Space Nuts Episode: Gemstone Rain on Exoplanets and the Reliability of Research Papers #483
Join Andrew Dunkley and Professor Fred Watson as they explore the wonders of the cosmos in another intriguing episode of Space Nuts. This week, dive into the fascinating world of exoplanets with gemstone rain and discuss the reliability of research papers with insightful audience questions.
Episode Highlights:
- Gemstone Rain on Exoplanet WASP-121b: Discover the extraordinary exoplanet where it rains gemstones. Learn about the unique atmospheric conditions that lead to such exotic precipitation and the incredible journey of water and other materials across this tidally locked world.
- Reliability of Research Papers: Delve into a thought-provoking discussion about the accuracy of scientific research papers. Explore how often published findings might be influenced by bias or statistical errors and what this means for fields like astronomy.
- Space Debris in Kenya: Hear about the unexpected arrival of a massive metal object in a Kenyan village, identified as a separation ring from a rocket launch. Understand the implications of such events and the protocols followed under International Space Law.
- Gravitational Wave Detection Breakthrough: Learn about a new technique called optical spring tracking that could significantly enhance our ability to detect gravitational waves. Discover how this advancement could provide insights into cosmic events from the earliest moments of the universe.
For more Space Nuts, including our continually updating newsfeed and to listen to all our episodes, visit our website. Follow us on social media at SpaceNutsPod on Facebook, X, YouTube Music, YouTube Music Music, Tumblr, Instagram, and TikTok. We love engaging with our community, so be sure to drop us a message or comment on your favourite platform.
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If you'd like to help support Space Nuts and join our growing family of insiders for commercial-free episodes and more, visit spacenutspodcast.com/about
Stay curious, keep looking up, and join us next time for more stellar insights and cosmic wonders. Until then, clear skies and happy stargazing.
00:00 - This is Space Nuts, where we talk astronomy and space science
01:41 - Andrew Bennett: There's an exoplanet that rains gemstones
05:08 - You observe the star's light throughout the orbital period of the planet
12:09 - You can help support the Space Nuts podcast through Patreon or Supercast
13:47 - Bob from North Carolina has two questions for Professor Watson about scientific accuracy
22:12 - A metal object plummeted from space and landed in a Kenyan village on Tuesday
23:34 - Scientists have developed a new technique called optical spring tracking to detect gravitational waves
✍️ Episode References
WASP-121b
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WASP-121b
Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT)
Johns Hopkins University
Caltech
Hubble Space Telescope
https://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/hubble/main/index.html
phys.org
Astronomy Daily
Advanced Laser Interferometer Gravitational-Wave Observatory (LIGO)
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/space-nuts--2631155/support (https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/space-nuts--2631155/support?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=rss) .
Episode link: https://play.headliner.app/episode/24887260?utm_source=youtube
00:00:00 --> 00:00:01 while the world takes a little bit of a
00:00:01 --> 00:00:03 rest over the Christmas New Year period
00:00:03 --> 00:00:05 we thought we would too but we're not
00:00:05 --> 00:00:07 going to leave you hanging we've dug
00:00:08 --> 00:00:10 into the archives and found a few of the
00:00:10 --> 00:00:13 biggest episodes of recent times so sit
00:00:13 --> 00:00:15 back and enjoy those and we'll be back
00:00:15 --> 00:00:18 with new episodes of Space Nuts probably
00:00:18 --> 00:00:21 in the middle of January see you then
00:00:21 --> 00:00:22 Space Nuts hello and thank you for
00:00:23 --> 00:00:25 joining us on Space Nuts where we talk
00:00:25 --> 00:00:28 astronomy and space science great to
00:00:28 --> 00:00:30 have you all company once again and
00:00:30 --> 00:00:32 coming up on this particular episode
00:00:32 --> 00:00:34 we're going to talk about an exoplanet
00:00:34 --> 00:00:38 that has unusual rain it's raining
00:00:38 --> 00:00:41 gemstones and ruby slippers well maybe
00:00:41 --> 00:00:42 not the ruby slippers but definitely
00:00:42 --> 00:00:45 gemstones which is very unusual we'll
00:00:45 --> 00:00:47 also be answering some audience
00:00:47 --> 00:00:49 questions Bob wants to talk about
00:00:49 --> 00:00:51 research papers and how accurate or
00:00:51 --> 00:00:53 otherwise they might be that's all to
00:00:53 --> 00:00:58 come on this edition of Space Nuts 15
00:00:58 --> 00:01:00 seconds guidance is internal
00:01:00 --> 00:01:05 10 9 ignition sequence start Space Nuts
00:01:05 --> 00:01:09 5 4 3
00:01:09 --> 00:01:14 2 Space Nuts report it feels good my
00:01:14 --> 00:01:16 name is Andrew Dunley I am your host
00:01:16 --> 00:01:18 thank you for joining us and with us
00:01:18 --> 00:01:21 again this week because we can't get rid
00:01:21 --> 00:01:24 of him really uh it is Professor Fred
00:01:24 --> 00:01:26 Watson astronomer at large hello Fred
00:01:26 --> 00:01:29 hello Andrew how are you you are the
00:01:29 --> 00:01:31 Space Nuts barnicle you are that's yeah
00:01:31 --> 00:01:34 I know just just a barnacle on the back
00:01:34 --> 00:01:35 side of
00:01:35 --> 00:01:39 [Laughter]
00:01:39 --> 00:01:41 space right we got a lot to talk about
00:01:41 --> 00:01:43 today so let's get straight to our first
00:01:43 --> 00:01:46 topic and this is uh really interesting
00:01:46 --> 00:01:49 one we've talked about exoplanets and uh
00:01:50 --> 00:01:52 and even planets and moons in our own
00:01:52 --> 00:01:54 solar system that have unusual kind of
00:01:54 --> 00:01:58 rain like sulfur rain and acid rain and
00:01:58 --> 00:02:00 I think we talked about a planet that
00:02:00 --> 00:02:01 rained
00:02:01 --> 00:02:03 diamonds now there's an exoplanet that
00:02:03 --> 00:02:07 Reigns gemstones what's what's this all
00:02:07 --> 00:02:10 about well yeah the it's gemstones among
00:02:10 --> 00:02:14 other things um and it's you know that
00:02:14 --> 00:02:16 there's a there's a lot going on on this
00:02:16 --> 00:02:19 exoplanet uh it's uh what is it well it
00:02:20 --> 00:02:23 is uh I think it's a wasp yeah wasp
00:02:23 --> 00:02:27 121b wasp is a is a a project that um
00:02:27 --> 00:02:30 that develop that detects ex of planets
00:02:30 --> 00:02:31 the transit method the fact that their
00:02:31 --> 00:02:33 brightness drops when they pass in front
00:02:33 --> 00:02:37 of their parent star um wasp 121 is
00:02:37 --> 00:02:40 actually a star which is about 850 light
00:02:40 --> 00:02:45 years from here um it has a planet which
00:02:45 --> 00:02:48 is uh very close to it it's a hot
00:02:48 --> 00:02:50 Jupiter that's the excuse me the
00:02:50 --> 00:02:52 official description because it's a big
00:02:52 --> 00:02:56 planet um and it orbits its parent star
00:02:56 --> 00:02:59 once every 30 hours so you know its year
00:02:59 --> 00:03:01 is 30 hours long Andrew it just begas
00:03:01 --> 00:03:03 belief doesn't it but that's what's
00:03:03 --> 00:03:06 happening um now that
00:03:06 --> 00:03:09 means one of the things that means is
00:03:10 --> 00:03:13 that uh W with a you know with a period
00:03:13 --> 00:03:14 that short and the distance between the
00:03:14 --> 00:03:17 parent star and the planet that that
00:03:17 --> 00:03:19 small this planet will be tidally locked
00:03:19 --> 00:03:23 to its parent star and that is the I
00:03:23 --> 00:03:25 guess the key to understanding What's um
00:03:25 --> 00:03:28 you know what's going on here it is uh
00:03:28 --> 00:03:30 it it's day side
00:03:30 --> 00:03:33 always is is permanently facing the
00:03:33 --> 00:03:36 parent sty well that that's a bit of a
00:03:37 --> 00:03:39 torty really isn't it uh because the day
00:03:39 --> 00:03:41 side is always facing the parent star
00:03:41 --> 00:03:44 but the bottom line is uh geez this is a
00:03:44 --> 00:03:47 good start this morning you're going the
00:03:47 --> 00:03:49 the bottom line see how I bailed you out
00:03:49 --> 00:03:52 of that yes oh well done thank you
00:03:52 --> 00:03:56 yes the uh this the planet is rotating
00:03:56 --> 00:03:58 at the same rate at which it revolves
00:03:58 --> 00:04:00 around its start like the Moon is
00:04:00 --> 00:04:02 rotating at the same rate as it revolves
00:04:02 --> 00:04:04 around the earth and so uh you've got
00:04:05 --> 00:04:07 this one side of it that permanently
00:04:07 --> 00:04:10 faces the heat source and that means one
00:04:10 --> 00:04:12 side is hot and the other side is cold
00:04:12 --> 00:04:17 um now given that we can't see these
00:04:17 --> 00:04:20 planets directly you may well ask Andrew
00:04:20 --> 00:04:22 how can you study the day and night
00:04:22 --> 00:04:25 sides of a world like this in detail
00:04:25 --> 00:04:27 that's a good question glad I thought of
00:04:27 --> 00:04:31 it I'm glad you thought of it it too the
00:04:31 --> 00:04:33 and the answer is it's really clever
00:04:33 --> 00:04:36 stuff and needs um you know it needs
00:04:36 --> 00:04:38 really quite significant astronomical
00:04:38 --> 00:04:41 infrastructure uh in order to make these
00:04:41 --> 00:04:43 observations I should I should mention
00:04:43 --> 00:04:46 that um uh the authors of this uh work
00:04:46 --> 00:04:49 come from MIT Massachusetts Institute of
00:04:49 --> 00:04:52 Technology Johns Hopkin God John's
00:04:53 --> 00:04:56 Hopkins University Caltech and other us
00:04:56 --> 00:04:58 universities it is a mouthful but it is
00:04:58 --> 00:05:00 Massachusetts
00:05:00 --> 00:05:02 M Massachusetts is what I tried to say
00:05:02 --> 00:05:04 that's
00:05:04 --> 00:05:07 right I didn't really anyway never mind
00:05:07 --> 00:05:09 I didn't do well with it but so what
00:05:09 --> 00:05:13 what um how do you how do you detect um
00:05:13 --> 00:05:14 what's going on on the day and night
00:05:14 --> 00:05:16 sides of a world like this and what you
00:05:16 --> 00:05:22 do is You observe the planet and all you
00:05:22 --> 00:05:23 can see is the star that's the only
00:05:24 --> 00:05:26 thing that is visible in your telescope
00:05:26 --> 00:05:28 yeah but you observe the Stars light
00:05:28 --> 00:05:31 throughout the orbital period of the
00:05:31 --> 00:05:33 planet and given that that's only 30
00:05:33 --> 00:05:36 hours you don't have to wait very long
00:05:36 --> 00:05:37 uh if you are looking from outside the
00:05:37 --> 00:05:39 solar system and trying to do this with
00:05:39 --> 00:05:41 Jupiter you'd be waiting what is it 12
00:05:41 --> 00:05:42 years or something like that it's much
00:05:43 --> 00:05:46 longer um uh no I think it's five years
00:05:46 --> 00:05:50 sorry I should do that calculation again
00:05:50 --> 00:05:54 uh anyway um 30 hours gives you time to
00:05:54 --> 00:05:58 um you know to to actually work out uh
00:05:58 --> 00:06:00 exactly what's going on through the
00:06:00 --> 00:06:02 different phases of the planet because
00:06:02 --> 00:06:04 that's what it's all about it's like the
00:06:04 --> 00:06:06 phases of the moon we watch the moon
00:06:06 --> 00:06:08 going around uh because it's lit up by
00:06:09 --> 00:06:12 the Sun and we can see you know it
00:06:12 --> 00:06:14 progressing from New Moon to first
00:06:14 --> 00:06:15 quarter to Full Moon and all the rest of
00:06:15 --> 00:06:19 it and you can do the same thing with an
00:06:19 --> 00:06:21 exoplanet but you what you do what all
00:06:21 --> 00:06:23 you're able to measure is the total
00:06:23 --> 00:06:27 light from the planet plus the star but
00:06:27 --> 00:06:29 as you'd imagine that varies throughout
00:06:29 --> 00:06:30 the
00:06:30 --> 00:06:32 the revolution period of the planet um
00:06:33 --> 00:06:35 when you when you've got just when when
00:06:35 --> 00:06:38 the planet is behind the star all you've
00:06:38 --> 00:06:41 got is the light of the star uh and I
00:06:41 --> 00:06:43 should add that you you you're not just
00:06:43 --> 00:06:44 observing how bright it is you're also
00:06:44 --> 00:06:46 observing the spectrum of this thing so
00:06:46 --> 00:06:49 you're looking in detail at the chemical
00:06:49 --> 00:06:52 constituents that is is revealed by the
00:06:52 --> 00:06:55 light that is coming to you yeah so when
00:06:55 --> 00:06:56 when the planet is behind the star all
00:06:56 --> 00:06:58 he seeing is the light of the star when
00:06:58 --> 00:07:01 the Planet shifts slightly in its path
00:07:01 --> 00:07:04 around the star so you can see both what
00:07:04 --> 00:07:06 you've got is effectively you're looking
00:07:06 --> 00:07:09 at the full Planet like equivalent of a
00:07:09 --> 00:07:10 full moon it's almost completely
00:07:10 --> 00:07:13 illuminated right and that light adds to
00:07:13 --> 00:07:16 the light of the star uh and so um you
00:07:16 --> 00:07:19 can then look at how the Spectrum has
00:07:19 --> 00:07:21 changed and that is telling you about
00:07:21 --> 00:07:23 the atmosphere of the planet itself
00:07:24 --> 00:07:26 rather than uh the you know the um the
00:07:26 --> 00:07:28 atmosphere of the style you in fact what
00:07:28 --> 00:07:30 you can do is subtract the star Spectrum
00:07:30 --> 00:07:33 from the spectrum of the combined Planet
00:07:33 --> 00:07:35 plus star and you get the planet
00:07:35 --> 00:07:37 Spectrum uh that's that's how this works
00:07:37 --> 00:07:40 and then that changes throughout the
00:07:40 --> 00:07:42 throughout the planet's year 30 day of
00:07:42 --> 00:07:45 30 hours um and and eventually you're
00:07:45 --> 00:07:49 looking at the backside of the planet
00:07:49 --> 00:07:52 and and in fact uh you you have a point
00:07:52 --> 00:07:54 where that is superimposed on the star
00:07:54 --> 00:07:57 once again you can uh you can do some
00:07:57 --> 00:08:00 clever work because you can look at
00:08:00 --> 00:08:02 the the you can look at the combined
00:08:02 --> 00:08:04 spectrum of the of the The Backs side of
00:08:04 --> 00:08:06 the planet superimposed on the star
00:08:06 --> 00:08:09 itself that combined Spectrum uh if you
00:08:09 --> 00:08:12 subtract out the spectrum of the star
00:08:12 --> 00:08:15 itself it it shows you what chemical
00:08:15 --> 00:08:17 constituents again are in the atmosphere
00:08:17 --> 00:08:20 of the planet because the light of the
00:08:20 --> 00:08:21 star is passing through the atmosphere
00:08:22 --> 00:08:24 of the planet around the edge of it and
00:08:24 --> 00:08:26 coming back to Earth so that that's the
00:08:26 --> 00:08:29 technique uh and what's been found is
00:08:29 --> 00:08:32 that this object is quite extraordinary
00:08:32 --> 00:08:37 so it's got um a day side that is
00:08:37 --> 00:08:40 extremely hot more than 3 degrees
00:08:40 --> 00:08:45 Kelvin uh so uh what that does is the
00:08:45 --> 00:08:46 it's known that there is water vapor in
00:08:46 --> 00:08:48 the atmosphere of this planet well
00:08:48 --> 00:08:50 there's water vapor on the night side
00:08:50 --> 00:08:52 but on the day side uh the water
00:08:52 --> 00:08:56 molecules are just torn apart because of
00:08:56 --> 00:08:59 the high temperatures uh so you've got
00:08:59 --> 00:09:02 uh hydrogen and oxygen atoms that are
00:09:02 --> 00:09:04 that are you know they're they're
00:09:04 --> 00:09:07 independent within the atmosphere um and
00:09:07 --> 00:09:09 then it turns out that because of the
00:09:09 --> 00:09:12 heat that generates high pressure in the
00:09:12 --> 00:09:15 day side which causes winds that blow
00:09:15 --> 00:09:18 things around to the night side and on
00:09:18 --> 00:09:21 the night side it's cool enough yeah for
00:09:21 --> 00:09:24 these things to form back to water um
00:09:24 --> 00:09:27 and so you get water vapor falling
00:09:27 --> 00:09:30 forming in the atmosphere of the of the
00:09:30 --> 00:09:32 dark side of the planet um that the
00:09:32 --> 00:09:35 estimate that these these winds are 5
00:09:35 --> 00:09:38 kilometers per second so this is
00:09:38 --> 00:09:41 11 miles per hour it's um it's a
00:09:42 --> 00:09:45 it's you know 16 16 to 17 kilometers
00:09:45 --> 00:09:48 per our sounds like um that's the same
00:09:48 --> 00:09:50 as it was in Sydney yesterday uh yeah we
00:09:50 --> 00:09:52 didn't get the wind but we got the rain
00:09:52 --> 00:09:55 so we got the we got the water vapor
00:09:55 --> 00:09:58 huge huge quantities of of rain oh gosh
00:09:58 --> 00:10:01 bucket loads of it um
00:10:01 --> 00:10:04 H2O suitably combined back into water
00:10:04 --> 00:10:06 vapor yes so that that's what they get
00:10:06 --> 00:10:09 on the on the dark side of the of this
00:10:09 --> 00:10:13 um was one21 being um but uh there but
00:10:13 --> 00:10:17 wait there's more because it's not just
00:10:17 --> 00:10:20 water uh that's that's circulating like
00:10:20 --> 00:10:24 this um they find it on the night side
00:10:24 --> 00:10:28 um that the temperature is right to have
00:10:28 --> 00:10:31 quite um I guess the best word is exotic
00:10:31 --> 00:10:34 CL or clouds of exotic materials and
00:10:34 --> 00:10:38 iron is one of them and a mineral a
00:10:38 --> 00:10:40 mineral that actually is a constituent
00:10:40 --> 00:10:42 in gemstones that's that's the point
00:10:42 --> 00:10:43 that you were making right at the
00:10:43 --> 00:10:46 beginning yeah um well that's that's
00:10:46 --> 00:10:48 that's the journalistic hook isn't it it
00:10:48 --> 00:10:52 it is absolutely so um yes to quote the
00:10:52 --> 00:10:56 physics.org uh report on this on on the
00:10:56 --> 00:10:58 way around exotic rain might be produced
00:10:58 --> 00:11:01 such as liquid gems from the corundum
00:11:01 --> 00:11:04 clouds so you know liquid rubies that'
00:11:04 --> 00:11:07 be quite nice actually
00:11:07 --> 00:11:11 well anyway um really quite um really
00:11:11 --> 00:11:13 quite remarkable stuff I should mention
00:11:13 --> 00:11:15 that these uh these observations were
00:11:15 --> 00:11:18 made with uh the Hubble Space Telescope
00:11:18 --> 00:11:20 it was one of the spectroscopic cameras
00:11:20 --> 00:11:22 on board the Hubble telescope that were
00:11:22 --> 00:11:25 that was used uh and fantastic work uh
00:11:26 --> 00:11:28 congratulations to the team and to the
00:11:28 --> 00:11:30 journalists who writing about this I
00:11:30 --> 00:11:32 don't suppose they can tell us exactly
00:11:32 --> 00:11:35 what kind of gemstones these might be or
00:11:35 --> 00:11:40 Gem Gem blob opponents yeah uh they're
00:11:40 --> 00:11:45 suggesting um that it could be um uh
00:11:45 --> 00:11:47 maybe
00:11:47 --> 00:11:51 um look I had rubies in my mind uh and
00:11:51 --> 00:11:53 yeah may maybe rubies and sapphires
00:11:53 --> 00:11:55 that's that's um that's the possibility
00:11:55 --> 00:11:58 kandum apparently is a mineral that that
00:11:58 --> 00:12:01 you know go goes towards these uh these
00:12:01 --> 00:12:03 gemstones so I wasn't far wrong with my
00:12:03 --> 00:12:05 ruby slippers analogy no no it's very
00:12:05 --> 00:12:08 nice one that I like that very much yes
00:12:08 --> 00:12:10 interesting all right uh that that's a
00:12:10 --> 00:12:12 fascinating Discovery and uh if you want
00:12:12 --> 00:12:14 to read more about it you um should go
00:12:14 --> 00:12:18 to the fizz. org website that's not fi Z
00:12:18 --> 00:12:20 that's
00:12:20 --> 00:12:23 phys.org website it's a fabulous website
00:12:23 --> 00:12:25 if you um want to catch up on that and
00:12:25 --> 00:12:29 and many other um stories this is space
00:12:29 --> 00:12:31 nuts with Andrew Dunley and of course
00:12:31 --> 00:12:34 Professor Fred
00:12:34 --> 00:12:37 Watson 3
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00:13:47 --> 00:13:50 okay Fred let's get into our question
00:13:50 --> 00:13:52 segment this is where people who listen
00:13:52 --> 00:13:54 to space nut send us all sorts of uh
00:13:54 --> 00:13:56 hyper intelligent questions that I've
00:13:56 --> 00:13:59 got no clue about but Fred has an
00:13:59 --> 00:14:03 inkling and uh our first one comes from
00:14:03 --> 00:14:06 Bob this is Bob from Ashville North
00:14:06 --> 00:14:09 Carolina in the US I have two questions
00:14:10 --> 00:14:12 in 2005 professor John I onitis
00:14:12 --> 00:14:14 published a highly influential paper in
00:14:14 --> 00:14:17 PL medicine titled why most published
00:14:17 --> 00:14:20 research findings are false he makes the
00:14:20 --> 00:14:22 argument and here I'm quoting that for
00:14:22 --> 00:14:25 most study designs and settings it is
00:14:25 --> 00:14:27 more likely for a research claim to be
00:14:27 --> 00:14:29 false than true
00:14:29 --> 00:14:31 it's important to note that he was
00:14:31 --> 00:14:33 focusing on medical studies which have
00:14:33 --> 00:14:36 less scientific rigor than physics he
00:14:36 --> 00:14:37 does however conclude that and I'm
00:14:37 --> 00:14:40 quoting his paper again that for many
00:14:40 --> 00:14:42 current scientific Fields claimed
00:14:42 --> 00:14:45 research findings May often be simply
00:14:45 --> 00:14:48 accurate measures of the prevailing bias
00:14:48 --> 00:14:50 my first question for Professor Watson
00:14:50 --> 00:14:52 is how often does this happen in your
00:14:52 --> 00:14:55 field meaning how often are published
00:14:55 --> 00:14:57 research findings actually false because
00:14:57 --> 00:14:59 of bias or statistical
00:14:59 --> 00:15:01 reasons my second question is
00:15:02 --> 00:15:04 hypothetical medicine changes relatively
00:15:04 --> 00:15:07 quickly for example peptic ulcers were
00:15:07 --> 00:15:10 treated with surgery until 1984 which is
00:15:10 --> 00:15:13 when Barry James Marshall an Australian
00:15:13 --> 00:15:15 physician at Royal Perth Hospital
00:15:15 --> 00:15:17 reported that peptic ulcers were caused
00:15:17 --> 00:15:19 by a type of bacteria called
00:15:19 --> 00:15:20 helicobactor
00:15:20 --> 00:15:23 pylori today ulcers are treated with
00:15:23 --> 00:15:26 antibiotics Professor Watson suppose you
00:15:26 --> 00:15:28 could fast forward 100 or 500 years into
00:15:28 --> 00:15:30 the future and look back at cosmology
00:15:30 --> 00:15:32 and Astro and that's where Bob
00:15:32 --> 00:15:34 unfortunately got cut off but we think
00:15:34 --> 00:15:36 we've got the nuts and bolts of his
00:15:36 --> 00:15:39 question uh so we're going to take a
00:15:39 --> 00:15:41 stab at it for you Bob um but yeah I
00:15:41 --> 00:15:43 guess the first part of his question is
00:15:43 --> 00:15:46 about um um scientific papers research
00:15:46 --> 00:15:50 papers uh published works and uh
00:15:50 --> 00:15:54 how maybe they could misinform or not be
00:15:54 --> 00:15:56 quite accurate is that something that
00:15:56 --> 00:15:59 happens um
00:15:59 --> 00:16:02 look it's it's a really interesting
00:16:02 --> 00:16:05 question um there
00:16:05 --> 00:16:08 are I don't think there in in
00:16:08 --> 00:16:12 astronomy um there is a
00:16:12 --> 00:16:13 strong
00:16:13 --> 00:16:18 uh incentive perhaps or or um reason why
00:16:18 --> 00:16:21 uh people should intentionally misinform
00:16:21 --> 00:16:25 um I think that is almost always almost
00:16:25 --> 00:16:29 always zero um and what research
00:16:29 --> 00:16:32 that does bark up the wrong tree what
00:16:32 --> 00:16:35 research of that kind that there is is
00:16:35 --> 00:16:39 is honest mistakes um like the color of
00:16:39 --> 00:16:41 the universe perhaps well that's right
00:16:41 --> 00:16:43 that was an honest mistake yeah which
00:16:43 --> 00:16:46 was um what was it was kind of well they
00:16:46 --> 00:16:48 originally said it was Aqua but it
00:16:48 --> 00:16:50 turned out to be beige it was beige yeah
00:16:50 --> 00:16:52 that's right and and in fact um I
00:16:52 --> 00:16:55 remember when I read that paper this is
00:16:55 --> 00:16:57 probably 10 15 years ago and I know the
00:16:57 --> 00:16:59 guy who wrote it quite well uh I
00:16:59 --> 00:17:01 remember when I read that paper thinking
00:17:01 --> 00:17:03 this cannot be the case you can't have a
00:17:03 --> 00:17:06 an aqua Universe because it's it's
00:17:06 --> 00:17:09 expanding and you know you've got
00:17:09 --> 00:17:10 basically a red shift there and it
00:17:10 --> 00:17:13 turned out to be beige which is red
00:17:13 --> 00:17:16 shifted Aqua anyway look um the kind of
00:17:16 --> 00:17:17 thing that I was thinking of Andrew and
00:17:17 --> 00:17:19 it might go to the heart of Bob's
00:17:19 --> 00:17:22 question is you remember last year there
00:17:22 --> 00:17:24 was a big fuss when people thought that
00:17:25 --> 00:17:27 phosphine had been detected in the upper
00:17:27 --> 00:17:30 atmosphere of Venus M um uh and
00:17:30 --> 00:17:35 phosphine is on Earth is is generally
00:17:35 --> 00:17:38 produced by biological processes uh and
00:17:38 --> 00:17:40 so that I know that the researchers who
00:17:40 --> 00:17:42 did that work and I know some of them in
00:17:42 --> 00:17:44 fact I talked to one of them afterwards
00:17:44 --> 00:17:48 uh he's a friend of mine in Hawaii um
00:17:48 --> 00:17:52 they were very very careful to tease out
00:17:52 --> 00:17:55 the signal of phosphine from the noise
00:17:55 --> 00:17:57 it was this was done with quite big
00:17:57 --> 00:17:59 radio telescopes in fact Alo was one of
00:17:59 --> 00:18:01 them they has a car a large millimeter
00:18:01 --> 00:18:06 array um and uh it uh it was with
00:18:06 --> 00:18:08 reluctance that they mentioned the fact
00:18:08 --> 00:18:12 that phosphine is a a life product um
00:18:12 --> 00:18:14 because the popular press jumped all
00:18:14 --> 00:18:15 over there yeah that's right life on
00:18:15 --> 00:18:18 Venus there's life on Venus yeah exactly
00:18:18 --> 00:18:21 what happened and um you know maybe the
00:18:21 --> 00:18:23 bias that Bob mentions is there because
00:18:23 --> 00:18:25 it's something that we're all you know
00:18:25 --> 00:18:28 we're all kind of trigger happy with we
00:18:28 --> 00:18:29 we uh
00:18:29 --> 00:18:32 urgently trying to seek any evidence of
00:18:32 --> 00:18:35 Life anywhere else in the universe um
00:18:35 --> 00:18:37 now and when you give some elements of
00:18:37 --> 00:18:39 the media an inch they take a mile
00:18:39 --> 00:18:41 that's well that's true and that
00:18:41 --> 00:18:43 certainly happened in that case um my
00:18:43 --> 00:18:45 recollection is that the the original
00:18:45 --> 00:18:48 team still stand by their their
00:18:48 --> 00:18:50 discovery that it was phos but there was
00:18:50 --> 00:18:52 another paper published it must have
00:18:52 --> 00:18:54 been actually the year before last when
00:18:54 --> 00:18:55 the phosphine measurement was made
00:18:55 --> 00:18:57 because I think it was early last year
00:18:57 --> 00:18:59 that another paper was published showing
00:18:59 --> 00:19:03 how the phosphine signature could be
00:19:03 --> 00:19:06 mistaken um that it might actually I
00:19:06 --> 00:19:07 think it was something like nitrous
00:19:07 --> 00:19:09 oxide I can't remember it was something
00:19:09 --> 00:19:12 a lot less um suggestive of life
00:19:12 --> 00:19:14 processes so I think honest mistakes are
00:19:14 --> 00:19:17 made but yes there might be a bias there
00:19:17 --> 00:19:20 too generally you you'll probably find
00:19:20 --> 00:19:23 bias in circumstances where somebody's
00:19:23 --> 00:19:26 trying to sell something yeah you might
00:19:26 --> 00:19:29 get those um you know
00:19:29 --> 00:19:32 studies that are released into certain
00:19:32 --> 00:19:34 uh products that improve your life and
00:19:34 --> 00:19:36 the study turned out to be 10 people at
00:19:36 --> 00:19:39 a festar result for a weekend answering
00:19:39 --> 00:19:41 a questionnaire yes yes that kind of
00:19:41 --> 00:19:43 thing so yeah there's a bit of that goes
00:19:43 --> 00:19:45 on there is certainly less so in
00:19:45 --> 00:19:49 astronomy astronomy I think is partly um
00:19:49 --> 00:19:51 what one thing you're looking for and
00:19:51 --> 00:19:53 you always check this whenever you make
00:19:53 --> 00:19:56 a discovery is how consistent it is with
00:19:56 --> 00:19:58 what we already know about the universe
00:19:58 --> 00:20:00 because um often you know our
00:20:00 --> 00:20:02 discoveries they're highly forensic it's
00:20:02 --> 00:20:05 all done at distances ranging up to 13
00:20:05 --> 00:20:09 billion light years um just turning to
00:20:09 --> 00:20:11 and I'm I'm hypothesizing here as to
00:20:11 --> 00:20:13 what the second part of Bob's question
00:20:13 --> 00:20:15 was because he got cut off as you said
00:20:15 --> 00:20:17 but I think he might have been wanting
00:20:17 --> 00:20:20 to ask me what if I fast forwarded 100
00:20:20 --> 00:20:24 years into the future and then look back
00:20:24 --> 00:20:27 at 2022 what I would think of as being
00:20:27 --> 00:20:29 discoveries that maybe were Mis leading
00:20:30 --> 00:20:31 and perhaps the one that comes to mind
00:20:31 --> 00:20:33 and and it's not through any lack of
00:20:33 --> 00:20:36 honesty this is the best evidence we
00:20:36 --> 00:20:40 have so far is that dark matter exists
00:20:41 --> 00:20:43 and that it is a subatomic particle of
00:20:43 --> 00:20:46 some kind that is that is pointed to on
00:20:46 --> 00:20:48 so by through so many different
00:20:48 --> 00:20:49 experiments and there's a
00:20:49 --> 00:20:51 self-consistency about it as well with
00:20:51 --> 00:20:53 what else we know about the universe
00:20:53 --> 00:20:56 yeah but um it could well be that it
00:20:56 --> 00:20:59 turns out that it wasn't that um you
00:20:59 --> 00:21:01 know that in the end there is something
00:21:01 --> 00:21:04 that we don't understand about physics
00:21:04 --> 00:21:06 and what I'm thinking of is M modified
00:21:07 --> 00:21:10 neonian Dynamics we've got a a friend
00:21:10 --> 00:21:11 out there in the audience Peter aan
00:21:12 --> 00:21:14 who's studying that for his phdd and
00:21:14 --> 00:21:17 doing a great job you know just maybe uh
00:21:17 --> 00:21:20 the tide will turn and people will see
00:21:20 --> 00:21:22 the evidence for modified netian
00:21:22 --> 00:21:23 Dynamics which means that gravity
00:21:23 --> 00:21:25 doesn't behave quite the way we thought
00:21:25 --> 00:21:28 it did on large scales um that that
00:21:28 --> 00:21:29 might turn out to be the answer that
00:21:30 --> 00:21:32 would be one I might venture to suggest
00:21:32 --> 00:21:34 would be something that in 100 years
00:21:35 --> 00:21:37 time we might look back on and say we
00:21:37 --> 00:21:39 all thought it was dark
00:21:39 --> 00:21:42 matter yeah how foolish were
00:21:42 --> 00:21:46 we yeah no and and that's not probably
00:21:46 --> 00:21:48 not an uncommon scenario I mean we we
00:21:49 --> 00:21:51 hindsight is 2020 and yes that's right
00:21:51 --> 00:21:52 don't have hindsight until you go
00:21:52 --> 00:21:55 forward and look back and go ah okay all
00:21:55 --> 00:21:58 right that was it that was why yes
00:21:58 --> 00:22:00 of course we get it right A lot of the
00:22:00 --> 00:22:02 time too I think we do I think that's
00:22:02 --> 00:22:04 right all right Bob lovely to hear from
00:22:04 --> 00:22:07 you thanks for your
00:22:07 --> 00:22:13 question 3 2 1 Space Nuts hello again
00:22:13 --> 00:22:15 space Nutters this is Anna from
00:22:15 --> 00:22:17 astronomy daily the podcast stopping by
00:22:17 --> 00:22:19 again with a couple of the important
00:22:19 --> 00:22:21 stories we've been following over the
00:22:21 --> 00:22:24 past week in an intriguing start to 2025
00:22:24 --> 00:22:26 residents of muku village in Kenya's
00:22:26 --> 00:22:28 mcen County were startled by a m
00:22:28 --> 00:22:31 mysterious arrival from above a massive
00:22:31 --> 00:22:34 metal object weighing over 1 lb
00:22:34 --> 00:22:36 plummeted from space and landed in their
00:22:36 --> 00:22:38 Community creating a sound that could be
00:22:38 --> 00:22:40 heard up to 30 m
00:22:40 --> 00:22:42 away the Kenya space agency quickly
00:22:42 --> 00:22:44 responded to the incident arriving at
00:22:44 --> 00:22:47 the scene on Tuesday morning working
00:22:47 --> 00:22:49 alongside local authorities they secured
00:22:49 --> 00:22:51 the area and retrieved what they later
00:22:51 --> 00:22:54 identified as a separation ring from a
00:22:54 --> 00:22:56 rocket launch this impressive piece of
00:22:56 --> 00:22:58 space Hardware measures approximately 8
00:22:58 --> 00:23:01 ft in diameter typically these
00:23:01 --> 00:23:03 separation rings are designed to either
00:23:03 --> 00:23:05 burn up during re-entry into Earth's
00:23:05 --> 00:23:07 atmosphere or land safely in unpopulated
00:23:07 --> 00:23:10 areas like oceans this particular
00:23:10 --> 00:23:12 Landing while unexpected fortunately
00:23:12 --> 00:23:15 caused no injuries or significant damage
00:23:15 --> 00:23:17 the space agency has assured the public
00:23:17 --> 00:23:18 there is no cause for concern and is
00:23:18 --> 00:23:21 treating this as an isolated incident
00:23:21 --> 00:23:22 they're handling the situation under
00:23:22 --> 00:23:24 International Space law protocols with
00:23:24 --> 00:23:26 the object now in their custody for
00:23:26 --> 00:23:28 further investigation it's a remarkable
00:23:28 --> 00:23:30 reminder of how space exploration
00:23:30 --> 00:23:32 occasionally makes surprising
00:23:32 --> 00:23:34 appearances in our everyday lives
00:23:34 --> 00:23:36 scientists have made an exciting
00:23:36 --> 00:23:37 breakthrough in our ability to detect
00:23:37 --> 00:23:39 gravitational waves those subtle ripples
00:23:39 --> 00:23:41 in SpaceTime that give us unique
00:23:41 --> 00:23:44 insights into Cosmic events researchers
00:23:44 --> 00:23:46 have developed a new technique called
00:23:46 --> 00:23:48 Optical spring tracking that could
00:23:48 --> 00:23:50 dramatically improve how clearly we can
00:23:50 --> 00:23:53 detect these elusive waves the advanced
00:23:53 --> 00:23:55 laser interferometer gravitational wave
00:23:55 --> 00:23:58 Observatory or aligo uses incredibly
00:23:58 --> 00:23:59 Sensi equipment to measure tiny
00:23:59 --> 00:24:01 distortions in SpaceTime caused by
00:24:01 --> 00:24:04 distant Cosmic events while this
00:24:04 --> 00:24:06 technology has already revolutionized
00:24:06 --> 00:24:07 our understanding of phenomena like
00:24:07 --> 00:24:10 black hole mergers it faces limitations
00:24:10 --> 00:24:12 from what scientists call Quantum noise
00:24:13 --> 00:24:14 this new Optical spring tracking system
00:24:15 --> 00:24:16 works by tuning itself to match the
00:24:16 --> 00:24:18 frequency of incoming gravitational
00:24:18 --> 00:24:21 waves in tests researchers used a
00:24:21 --> 00:24:23 microscopic mirror weighing just 50
00:24:23 --> 00:24:25 nanog made from carefully layered
00:24:25 --> 00:24:27 aluminum gallium arsenide and gallium
00:24:27 --> 00:24:29 arsenide
00:24:29 --> 00:24:30 when hit with laser light this tiny
00:24:30 --> 00:24:32 mirror creates an optical spring effect
00:24:32 --> 00:24:34 that can be precisely controlled to
00:24:34 --> 00:24:36 track and enhance gravitational wave
00:24:36 --> 00:24:39 signals the results have been remarkable
00:24:39 --> 00:24:41 in their proof of concept experiment the
00:24:41 --> 00:24:43 team demonstrated that tracking a signal
00:24:43 --> 00:24:46 with this system improved the signal to
00:24:46 --> 00:24:49 noise ratio by up to 40 times compared
00:24:49 --> 00:24:51 to traditional methods this means we
00:24:51 --> 00:24:53 could potentially detect much fainter
00:24:53 --> 00:24:55 gravitational waves from even more
00:24:55 --> 00:24:57 distant Cosmic events while implementing
00:24:57 --> 00:24:59 this Tech technology in fullscale
00:24:59 --> 00:25:01 observatories like ligo will require
00:25:01 --> 00:25:04 overcoming some engineering challenges
00:25:04 --> 00:25:06 the potential benefits are
00:25:06 --> 00:25:08 enormous by enhancing our ability to
00:25:08 --> 00:25:11 detect gravitational waves we might soon
00:25:11 --> 00:25:13 be able to observe events from the very
00:25:13 --> 00:25:16 earliest moments of our universe
00:25:16 --> 00:25:18 including the mergers of primordial
00:25:18 --> 00:25:20 black holes formed shortly after the big
00:25:20 --> 00:25:23 bang this advancement represents a
00:25:23 --> 00:25:25 significant step forward in our quest to
00:25:25 --> 00:25:26 understand the universe's most energetic
00:25:26 --> 00:25:28 events and could help unlock mysteries
00:25:28 --> 00:25:30 about how our Cosmos formed and evolved
00:25:30 --> 00:25:32 over billions of
00:25:32 --> 00:25:34 years and that's it from me for this
00:25:34 --> 00:25:37 episode of Space Nuts I'm Anna don't
00:25:37 --> 00:25:39 forget to visit astronomy daily. for
00:25:39 --> 00:25:41 your daily fix of space and astronomy
00:25:41 --> 00:25:44 news updates we're constantly updating
00:25:44 --> 00:25:45 the site with the latest discoveries
00:25:45 --> 00:25:48 Mission updates and Cosmic wonders until
00:25:48 --> 00:25:50 our next adventure through the cosmos
00:25:50 --> 00:25:52 keep looking up and stay curious about
00:25:52 --> 00:25:54 the Mysteries that surround us in space
00:25:54 --> 00:25:57 Space Nuts you'll be listening to the
00:25:57 --> 00:26:00 Space Nuts podcast
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