may spawn a level of thinking that might
00:23:27 --> 00:23:28 send us down a path where we might
00:23:28 --> 00:23:30 eventually figure it out. I mean that's
00:23:30 --> 00:23:33 another possibility. Uh that's that's
00:23:33 --> 00:23:36 true. That's correct. Uh that's and and
00:23:36 --> 00:23:38 that's the way science works as well.
00:23:38 --> 00:23:40 Exactly as you said. Yes indeed. All
00:23:40 --> 00:23:43 right. Uh, as Fred said, you can read
00:23:43 --> 00:23:45 all about it at the fizz.org website.
00:23:45 --> 00:23:47 That's
00:23:47 --> 00:23:49 phys.org. Or you can read the published
00:23:49 --> 00:23:52 paper on the archive reprint server if
00:23:52 --> 00:23:54 you like. This is Space Nuts. Andrew
00:23:54 --> 00:23:58 Dunley here, Fred Watson there.
00:23:58 --> 00:24:00 Okay, we checked all four systems and
00:24:00 --> 00:24:03 being with the Space Nuts. Our final
00:24:03 --> 00:24:07 topic today, Fred, uh is a really
00:24:07 --> 00:24:10 interesting one and it is going to take
00:24:10 --> 00:24:13 us to the Kyper belt. So, uh tighten up
00:24:13 --> 00:24:15 your buckle and get ready for this one
00:24:15 --> 00:24:18 because we think there has been
00:24:18 --> 00:24:21 discovered a triple system in the Kyper
00:24:21 --> 00:24:23 belt. Now, when we talk about the Kyper
00:24:23 --> 00:24:26 belt, we don't really we've we've only
00:24:26 --> 00:24:29 been there a couple of times, um, fairly
00:24:29 --> 00:24:31 recent missions in the last decade or
00:24:31 --> 00:24:34 so, but we've only had, uh, close-up
00:24:34 --> 00:24:37 observations of two objects in the Kyper
00:24:37 --> 00:24:40 belt. So, this discovery was actually
00:24:40 --> 00:24:44 made not by either of those probes, but
00:24:44 --> 00:24:47 or or the probe in question. Um, it was
00:24:47 --> 00:24:50 made from Earth. Am I correct? Yes,
00:24:50 --> 00:24:53 that's right. uh using the Hubble Space
00:24:53 --> 00:24:58 Telescope. Yeah. Which is um you know
00:24:58 --> 00:25:01 still going strong and um still a
00:25:01 --> 00:25:04 fantastic resource
00:25:04 --> 00:25:08 uh given that it's now 35 years in
00:25:08 --> 00:25:11 space. Yes, it is amazing. That's right.
00:25:11 --> 00:25:14 Uh so um and again this is a team of
00:25:14 --> 00:25:16 researchers from NASA. Um what they've
00:25:16 --> 00:25:19 been doing is looking through uh Hubble
00:25:19 --> 00:25:22 telescope data at this very distant
00:25:22 --> 00:25:26 object uh which is uh it's a an
00:25:26 --> 00:25:28 asteroid. So it's got a number
00:25:28 --> 00:25:32 148780. Uh and it's known as Aljira. Uh
00:25:32 --> 00:25:38 that's its name. Uh and they they they
00:25:38 --> 00:25:41 haven't seen the three bodies that they
00:25:41 --> 00:25:43 now think make it up, but they've seen
00:25:43 --> 00:25:45 two. Wait for it. Dad joke coming. Oh,
00:25:45 --> 00:25:48 good. Okay. They've seen two of them. I
00:25:48 --> 00:25:49 was going So, they haven't seen the
00:25:49 --> 00:25:52 three bodies. That's a problem. Oh,
00:25:52 --> 00:25:57 there we go. Gosh. Love it. Love it.
00:25:57 --> 00:25:59 I I don't understand. You must rehearse
00:25:59 --> 00:26:01 our conversations weeks in advance,
00:26:01 --> 00:26:04 Andrew, to get No, this the scary part
00:26:04 --> 00:26:07 is this garbage just pops in there. Yes.
00:26:07 --> 00:26:10 At random moments. It used to happen
00:26:10 --> 00:26:12 when I was on the radio. I'd just be
00:26:12 --> 00:26:14 talking about something in this in a
00:26:14 --> 00:26:16 little voice and go, "Hey, tell this
00:26:16 --> 00:26:18 joke." Yeah. And then at the end of it,
00:26:18 --> 00:26:20 you think, "God, I wish I hadn't told
00:26:20 --> 00:26:22 God, I wish I hadn't said that." Yeah.
00:26:22 --> 00:26:28 Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, um uh so it's uh it
00:26:28 --> 00:26:31 it basically is uh new research and so
00:26:31 --> 00:26:34 so they can see two they can detect that
00:26:34 --> 00:26:35 there are two
00:26:35 --> 00:26:38 objects orbiting one another. I see the
00:26:38 --> 00:26:40 butt.
00:26:40 --> 00:26:44 The the butt is Yes. Yes. Um the butt is
00:26:44 --> 00:26:46 that it looks as though one of them is
00:26:46 --> 00:26:48 actually a pair of objects. That's the
00:26:48 --> 00:26:52 trick. So we've got two things that have
00:26:52 --> 00:26:55 been seen, but one of them is probably a
00:26:55 --> 00:27:00 double. And they've had to use the very
00:27:00 --> 00:27:04 detailed uh measurements of the way the
00:27:04 --> 00:27:07 object that they can see orbits the
00:27:07 --> 00:27:09 other one. the way that that orbit
00:27:09 --> 00:27:12 changes uh that is what tells you that
00:27:12 --> 00:27:15 the central object if I can put it that
00:27:15 --> 00:27:18 way might actually be two um and so it's
00:27:18 --> 00:27:22 the the outer object uh its orbit
00:27:22 --> 00:27:25 changes over time and it's that change
00:27:25 --> 00:27:28 uh that allows the deduction that the
00:27:28 --> 00:27:32 central object if I put it that way
00:27:32 --> 00:27:35 is it well they say it's either
00:27:35 --> 00:27:38 extremely elongated or it's two separate
00:27:38 --> 00:27:41 objects and that um you know the odds
00:27:41 --> 00:27:44 are that it is actually probably two. Uh
00:27:44 --> 00:27:47 often though we've got this situation
00:27:47 --> 00:27:51 especially with these um distant
00:27:51 --> 00:27:54 asteroids where you have clearly
00:27:54 --> 00:27:56 something that has been a binary two
00:27:56 --> 00:27:58 objects in orbit around one another but
00:27:58 --> 00:28:02 they've gradually uh collapsed together
00:28:02 --> 00:28:04 not in a violent way and wound up in
00:28:04 --> 00:28:06 contact which is something we call
00:28:06 --> 00:28:09 believe it or not a contact binary and
00:28:09 --> 00:28:12 Aricoth uh it's one of the Kyper belt
00:28:12 --> 00:28:14 objects that you actually just refer
00:28:14 --> 00:28:15 referred to. It's beyond the orbit of
00:28:16 --> 00:28:18 Pluto. It was visited by New Horizons.
00:28:18 --> 00:28:20 Uh when we saw it, it looked like a
00:28:20 --> 00:28:22 snowman and that was very seasonal
00:28:22 --> 00:28:23 because I think it was Christmas time
00:28:23 --> 00:28:26 when it was uh when it was discovered.
00:28:26 --> 00:28:29 But the analysis of New Horizon's data
00:28:29 --> 00:28:31 as it flew past Aracoth showed that it
00:28:31 --> 00:28:33 wasn't actually two balls joined
00:28:33 --> 00:28:34 together. It was two pancakes joined
00:28:34 --> 00:28:37 together uh rimto- rim. Uh so that it
00:28:37 --> 00:28:39 actually looked like a snowman, but from
00:28:39 --> 00:28:40 the edge on it, it looked a lot more
00:28:40 --> 00:28:43 like two pancakes stuck together. Uh but
00:28:43 --> 00:28:45 that's a common phenomenon. Two objects,
00:28:45 --> 00:28:47 whatever their shape is, coming together
00:28:47 --> 00:28:51 gently and actually um basically
00:28:51 --> 00:28:52 cementing themselves together just by
00:28:52 --> 00:28:54 gravity, but then the sort of gap
00:28:54 --> 00:28:56 between them fills in and you end up
00:28:56 --> 00:28:58 with something that looks like a peanut.
00:28:58 --> 00:29:02 Uh, so I think it's still possible that
00:29:02 --> 00:29:05 Algeria could have that sort of shape,
00:29:05 --> 00:29:08 but they actually say the the research
00:29:08 --> 00:29:11 team who's done this, they say that the
00:29:11 --> 00:29:13 triple system actually fits the data
00:29:13 --> 00:29:17 best. Um, it fits it better than a
00:29:17 --> 00:29:20 contact binary or a really elongated
00:29:20 --> 00:29:22 central object. So triple system is what
00:29:22 --> 00:29:26 we believe it is. Uh it's a very nice
00:29:26 --> 00:29:28 target for a future mission to the outer
00:29:28 --> 00:29:30 solar system, but that's not going to
00:29:30 --> 00:29:32 happen anytime soon. No. Uh but yeah, so
00:29:32 --> 00:29:35 um very nice discovery. Triple systems
00:29:35 --> 00:29:37 are rare. That's why that's why it's uh
00:29:37 --> 00:29:39 you know, it's making the headlines.
00:29:39 --> 00:29:42 These are rare phenomena. Binaries are
00:29:42 --> 00:29:44 very common. In fact, probably most
00:29:44 --> 00:29:46 objects out there in this outer solar
00:29:46 --> 00:29:48 system might be binaries, but triple
00:29:48 --> 00:29:51 systems are rare. Uh interestingly this
00:29:51 --> 00:29:54 um rock if you want to call it that or
00:29:54 --> 00:29:57 or it system Algera is much much bigger
00:29:57 --> 00:30:01 than Araoth. It's uh about 124 miles
00:30:01 --> 00:30:03 wide or 200 kilometers. That that's a
00:30:03 --> 00:30:06 big chunk. Yes it is. Yeah it's a lot a
00:30:06 --> 00:30:08 lot more substantial than Aricoth which
00:30:08 --> 00:30:09 was only if I remember right it was less
00:30:09 --> 00:30:11 than a kilometer I think. Uh it's
00:30:12 --> 00:30:14 amazing that they found it at all to to
00:30:14 --> 00:30:16 give it give New Horizons a target
00:30:16 --> 00:30:18 beyond Pluto.
00:30:18 --> 00:30:21 Yeah. Um, yeah, as you say, we're
00:30:21 --> 00:30:22 probably not going to go back out there
00:30:22 --> 00:30:25 in a hurry. These missions are very
00:30:25 --> 00:30:27 long- winded because of the distances
00:30:27 --> 00:30:32 involved. We're talking what um 30 or 30
00:30:32 --> 00:30:34 AU or something. Yeah, I think this is
00:30:34 --> 00:30:37 more I think it's more like 45 AU. Wow.
00:30:37 --> 00:30:40 So, it's Yeah, AU is an astronomical
00:30:40 --> 00:30:43 unit. 150 million kilometers. Yeah,
00:30:43 --> 00:30:47 that's a long way away. Um but yeah,
00:30:47 --> 00:30:49 it's it's probably an area of our solar
00:30:49 --> 00:30:51 system, even though it's so remote, that
00:30:51 --> 00:30:54 we need to learn more about because um
00:30:54 --> 00:30:55 you
00:30:55 --> 00:30:57 know, some of these rocks get bumped and
00:30:58 --> 00:31:00 end up heading our way. Uh yes, that's
00:31:00 --> 00:31:03 right. In the in the Yeah, they do. Or
00:31:03 --> 00:31:04 um you know, gravitationally interact
00:31:04 --> 00:31:06 with other objects. Uh but you're right,
00:31:06 --> 00:31:09 it it's it's um in some ways it's the
00:31:09 --> 00:31:11 last frontier. is completing the the
00:31:11 --> 00:31:14 evidence for the way we think our solar
00:31:14 --> 00:31:18 system formed by this icy uh dust and
00:31:18 --> 00:31:21 gas cloud that collapsed. And a lot of
00:31:21 --> 00:31:23 this stuff is the last vestigages, the
00:31:23 --> 00:31:26 outer the outer vestigages of those um
00:31:26 --> 00:31:28 you know those uh objects that
00:31:28 --> 00:31:30 eventually went up to make the inner
00:31:30 --> 00:31:32 planets. These are these are worlds that
00:31:32 --> 00:31:34 have never been heated. And that's the,
00:31:34 --> 00:31:36 you know, the planets have been they've
00:31:36 --> 00:31:39 been bombarded by gravitational
00:31:39 --> 00:31:41 interactions by collisions and and
00:31:42 --> 00:31:43 impacts and things of that sort. So they
00:31:43 --> 00:31:46 they're hot. Uh these worlds have always
00:31:46 --> 00:31:48 been cold and that's why they're so
00:31:48 --> 00:31:49 interesting because they're sort of the
00:31:49 --> 00:31:51 fossil of the solar systems earliest
00:31:51 --> 00:31:53 history. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I guess
00:31:53 --> 00:31:55 the time will come where we do extensive
00:31:55 --> 00:31:57 studies, but uh I think we'll have to
00:31:57 --> 00:32:00 get better spacecraft and maybe use
00:32:00 --> 00:32:02 those um those um super highways you
00:32:02 --> 00:32:04 were talking about. Yeah. Yeah, that's
00:32:04 --> 00:32:06 right. Get out there and have a look.
00:32:06 --> 00:32:08 Yes. Uh if you'd like to read up on
00:32:08 --> 00:32:09 that, you can do that at the NASA
00:32:10 --> 00:32:12 science website or you can go uh to the
00:32:12 --> 00:32:14 study itself which was published in the
00:32:14 --> 00:32:17 planetary science journal. Uh that
00:32:17 --> 00:32:20 brings us to the end. Fred, thank you so
00:32:20 --> 00:32:23 much. Uh it's a pleasure, Andrew. Um, a
00:32:23 --> 00:32:25 nice surprise to see you and um, always
00:32:25 --> 00:32:27 a pleasure to talk. Good to see you,
00:32:27 --> 00:32:29 too. And we'll catch you on the very
00:32:30 --> 00:32:31 next episode. Don't forget to visit us
00:32:31 --> 00:32:33 online. In the meantime, we've got
00:32:33 --> 00:32:35 plenty of platforms. We're on Instagram.
00:32:35 --> 00:32:37 We're on YouTube. We're on Facebook.
00:32:37 --> 00:32:40 We're on our own website,
00:32:40 --> 00:32:42 spacenutsodcast.com. Spacenuts.io.
00:32:42 --> 00:32:44 Either URL will take you to the same
00:32:44 --> 00:32:46 place and have a look around while
00:32:46 --> 00:32:49 you're there. and uh Hugh in the studio.
00:32:49 --> 00:32:51 He did actually turn up briefly today,
00:32:51 --> 00:32:54 but he forgot to put on his Kyper belt
00:32:54 --> 00:32:55 and his pants fell fell down, so he had
00:32:55 --> 00:32:56 to make a run for
00:32:57 --> 00:32:59 it. From me, Andrew Dunley. Oh, it's
00:32:59 --> 00:33:01 terrible. Uh, thanks for your company.
00:33:01 --> 00:33:03 We'll see you on the next episode of
00:33:03 --> 00:33:05 Space Nuts. Bye-bye. Space Nuts, you'll
00:33:06 --> 00:33:09 be listening to the Space Nuts podcast,
00:33:10 --> 00:33:13 available at Apple Podcasts, Spotify,
00:33:13 --> 00:33:15 iHeart Radio, or your favorite podcast
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00:33:18 --> 00:33:20 byes.com. This has been another quality
00:33:20 --> 00:33:25 podcast production from byes.com.