Space Nuts Episode 508: Space and Time, Movement in the Universe, and the Nature of Discovery
In this engaging Q&A edition of Space Nuts, host Andrew Dunkley is joined by astronomer Professor Fred Watson and special guest Heidi Campo as they tackle a variety of thought-provoking listener questions. From the intricate relationship between space and time within black holes to the inherent direction of movement in the universe, this episode is filled with fascinating insights and lively discussions that will ignite your curiosity about the cosmos.
Episode Highlights:
- Space and Time Dynamics: Andrew and Fred revisit a complex question about whether space and time switch roles inside the event horizon of a black hole, exploring the implications of this phenomenon and referencing an insightful video that clarifies the concept.
- Movement of Celestial Bodies: A listener inquires about the inherent direction of rotation and movement in the universe, leading to a discussion on the anti-clockwise motion of planets and galaxies, and the fascinating reasons behind these patterns.
- Osiris Rex Mission Insights: The team delves into the findings from NASA's Osiris Rex mission, examining the similarities between the asteroid Bennu and Earth, and the implications of its origin and composition.
- Hypothetical Science: A thought-provoking hypothetical question from a listener prompts a discussion on the nature of scientific discovery and the importance of unanswered questions in driving scientific inquiry.
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Stay curious, keep looking up, and join us next time for more stellar insights and cosmic wonders. Until then, clear skies and happy stargazing.
(00:00) This is a Q and A edition of Space Nuts
(01:41) Fred asks question about if space and time can switch roles inside black hole
(03:04) A video on Reddit explains how space and time interact inside a black hole
(11:08) Most objects in the universe have some form of rotation or movement
(18:08) Andrew Dunkley answers John Foster's question on Space Nuts
(18:39) NASA's Osiris Rex mission returned with a sample of the asteroid Bennu
(21:48) Would you rather be a scientist with nothing left to solve or everything wrong
(25:05) Robert asks if our solar system is unique or not
(29:43) Space Nuts podcast available at Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadioBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/space-nuts-exploring-the-cosmos--2631155/support (https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/space-nuts-exploring-the-cosmos--2631155/support?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=rss) .
Episode link: https://play.headliner.app/episode/26362584?utm_source=youtube
00:00:00 --> 00:00:01 hi there thanks for joining us this is
00:00:02 --> 00:00:03 Space Nuts andrew Dunley here great to
00:00:03 --> 00:00:06 have your company this is a Q&A edition
00:00:06 --> 00:00:09 which means we don't have to do anything
00:00:09 --> 00:00:11 because the audience provides all the
00:00:11 --> 00:00:12 content we just have to try and figure
00:00:12 --> 00:00:15 out what they want to know uh we have a
00:00:15 --> 00:00:19 follow-up from RK in Sweden about space
00:00:19 --> 00:00:21 and time apparently we tried to tackle
00:00:21 --> 00:00:23 this question at the end of last year we
00:00:23 --> 00:00:26 promised to review it in January it's
00:00:26 --> 00:00:29 now almost April
00:00:29 --> 00:00:31 we forgot but uh he sent us a gentle
00:00:32 --> 00:00:34 reminder so we'll see if we can handle
00:00:34 --> 00:00:37 that one uh John uh is looking at the
00:00:37 --> 00:00:40 inherent direction of object movement in
00:00:40 --> 00:00:43 space david has some thoughts on the
00:00:43 --> 00:00:46 Osiris mix Rex mission beloo has a
00:00:46 --> 00:00:49 hypothetical for you Fred and if we got
00:00:49 --> 00:00:50 anything else we can throw into the mix
00:00:50 --> 00:00:53 we will do so on this episode of Space
00:00:53 --> 00:00:58 Nuts 15 seconds guidance is internal 10
00:00:58 --> 00:01:03 9 Ignition sequence start space nuts 5 4
00:01:03 --> 00:01:07 3 2 1 2 3 4 5 5 4 3 2 1 Space Nuts
00:01:08 --> 00:01:10 astronauts report it feels good as much
00:01:10 --> 00:01:12 as he hates it he's back again professor
00:01:12 --> 00:01:14 Fred Watson astronomer at large hello
00:01:14 --> 00:01:18 Fred hello Andrew yes I am here well the
00:01:18 --> 00:01:21 bits bits of me are Yeah you know that's
00:01:21 --> 00:01:23 left i know you love it especially the
00:01:23 --> 00:01:27 Q&A um it it's always good actually some
00:01:27 --> 00:01:29 of these questions are incredible today
00:01:29 --> 00:01:31 so we'll um we'll enjoy those and Heidi
00:01:31 --> 00:01:35 Campo is with us on on a very steep
00:01:35 --> 00:01:36 learning curve into a black hole called
00:01:36 --> 00:01:40 Space Nuts and uh welcome Heidi thank
00:01:40 --> 00:01:43 you so much actually what I just said
00:01:43 --> 00:01:45 probably does relate to the very first
00:01:45 --> 00:01:48 question uh which has come from RKN
00:01:48 --> 00:01:51 Sweden he said this is a very long read
00:01:51 --> 00:01:54 so sit back relax get comfortable uh in
00:01:54 --> 00:01:57 episode 408 in December I asked a
00:01:57 --> 00:01:59 question about if space and time can
00:01:59 --> 00:02:01 switch roles inside the event horizon of
00:02:01 --> 00:02:03 our black hole in brackets uh more
00:02:03 --> 00:02:06 specifically does time and space switch
00:02:06 --> 00:02:08 roles the moment uh you pass the event
00:02:08 --> 00:02:12 horizon if so does that mean that the um
00:02:12 --> 00:02:15 that space can go in only one direction
00:02:15 --> 00:02:17 uh towards the center of a black hole
00:02:17 --> 00:02:19 hence the reason why nothing can get out
00:02:20 --> 00:02:22 does it also mean that time can go in
00:02:22 --> 00:02:24 any uh direction inside the event
00:02:24 --> 00:02:28 horizon uh in episode 504 you also
00:02:28 --> 00:02:31 mentioned that arrows of time might be
00:02:31 --> 00:02:33 might not be what we previously have
00:02:33 --> 00:02:35 thought uh you didn't have an answer
00:02:35 --> 00:02:37 straight out in December's episode and
00:02:37 --> 00:02:39 promised to come back to me mid
00:02:39 --> 00:02:43 January uh otherwise um you asked me to
00:02:43 --> 00:02:45 remind you then I guess space and time
00:02:45 --> 00:02:48 got switched for Fred and instead of
00:02:48 --> 00:02:50 replying in January he physically ended
00:02:50 --> 00:02:51 up in the northern hemisphere not far
00:02:51 --> 00:02:54 from where I live i almost expected him
00:02:54 --> 00:02:56 to personally deliver the answer uh that
00:02:56 --> 00:02:58 would have been nice anyway great show
00:02:58 --> 00:03:00 and I hope you'll continue until the end
00:03:00 --> 00:03:05 of time or space uh clear skies okay um
00:03:05 --> 00:03:08 Fred you sent me this amazing video
00:03:08 --> 00:03:12 which was on Reddit explaining spaceime
00:03:12 --> 00:03:15 and I it's it's about 12 minutes i
00:03:15 --> 00:03:18 watched the whole thing and I got off to
00:03:18 --> 00:03:20 a great start and then my brain just
00:03:20 --> 00:03:25 sort of imploded and melted down um but
00:03:25 --> 00:03:29 um what I got out of it was that space
00:03:29 --> 00:03:31 and time operate
00:03:32 --> 00:03:34 uh in in zero gravity as you would
00:03:34 --> 00:03:37 expect but as big objects start to
00:03:37 --> 00:03:40 disturb them things change uh and then
00:03:40 --> 00:03:42 you get to a black hole and that's where
00:03:42 --> 00:03:44 everything goes upside down so ARK is
00:03:44 --> 00:03:49 probably kind of on the money there
00:03:49 --> 00:03:54 um yes yes that that's correct uh the um
00:03:54 --> 00:03:57 I mean his question was well formulated
00:03:57 --> 00:03:59 there's never any doubt about that
00:03:59 --> 00:04:01 because we do know that um the roles of
00:04:01 --> 00:04:02 space and
00:04:02 --> 00:04:06 time they interchange within the black
00:04:06 --> 00:04:09 hole the question that RK was asking was
00:04:09 --> 00:04:13 why why is it so why does this happen
00:04:13 --> 00:04:17 and I sort of knew the the physics I
00:04:17 --> 00:04:22 guess in in a handwaving way but uh I
00:04:22 --> 00:04:25 looked for something that would explain
00:04:25 --> 00:04:27 it in as what I thought was as concise a
00:04:27 --> 00:04:29 way as possible and came across this
00:04:29 --> 00:04:33 video which you've watched and I'm sorry
00:04:33 --> 00:04:36 you it lost you halfway through uh but
00:04:36 --> 00:04:39 keep watching because it is very clear
00:04:39 --> 00:04:42 as to what's happening yeah uh and I we
00:04:42 --> 00:04:44 should credit the author of this video
00:04:44 --> 00:04:48 whose name is Aleandro Rousel uh and um
00:04:48 --> 00:04:50 you can find it it was the Reddit
00:04:50 --> 00:04:53 discussion is is where exactly as you
00:04:53 --> 00:04:55 said where it turned up um RK have a
00:04:56 --> 00:04:58 look at this uh it's called Why Time and
00:04:58 --> 00:05:00 Space Flip Inside a Black Hole as Andrew
00:05:00 --> 00:05:03 said it's a 12minute video it is very
00:05:03 --> 00:05:05 very well done yeah it's on the uh just
00:05:05 --> 00:05:07 so I can get it through to him quick
00:05:07 --> 00:05:09 before I forget uh it's on the physics
00:05:09 --> 00:05:12 subreddit so okay
00:05:12 --> 00:05:15 right okay i'm I'm not a Reddit person
00:05:15 --> 00:05:18 so I wasn't aware of that but I did see
00:05:18 --> 00:05:19 physics there
00:05:19 --> 00:05:22 um so and and it comes about because of
00:05:22 --> 00:05:26 this relativistic concept of light cones
00:05:26 --> 00:05:30 um the fact that uh if you look at a
00:05:30 --> 00:05:33 fourdimensional space you in order to
00:05:33 --> 00:05:34 get this into your head you've got to
00:05:34 --> 00:05:37 collapse it to three dimensions so that
00:05:37 --> 00:05:39 uh the three dimensions of space are
00:05:39 --> 00:05:41 squashed into a plane and the other
00:05:41 --> 00:05:45 dimension is time um then um it's part
00:05:46 --> 00:05:48 and parcel of the way relativity works
00:05:48 --> 00:05:50 that um there's what's called a light
00:05:50 --> 00:05:55 cone which is effectively a 45 degree
00:05:55 --> 00:05:59 angle cone uh which is on the inside of
00:05:59 --> 00:06:02 the cone are things that you can see
00:06:02 --> 00:06:06 because their light will reach you as an
00:06:06 --> 00:06:08 observer on the outside of the cone the
00:06:08 --> 00:06:10 stuff that you'll never see because it's
00:06:10 --> 00:06:12 light will never get to you and that's
00:06:12 --> 00:06:14 the bottom line i'm not really
00:06:14 --> 00:06:16 explaining this very well um it needs a
00:06:16 --> 00:06:19 diagram and the video is replete with
00:06:19 --> 00:06:22 moving diagrams which I think explain it
00:06:22 --> 00:06:25 uh the the bottom line of this is that
00:06:25 --> 00:06:30 as you approach a black hole you are in
00:06:30 --> 00:06:34 a regime where the space is highly
00:06:34 --> 00:06:38 highly curved uh I'm sorry uh there's
00:06:38 --> 00:06:40 something going on outside my window
00:06:40 --> 00:06:42 which sounded like a cockatu it's it was
00:06:42 --> 00:06:45 three cocker passing over a scrap of
00:06:45 --> 00:06:47 meat and then they were dispersed by
00:06:47 --> 00:06:50 young Jordy there who decided to come
00:06:50 --> 00:06:53 and join in so um if anything really
00:06:53 --> 00:06:54 exciting happens I'll turn my laptop
00:06:54 --> 00:06:56 around and you can watch it live but
00:06:56 --> 00:07:01 it's not that good at the moment um so
00:07:01 --> 00:07:04 sorry uh so so that the as you get near
00:07:04 --> 00:07:08 a black hole you are because of the fact
00:07:08 --> 00:07:11 that we know space distorts in the
00:07:11 --> 00:07:13 presence of mass with a black hole that
00:07:14 --> 00:07:17 distortion is extreme uh the theory of
00:07:17 --> 00:07:20 relativity uh is what allows us to
00:07:20 --> 00:07:22 understand the distortion of space but
00:07:22 --> 00:07:25 the particular case of a very small uh
00:07:26 --> 00:07:29 singularity in fact a point with zero uh
00:07:29 --> 00:07:33 dimensions distorting space that was
00:07:33 --> 00:07:35 analyzed not by Einstein but by his
00:07:35 --> 00:07:38 colleague Schvat just after Einstein
00:07:38 --> 00:07:41 published his relativity theory uh and
00:07:41 --> 00:07:44 that tells you that the space is highly
00:07:44 --> 00:07:48 curved around a black hole m and what
00:07:48 --> 00:07:51 that means is your light cur your your
00:07:51 --> 00:07:55 light cone gets bent basically uh it
00:07:55 --> 00:07:57 bends towards the black hole and the
00:07:57 --> 00:08:01 time dimension of the light cone
00:08:01 --> 00:08:04 actually becomes space effectively
00:08:04 --> 00:08:05 because it's pointing towards the black
00:08:05 --> 00:08:08 hole it's it's the the twisting of space
00:08:08 --> 00:08:11 and time that results in that
00:08:11 --> 00:08:14 interchange between space and time uh I
00:08:14 --> 00:08:16 haven't explained it well uh that little
00:08:16 --> 00:08:20 video um Alessandro's video I think is
00:08:20 --> 00:08:22 is pretty well as good as it gets in
00:08:22 --> 00:08:24 trying to explain this without immersing
00:08:24 --> 00:08:28 yourself in some horrendous mathematics
00:08:28 --> 00:08:31 yeah the video gives an example of an
00:08:31 --> 00:08:34 astronaut falling into a black hole and
00:08:34 --> 00:08:37 once you pass the event horizon
00:08:37 --> 00:08:39 everything turns upside down and you're
00:08:39 --> 00:08:42 just being sort of drawn to the center
00:08:42 --> 00:08:46 of the um the black hole space and time
00:08:46 --> 00:08:49 flip basically that That's right it's a
00:08:49 --> 00:08:51 it's an angle almost an angle thing yeah
00:08:51 --> 00:08:53 um um Alessandro did resist the
00:08:53 --> 00:08:55 temptation to depict the astronaut being
00:08:55 --> 00:08:57 spaghettified would have probably not
00:08:57 --> 00:08:59 been it's almost like uh depicting
00:09:00 --> 00:09:01 falling into the upside down in the TV
00:09:02 --> 00:09:04 show Stranger Things
00:09:04 --> 00:09:07 yeah more or less uh that would Yeah I'
00:09:07 --> 00:09:08 I've seen that series and I know what
00:09:08 --> 00:09:11 you're talking about so yes um Fred
00:09:11 --> 00:09:13 probably hasn't
00:09:13 --> 00:09:15 uh I haven't no
00:09:15 --> 00:09:18 no he he has much more eclectic taste
00:09:18 --> 00:09:21 than I have but um uh we often share
00:09:21 --> 00:09:24 notes on TV shows and movies and um of
00:09:24 --> 00:09:27 course your podcasts about science
00:09:27 --> 00:09:28 fiction whether or not it could happen
00:09:28 --> 00:09:32 in real life uh is is a great listen and
00:09:32 --> 00:09:34 I've love listen to a couple of episodes
00:09:34 --> 00:09:36 and the people you get on there are
00:09:36 --> 00:09:38 fantastic Heidi and um yeah it's
00:09:38 --> 00:09:42 interesting how sci-fi has kind of um
00:09:42 --> 00:09:44 worked its way into real life and not
00:09:44 --> 00:09:47 the other way around sometimes so um
00:09:47 --> 00:09:49 yeah it it's it's a really interesting
00:09:49 --> 00:09:52 sort of a pseudocience type of thing
00:09:52 --> 00:09:55 here's a side tangent with that um I was
00:09:55 --> 00:09:57 interviewing some uh spacuit engineer
00:09:57 --> 00:09:59 recently and she was telling me an
00:09:59 --> 00:10:02 interesting factoid that the first model
00:10:02 --> 00:10:06 spaceuits they painted them silver not
00:10:06 --> 00:10:08 for any benefit to the astronauts but
00:10:08 --> 00:10:11 because that's what sci-fi depicted
00:10:11 --> 00:10:13 space suits as
00:10:13 --> 00:10:15 so they thought well we need to make it
00:10:15 --> 00:10:17 look like a space suit and so there are
00:10:17 --> 00:10:20 so many cases where science fiction
00:10:20 --> 00:10:23 influences the science that we're
00:10:23 --> 00:10:25 actually doing and that's just one funny
00:10:25 --> 00:10:27 example yeah that's I didn't know that
00:10:27 --> 00:10:29 that's an absolute ripper that would
00:10:29 --> 00:10:31 have made a great radio question back
00:10:31 --> 00:10:33 when I was on the radio yeah used to
00:10:33 --> 00:10:36 love doing all that sort of stuff um but
00:10:36 --> 00:10:39 yeah that that's um what I might do for
00:10:39 --> 00:10:42 AR is um if I can find his email I'll
00:10:42 --> 00:10:44 email him the link to the video that
00:10:44 --> 00:10:46 would be great in fact uh Hugh if he
00:10:46 --> 00:10:48 hears this part of the podcast might
00:10:48 --> 00:10:51 want to put that on the show notes so I
00:10:51 --> 00:10:54 can um that might be a way around it as
00:10:54 --> 00:10:57 well but Ary thanks for the question
00:10:57 --> 00:10:59 hopefully adequately answered it we we
00:10:59 --> 00:11:05 strive for adequacy here on Space
00:11:05 --> 00:11:09 Nuts and I feel space nuts uh now to an
00:11:09 --> 00:11:14 audio question here's John this is John
00:11:14 --> 00:11:16 from Foster and I have a question
00:11:16 --> 00:11:21 regarding the movement of objects in the
00:11:21 --> 00:11:23 universe it appears to me that most
00:11:23 --> 00:11:26 objects in the universe have some form
00:11:26 --> 00:11:31 of rotation or movement either the
00:11:31 --> 00:11:36 rotation of a planet or a moon on its
00:11:36 --> 00:11:43 axis or the orbit of the moon around its
00:11:43 --> 00:11:45 planet the orbit of a planet around a
00:11:46 --> 00:11:50 star and the rotation of galaxies
00:11:50 --> 00:11:52 now save
00:11:52 --> 00:11:56 for those circumstances
00:11:56 --> 00:12:00 where an object is tightly locked due to
00:12:00 --> 00:12:03 gravity and some
00:12:03 --> 00:12:06 exceptions for certain reasons which you
00:12:06 --> 00:12:08 might be able to explain
00:12:08 --> 00:12:13 my question is is there an
00:12:13 --> 00:12:16 inherent direction of movement and
00:12:16 --> 00:12:19 rotation much like the corololis effect
00:12:19 --> 00:12:23 on weather and water on Earth that
00:12:23 --> 00:12:27 applies to celestial bodies in other
00:12:27 --> 00:12:31 words do bodies inherently spin in a
00:12:31 --> 00:12:35 certain direction do planets inherently
00:12:35 --> 00:12:38 orbit in a certain direction
00:12:38 --> 00:12:41 and do galaxies spin in a certain
00:12:41 --> 00:12:47 direction and if so why and if not why
00:12:47 --> 00:12:49 not
00:12:49 --> 00:12:52 thank you okay thank you John um hope
00:12:52 --> 00:12:54 you're well in Foster heidi Foster is
00:12:54 --> 00:12:56 one of the most horrible places in the
00:12:56 --> 00:12:59 world that I would never live horri
00:12:59 --> 00:13:01 dreadful dreadful no it's beautiful
00:13:01 --> 00:13:02 absolutely beautiful up there on the
00:13:02 --> 00:13:05 midn north coast of uh New South Wales
00:13:05 --> 00:13:09 yeah uh very popular holiday spot um is
00:13:09 --> 00:13:11 there an inherent direction that objects
00:13:11 --> 00:13:15 move in space if so why uh and the
00:13:15 --> 00:13:17 direction I think he's talking about is
00:13:17 --> 00:13:20 that away that away would be the simple
00:13:20 --> 00:13:22 answer but I think you probably know a
00:13:22 --> 00:13:24 bit more about it than I do fred if you
00:13:24 --> 00:13:28 were pointing uh east Andrew I wasn't no
00:13:28 --> 00:13:30 I am now right that's the way you're
00:13:30 --> 00:13:32 moving because the Earth's
00:13:32 --> 00:13:35 rotation and you're doing roughly 1400
00:13:35 --> 00:13:38 kilometer an hour eastwards so hang on
00:13:38 --> 00:13:41 and look at my hair it's not even moving
00:13:41 --> 00:13:44 anyway uh look there's there's a number
00:13:44 --> 00:13:46 of layers to this question it's a great
00:13:46 --> 00:13:48 question John and um I you've actually
00:13:48 --> 00:13:50 touched on something that's right at the
00:13:50 --> 00:13:52 cutting edge of research but the one
00:13:52 --> 00:13:53 thing that's not really at the cutting
00:13:53 --> 00:13:56 edge of research is why planets in a
00:13:56 --> 00:13:59 solar system like ours all do have a
00:13:59 --> 00:14:01 preferred direction of not just
00:14:01 --> 00:14:05 revolution around the sun but uh um
00:14:05 --> 00:14:08 rotation about their axes uh so if you
00:14:08 --> 00:14:11 sit at the above the north pole of the
00:14:11 --> 00:14:14 earth and look down at the earth and the
00:14:14 --> 00:14:16 whole solar system virtually everything
00:14:16 --> 00:14:18 is rotating
00:14:18 --> 00:14:20 anticlockwise uh not everything there
00:14:20 --> 00:14:22 are one or two things that don't fit the
00:14:22 --> 00:14:25 picture but when you generalize it the
00:14:25 --> 00:14:27 planets are all moving
00:14:27 --> 00:14:29 anticlockwise they most of them are
00:14:29 --> 00:14:31 rotating anticlockwise their moons are
00:14:31 --> 00:14:34 going around in orbit anticlockwise uh
00:14:34 --> 00:14:36 the whole thing is you know it's an
00:14:36 --> 00:14:38 anticlockwise do dominated um
00:14:38 --> 00:14:40 environment and that's because of the
00:14:40 --> 00:14:43 way all this stuff has been formed
00:14:43 --> 00:14:45 because originally it was part of a disc
00:14:45 --> 00:14:47 of material that was going guess what
00:14:47 --> 00:14:51 anticlockwise around the baby sun uh the
00:14:51 --> 00:14:54 sun's formation involved the collapse of
00:14:54 --> 00:14:57 a cloud of gas and dust the central part
00:14:57 --> 00:15:00 got hot enough to start nuclear fusion
00:15:00 --> 00:15:03 reactions uh and the rest of it formed
00:15:03 --> 00:15:05 into this disc the pro protolanetary
00:15:05 --> 00:15:08 disc we talked about in the last episode
00:15:08 --> 00:15:10 and the moons there are moons forming in
00:15:10 --> 00:15:11 that as well and certainly in the case
00:15:11 --> 00:15:13 of the solar system everything's going
00:15:13 --> 00:15:15 anticlockwise so that's to do with the
00:15:15 --> 00:15:19 way it was way it was formed and it's
00:15:19 --> 00:15:22 likely that the rotation of galaxies is
00:15:22 --> 00:15:25 like that too that you might well find
00:15:25 --> 00:15:28 that a galaxy uh originally collapsed
00:15:28 --> 00:15:31 from a very much larger cloud of gas
00:15:32 --> 00:15:34 probably gas cuz these happened earlier
00:15:34 --> 00:15:35 there would probably not be that much
00:15:35 --> 00:15:37 dust around at the time although there's
00:15:37 --> 00:15:40 some there um that gas cloud would have
00:15:40 --> 00:15:44 an inherent rotation um which probably
00:15:44 --> 00:15:46 would have come just from a prevalence
00:15:46 --> 00:15:48 there would have been in a static gas
00:15:48 --> 00:15:49 cloud there are going to be eddies
00:15:49 --> 00:15:52 forming and it as this thing collapses
00:15:52 --> 00:15:55 those eddies kind of basically you know
00:15:55 --> 00:15:57 there's an election and the the most
00:15:57 --> 00:16:00 common direction of eddying is what ends
00:16:00 --> 00:16:03 up being the rotation of the gas cloud
00:16:03 --> 00:16:06 as a whole and so that's why probably
00:16:06 --> 00:16:08 why galaxies are rotating uh but the
00:16:08 --> 00:16:09 reason why I think you've put your
00:16:09 --> 00:16:11 finger on something very new John is
00:16:11 --> 00:16:13 that um there was a study I read I
00:16:14 --> 00:16:15 didn't really read it in detail and I've
00:16:15 --> 00:16:17 yet to go back to it but it was some
00:16:17 --> 00:16:19 results that came out I think about a
00:16:19 --> 00:16:22 fortnight ago that suggests that when
00:16:22 --> 00:16:23 you look at the very distant universe
00:16:24 --> 00:16:25 there is a prevalent direction of
00:16:25 --> 00:16:29 rotation of galaxies uh and it's you
00:16:29 --> 00:16:32 know they're all at different angles but
00:16:32 --> 00:16:35 uh it looked as though uh from our
00:16:35 --> 00:16:38 perspective an anticlockwise rotation
00:16:38 --> 00:16:39 was more prevalent than a clockwise
00:16:39 --> 00:16:41 rotation i think that's right rather
00:16:41 --> 00:16:43 than the other way around can't remember
00:16:43 --> 00:16:44 might might have been the other way
00:16:44 --> 00:16:46 around doesn't matter um the the bottom
00:16:46 --> 00:16:47 line is that there seems to be a
00:16:47 --> 00:16:50 preferred direction of rotation and that
00:16:50 --> 00:16:51 flies in the face of what we understand
00:16:52 --> 00:16:54 about the way galaxies form we think
00:16:54 --> 00:16:56 there should be no preferred direction
00:16:56 --> 00:16:58 of rotation and so there may be new
00:16:58 --> 00:17:01 results coming from that too and I
00:17:01 --> 00:17:02 should have read it in more detail if
00:17:02 --> 00:17:04 I'd known John's question was coming uh
00:17:04 --> 00:17:07 but I will uh have a look at it and see
00:17:07 --> 00:17:08 if there's anything more to add to that
00:17:08 --> 00:17:12 story m we we do see
00:17:12 --> 00:17:14 variations which are circumstantial even
00:17:14 --> 00:17:17 in our solar system when you got you got
00:17:17 --> 00:17:19 Venus is it Venus that spins the wrong
00:17:19 --> 00:17:22 way and yeah and and Uranus is on its
00:17:22 --> 00:17:24 side and spins the wrong way and all
00:17:24 --> 00:17:26 that and and there are few moons that go
00:17:26 --> 00:17:27 the wrong way around because they've
00:17:27 --> 00:17:29 been captured rather than you know
00:17:29 --> 00:17:32 formed in situ so there are yes you're
00:17:32 --> 00:17:34 you're absolutely right there are
00:17:34 --> 00:17:36 misfits but we can understand the reason
00:17:36 --> 00:17:39 why they're there the rotation but the
00:17:39 --> 00:17:41 big picture everything's pretty well
00:17:41 --> 00:17:44 doing the same kind of thing quite so
00:17:44 --> 00:17:48 and did we figure out why yes we did
00:17:48 --> 00:17:50 good i was listen I I was always
00:17:50 --> 00:17:52 listening yeah we It's the rotation of
00:17:52 --> 00:17:54 the protoplanetary disc Andrew yes
00:17:54 --> 00:17:56 that's it i knew that i heard you say
00:17:56 --> 00:18:00 that it just It just went like you know
00:18:00 --> 00:18:03 straight through went clockwise right
00:18:03 --> 00:18:05 through your head my head's in my head's
00:18:05 --> 00:18:06 in vacation mode that's what's going on
00:18:06 --> 00:18:11 i can tell i can tell yeah yeah um so
00:18:11 --> 00:18:14 the answer is yes because John
00:18:14 --> 00:18:16 but but it may be yes because we don't
00:18:16 --> 00:18:21 know as well with big picture stuff so
00:18:22 --> 00:18:24 thanks John hope all is well in that
00:18:24 --> 00:18:26 dreadful corner of the world called
00:18:26 --> 00:18:29 Foster uh this is Space Nuts andrew
00:18:29 --> 00:18:31 Dunley here with Fred Watson and Heidi
00:18:31 --> 00:18:35 Campo
00:18:35 --> 00:18:40 3 2 1 space nuts and our next question
00:18:40 --> 00:18:43 comes from David david's in Indiana uh
00:18:43 --> 00:18:46 NASA's Osiris Rex mission returned with
00:18:46 --> 00:18:49 a sample of the asteroid Bennu uh the
00:18:49 --> 00:18:51 announced testing results just released
00:18:51 --> 00:18:54 are in are interesting uh or
00:18:54 --> 00:18:56 interestingly close to our planet's
00:18:56 --> 00:18:58 makeup it starts me wondering with
00:18:58 --> 00:19:02 Beno's proximity or Beno's Benu's
00:19:02 --> 00:19:05 proximity so close to to Earth could it
00:19:05 --> 00:19:08 have been a satellite of ours or
00:19:08 --> 00:19:10 possibly ejector from a collision with
00:19:10 --> 00:19:13 another solar object like Thea which
00:19:13 --> 00:19:14 you've already mentioned greatly enjoy
00:19:14 --> 00:19:17 the podcast Dave in Westfield Indiana uh
00:19:18 --> 00:19:19 Dave if you were in Westfield in
00:19:19 --> 00:19:20 Australia you'd be living in a shopping
00:19:20 --> 00:19:23 mall but um that's a different story
00:19:23 --> 00:19:26 there's uh Westfields all over the world
00:19:26 --> 00:19:28 yeah maybe so
00:19:28 --> 00:19:34 um it's uh probably not uh is the answer
00:19:34 --> 00:19:37 to that i you know probably didn't form
00:19:37 --> 00:19:39 as as something that was knocked off the
00:19:39 --> 00:19:42 earth uh because it's composition yes
00:19:42 --> 00:19:46 there's a lot of similarities but um I
00:19:46 --> 00:19:47 think people who know much more about
00:19:47 --> 00:19:49 asteroid origins than I
00:19:49 --> 00:19:53 do bye Heidi yeah she dropped out
00:19:53 --> 00:19:55 something must have happened but yeah I
00:19:55 --> 00:20:00 think so um uh would would say um the
00:20:00 --> 00:20:03 evidence seems to be that there was um
00:20:03 --> 00:20:05 there was a collision but it wasn't
00:20:05 --> 00:20:07 involving the Earth it was a much larger
00:20:07 --> 00:20:11 asteroid carbonri probably like Bennu is
00:20:11 --> 00:20:16 um and that it it was it's probably that
00:20:16 --> 00:20:18 probably happened you know within the
00:20:18 --> 00:20:21 last hund uh within the last billion to
00:20:21 --> 00:20:24 two billion years um and it formed in
00:20:24 --> 00:20:27 the main asteroid belt and probably that
00:20:27 --> 00:20:30 collision is what sent it uh to interact
00:20:30 --> 00:20:33 much more closely with our own planet so
00:20:33 --> 00:20:35 it seems unlikely despite the
00:20:35 --> 00:20:37 similarities which I agree with you
00:20:37 --> 00:20:39 there are similarities in composition
00:20:39 --> 00:20:43 but it may well be that that's just you
00:20:43 --> 00:20:45 know circumstantial and it may might be
00:20:45 --> 00:20:46 because the earth basically came from
00:20:46 --> 00:20:49 the asteroid belt or at least it came
00:20:49 --> 00:20:51 from the same protolanetary cloud yeah
00:20:51 --> 00:20:54 absolutely um and yet we do see
00:20:54 --> 00:20:57 variations like uh like fear hit the
00:20:57 --> 00:21:00 earth and and we've got the moon but
00:21:00 --> 00:21:02 there's stuff on the moon that you can't
00:21:02 --> 00:21:04 find easily on Earth and there's more of
00:21:04 --> 00:21:07 it and you know there are differences
00:21:08 --> 00:21:09 some of that stuff's more recent though
00:21:09 --> 00:21:11 that you know it's because of the the
00:21:11 --> 00:21:14 interaction between the moon and the uh
00:21:14 --> 00:21:16 and the the solar radiation things like
00:21:16 --> 00:21:19 helium 3 which is much more common on
00:21:19 --> 00:21:21 the moon than it is on Earth but the but
00:21:21 --> 00:21:23 the the rocks of the moon are basically
00:21:23 --> 00:21:25 the same as the rocks of the earth with
00:21:25 --> 00:21:27 a similar isotopic composition just
00:21:27 --> 00:21:31 boring old bassalt a lot of it is yeah
00:21:31 --> 00:21:34 yeah but you find that stuff everywhere
00:21:34 --> 00:21:38 oh yes yeah um okay so there you are
00:21:38 --> 00:21:42 David probably not is the answer our
00:21:42 --> 00:21:44 final well sort of question um yeah it's
00:21:44 --> 00:21:47 a question uh from Belaloo who's uh sent
00:21:47 --> 00:21:50 questions in before um this is a
00:21:50 --> 00:21:53 hypothetical for you Freddy you ready
00:21:53 --> 00:21:56 are you ready Freddy here we go
00:21:56 --> 00:21:58 lou here again from Fyville North
00:21:58 --> 00:22:03 Carolina would you rather be a scientist
00:22:03 --> 00:22:05 with nothing left to solve nothing left
00:22:06 --> 00:22:10 to discover or a scientist and
00:22:10 --> 00:22:12 everything that you try to invent
00:22:12 --> 00:22:15 discover figure out is wrong you It's
00:22:15 --> 00:22:17 just always wrong you never get any
00:22:17 --> 00:22:19 headway thanks hope to hear y'all's
00:22:19 --> 00:22:22 answers may the force be with y'all have
00:22:22 --> 00:22:25 a great Thanks Belaloo um I think most
00:22:25 --> 00:22:27 scientists are option two aren't they
00:22:27 --> 00:22:31 yeah well I certainly am yes yeah yeah
00:22:31 --> 00:22:33 and um to be honest I'd rather be one
00:22:33 --> 00:22:36 you know if if it I'd rather be that
00:22:36 --> 00:22:39 than than somebody who solved everything
00:22:39 --> 00:22:40 because the odds are if you thought
00:22:40 --> 00:22:42 you'd solved everything you haven't
00:22:42 --> 00:22:45 because most science actually digs up
00:22:45 --> 00:22:48 more science it's all about uh you know
00:22:48 --> 00:22:51 discovery raises always raises more
00:22:52 --> 00:22:55 questions than it answers uh and so uh
00:22:55 --> 00:22:58 it looks as though all knowledge is not
00:22:58 --> 00:23:01 something we will ever achieve uh and
00:23:01 --> 00:23:02 that there's
00:23:02 --> 00:23:06 um trying to think uh there is that
00:23:06 --> 00:23:09 girdle's theorem that uh we can never
00:23:09 --> 00:23:10 know everything i can't remember the the
00:23:10 --> 00:23:11 details i think it is I think it's
00:23:11 --> 00:23:14 Girdle's theorem theorem that whatever
00:23:14 --> 00:23:16 we discover there'll be something else
00:23:16 --> 00:23:18 left to discover it's a mathematical
00:23:18 --> 00:23:23 hypothesis um so yes we we may well uh
00:23:23 --> 00:23:25 never know the answer to everything uh
00:23:26 --> 00:23:27 and that's good because it means
00:23:27 --> 00:23:29 scientists will always have a job yeah
00:23:30 --> 00:23:32 girdle's incompleteness theorems two
00:23:32 --> 00:23:35 theorems of mathematical logic that are
00:23:35 --> 00:23:38 concerned with the limits of um
00:23:38 --> 00:23:43 probability in formal axiomatic theories
00:23:44 --> 00:23:47 yep that's that's right yeah just as you
00:23:47 --> 00:23:51 said um it says there widely but not
00:23:51 --> 00:23:53 universally interpreted as showing that
00:23:53 --> 00:23:56 uh Hilbert's program to find a complete
00:23:56 --> 00:23:58 and consistent set of axioms for all
00:23:58 --> 00:24:00 mathematical all mathematics is
00:24:00 --> 00:24:02 impossible
00:24:02 --> 00:24:05 there you go yeah um that that's another
00:24:05 --> 00:24:07 one that makes your head hurt but like
00:24:07 --> 00:24:10 look when you get down to the bottom
00:24:10 --> 00:24:12 line it makes sense that we could never
00:24:12 --> 00:24:14 solve everything and once you solve
00:24:14 --> 00:24:17 something it's it's like astronomy um
00:24:17 --> 00:24:20 once you've found something that answers
00:24:20 --> 00:24:24 a question you you find yourself with
00:24:24 --> 00:24:25 another array of
00:24:25 --> 00:24:29 questions um it just it's just ongoing
00:24:29 --> 00:24:32 and and look what would humans be
00:24:32 --> 00:24:34 without the need to discover if
00:24:34 --> 00:24:37 everything was solved we'd get bored
00:24:37 --> 00:24:41 real quick i think we would yes I think
00:24:41 --> 00:24:43 we would you're right yeah it wouldn't
00:24:43 --> 00:24:46 be fun anymore uh and mysteries are good
00:24:46 --> 00:24:48 to have because it just keeps you
00:24:48 --> 00:24:53 motivated to try and solve problems and
00:24:53 --> 00:24:54 yeah we we don't want to solve
00:24:54 --> 00:24:56 everything well I suppose we do but
00:24:56 --> 00:24:57 that's what drives
00:24:57 --> 00:25:01 us I would suggest um have you got time
00:25:01 --> 00:25:03 for one more without notice Fred yeah
00:25:03 --> 00:25:06 yeah yeah let's do it uh this one comes
00:25:06 --> 00:25:09 from Robert hello Fred Andrew this is
00:25:09 --> 00:25:12 Robert from the Nethers i have a
00:25:12 --> 00:25:14 question for the professor about the
00:25:14 --> 00:25:16 discover your
00:25:16 --> 00:25:18 exoplanets because I'm not sure if the
00:25:18 --> 00:25:20 same configuration is our own solar
00:25:20 --> 00:25:23 system and what for inner rocky planets
00:25:23 --> 00:25:26 and for our gas giants if that
00:25:26 --> 00:25:29 configuration is unique or not as you
00:25:29 --> 00:25:31 know there's been a lot of discoveries
00:25:31 --> 00:25:34 of these planetary systems not to insane
00:25:34 --> 00:25:37 details the solar system of course I was
00:25:37 --> 00:25:41 just curious if we are very unique or
00:25:41 --> 00:25:43 Not
00:25:43 --> 00:25:45 thank you so much for taking time
00:25:45 --> 00:25:48 bye-bye thank you Robert um this is a
00:25:48 --> 00:25:50 question we've um had previously but
00:25:50 --> 00:25:52 it's it's good one to revisit i think we
00:25:52 --> 00:25:55 did talk about it fairly recently but um
00:25:55 --> 00:25:57 uh is our solar system the way it's set
00:25:58 --> 00:26:01 up rocky rocky rocky gas gas gas gas um
00:26:01 --> 00:26:06 unique and the answer is mostly yes
00:26:06 --> 00:26:09 isn't it well it's it's unique in the
00:26:09 --> 00:26:12 sense that um so far yes so far that's
00:26:12 --> 00:26:18 right uh and it it it is unlike um it's
00:26:18 --> 00:26:20 unlike most of the other things that we
00:26:20 --> 00:26:23 find but some of that might be due to
00:26:23 --> 00:26:26 the fact that we've got what we call
00:26:26 --> 00:26:28 selection effects you know that you
00:26:28 --> 00:26:31 can't um really
00:26:31 --> 00:26:34 see everything when we look out at the
00:26:34 --> 00:26:36 exoplanet so there may well be systems
00:26:36 --> 00:26:38 where there are planets you know four
00:26:38 --> 00:26:41 rocky planets at the sort of distance
00:26:41 --> 00:26:44 that ours has which are actually really
00:26:44 --> 00:26:47 hard to discover they're the really that
00:26:47 --> 00:26:48 they're the ones that are the most
00:26:48 --> 00:26:50 difficult to discover so the the easiest
00:26:50 --> 00:26:51 things to discover are massive things
00:26:51 --> 00:26:54 like Jupiter or bigger than Jupiter uh
00:26:54 --> 00:26:57 we are pushing down the mass spectrum
00:26:57 --> 00:26:59 towards the
00:26:59 --> 00:27:02 more you know the smaller bodies of uh
00:27:02 --> 00:27:04 equivalent to the the rocky planets in
00:27:04 --> 00:27:06 our solar system but it's still
00:27:06 --> 00:27:08 nevertheless
00:27:08 --> 00:27:11 um ours is a very special case because
00:27:11 --> 00:27:14 we could see it in detail uh and we
00:27:14 --> 00:27:17 haven't really seen anything like it but
00:27:17 --> 00:27:19 it doesn't necessarily mean that there
00:27:19 --> 00:27:21 isn't anything out there that's like it
00:27:21 --> 00:27:24 so it may not be unique we might just be
00:27:24 --> 00:27:26 unique in in as much as what's been
00:27:26 --> 00:27:28 discovered so far yeah that that makes
00:27:28 --> 00:27:31 sense and given how many systems exist
00:27:31 --> 00:27:33 out there I'd be very surprised if we
00:27:33 --> 00:27:37 don't find multiple solar systems like
00:27:37 --> 00:27:40 ours in time to come so
00:27:40 --> 00:27:43 uh at the moment Robert it looks that
00:27:43 --> 00:27:46 way but ultimately probably not I think
00:27:46 --> 00:27:49 would be the short answer uh thanks
00:27:49 --> 00:27:52 Robert thanks Beloo David John Aki uh
00:27:52 --> 00:27:54 for sending in your questions uh much
00:27:54 --> 00:27:56 appreciated of course if you have a
00:27:56 --> 00:27:59 question for us please send it in to
00:27:59 --> 00:28:01 Spacenuts uh via our website just click
00:28:01 --> 00:28:04 on the AMA link at the top uh
00:28:04 --> 00:28:07 spaceodcast.com
00:28:07 --> 00:28:10 spacenuts.io uh and that's it for me for
00:28:10 --> 00:28:12 probably the next eight or so episodes
00:28:12 --> 00:28:15 judy and I are taking a little sojourn
00:28:15 --> 00:28:17 uh we're going to um cruise the Panama
00:28:17 --> 00:28:19 Canal and visit a few countries along
00:28:19 --> 00:28:23 the way uh I'll be back late April but
00:28:23 --> 00:28:25 uh Fred will be in the capable of hands
00:28:25 --> 00:28:27 of Heidi Campo who had to exit early i
00:28:28 --> 00:28:30 think her dog was getting hungry and you
00:28:30 --> 00:28:33 never say no to a dog um but uh yeah
00:28:33 --> 00:28:35 Heidi will be looking after everything
00:28:35 --> 00:28:39 with the uh cooperation of one Hugh in
00:28:39 --> 00:28:42 the studio uh and Fred thank you so much
00:28:42 --> 00:28:45 uh I um I really appreciate it and I
00:28:45 --> 00:28:47 I'll see you in about a month i'll look
00:28:47 --> 00:28:49 forward to that Andrew i hope you have a
00:28:49 --> 00:28:51 great time um just watch out for the
00:28:51 --> 00:28:54 Panama Canal it's not very wide yeah um
00:28:54 --> 00:28:56 well I don't know if we're I don't know
00:28:56 --> 00:28:58 which way we're going into it but we we
00:28:58 --> 00:29:02 end up I think we end up in Panama City
00:29:02 --> 00:29:03 for a couple of days uh which we're
00:29:04 --> 00:29:05 going to enjoy but we're actually going
00:29:05 --> 00:29:08 to do a a full-on proper Panama Canal
00:29:08 --> 00:29:11 tour cuz I I want to understand it more
00:29:11 --> 00:29:13 i I've heard so much about it through my
00:29:13 --> 00:29:16 entire life and um yeah I think I think
00:29:16 --> 00:29:17 it's going to be really interesting to
00:29:17 --> 00:29:22 to just understand it more and find out
00:29:22 --> 00:29:24 uh all everything about it but yeah
00:29:24 --> 00:29:27 that'll be fun um so thanks uh Fred
00:29:27 --> 00:29:29 we'll see you soon and uh thanks to
00:29:29 --> 00:29:31 Heidi for stepping in thanks to Hugh in
00:29:31 --> 00:29:33 the studio who couldn't be with us today
00:29:33 --> 00:29:36 because he's hypothetical and from me
00:29:36 --> 00:29:38 Andrew Dunley thanks for your company
00:29:38 --> 00:29:41 see you real soon on another episode of
00:29:41 --> 00:29:44 Space Nuts bye-bye space nuts you'll be
00:29:44 --> 00:29:48 listening to the Space Nuts podcast
00:29:48 --> 00:29:51 available at Apple Podcasts Spotify
00:29:51 --> 00:29:53 iHeart Radio or your favorite podcast
00:29:53 --> 00:29:56 player you can also stream on demand
00:29:56 --> 00:29:59 ates.com this has been another quality
00:29:59 --> 00:30:03 podcast production from byes.com