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Theia's Fate, Galactic Mergers, and the Mysteries of Hydrogen
In this captivating Q&A edition of Space Nuts, hosts Andrew Dunkley and Professor Fred Watson tackle a range of intriguing questions from listeners, diving deep into cosmic mysteries and scientific theories. From the fate of the former planet Theia to the dynamics of galaxy mergers and the origins of hydrogen, this episode is packed with insights that will expand your understanding of the universe.
Episode Highlights:
- The Fate of Theia: Rusty from Donnybrook poses a thought-provoking question about Theia, the planet that collided with Earth. Andrew and Fred discuss the most accepted theories regarding Theia's remnants and how they may have been absorbed into Earth's mantle, leaving behind intriguing geological evidence.
- Galaxy Mergers Explained: New listener Melina asks about the merging of spiral galaxies in an expanding universe. The hosts explain how gravity can overcome the universe's expansion on galactic scales, leading to fascinating interactions and eventual mergers between galaxies.
- Olympus Mons and Mars' Atmosphere: Kevin wonders if the colossal eruptions of Olympus Mons could have contributed to Mars' atmospheric loss. Andrew and Fred explore the volcanic activity on Mars and clarify that while Olympus Mons is impressive, the planet's lack of a magnetic field is a more significant factor in its atmospheric decline.
- Hydrogen's Cosmic Origins: Five-year-old Yuki asks why hydrogen is the only element not formed in stars. The hosts explain that hydrogen was created shortly after the Big Bang, making it the most abundant element in the universe, while other elements formed later through stellar processes.
For more Space Nuts, including our continuously updating newsfeed and to listen to all our episodes, visit our website. (https://www.spacenutspodcast.com/) Follow us on social media at SpaceNutsPod on Facebook, Instagram, and more. We love engaging with our community, so be sure to drop us a message or comment on your favorite platform.
If you’d like to help support Space Nuts and join our growing family of insiders for commercial-free episodes and more, visit spacenutspodcast.com/about (https://www.spacenutspodcast.com/about) .
Stay curious, keep looking up, and join us next time for more stellar insights and cosmic wonders. Until then, clear skies and happy stargazing.
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Episode link: https://play.headliner.app/episode/31570932?utm_source=youtube
00:00:00 --> 00:00:02 Hello again. Thanks for joining us on a
00:00:02 --> 00:00:05 Q&A edition of Space Nuts. My name is
00:00:05 --> 00:00:08 Andrew Dunley and today we will be I
00:00:08 --> 00:00:10 won't Fred will be answering questions
00:00:10 --> 00:00:14 about uh the former planet known as
00:00:14 --> 00:00:18 Thea. Uh galaxy merges have come up. Um,
00:00:18 --> 00:00:21 we go back to Mars uh with a theory
00:00:21 --> 00:00:25 about Olympus Mons and why only
00:00:25 --> 00:00:28 hydrogen? That is a question uh that
00:00:28 --> 00:00:30 comes from, I believe, a 5-year-old.
00:00:30 --> 00:00:32 We'll deal with all of that today on
00:00:32 --> 00:00:35 this edition of Space Nuts.
00:00:35 --> 00:00:39 >> 15 seconds. Guidance is internal. 10 9g
00:00:40 --> 00:00:41 Ignition sequence start.
00:00:41 --> 00:00:45 >> Space Nuts. 5 4 3 2
00:00:45 --> 00:00:47 >> 1 2 3 4 5 5 4 3 2 1
00:00:47 --> 00:00:50 >> Space Notes astronauts report at Bills
00:00:50 --> 00:00:51 Good.
00:00:51 --> 00:00:53 >> And to solve all of those little
00:00:53 --> 00:00:54 riddles, we're joined again by Professor
00:00:54 --> 00:00:57 Fred Watson, astronomer at large. Hello,
00:00:57 --> 00:00:58 Fred.
00:00:58 --> 00:01:00 >> Hello, Andrew. Very good to see you
00:01:00 --> 00:01:00 again.
00:01:00 --> 00:01:03 >> Good to see you, too. We've got a bit of
00:01:03 --> 00:01:05 weird noise on your line. I I think it's
00:01:05 --> 00:01:07 probably just the internet being the
00:01:07 --> 00:01:09 internet, so hopefully that'll go away.
00:01:09 --> 00:01:11 >> In fact, it just did. So, yeah. There
00:01:11 --> 00:01:13 you go. solved itself. It must have
00:01:13 --> 00:01:15 heard me winging.
00:01:15 --> 00:01:17 >> All is well, I assume.
00:01:17 --> 00:01:19 >> Uh yeah, we're doing fine. Thank you. Uh
00:01:19 --> 00:01:22 it's good to join you on the questions
00:01:22 --> 00:01:24 episode of uh what's this called again?
00:01:24 --> 00:01:25 Oh, Space Nuts. That's right.
00:01:26 --> 00:01:28 >> Space idiots. Uh Space Nuts. Yes. Yeah.
00:01:28 --> 00:01:31 No, they're all good people. Uh we might
00:01:31 --> 00:01:33 as well jump in straight away to our
00:01:33 --> 00:01:37 first question, and it comes from one of
00:01:37 --> 00:01:39 our regular contributors. It's Rusty.
00:01:39 --> 00:01:42 Good day, Fred and Andrew. It's Rusty in
00:01:42 --> 00:01:45 Donny Brook. I've been listening to your
00:01:45 --> 00:01:47 latest episode
00:01:47 --> 00:01:51 where you look at the relationship
00:01:51 --> 00:01:55 between Sea and the Earth before the
00:01:55 --> 00:01:59 collision. And I just want to make sure
00:01:59 --> 00:02:02 I've got the story straight, so I'll put
00:02:02 --> 00:02:04 it in my own words. The Earth had a
00:02:04 --> 00:02:08 buddy named Thea who came a little too
00:02:08 --> 00:02:12 near. She hit with a splash, then made
00:02:12 --> 00:02:16 off with a dash. But there's no mooning
00:02:16 --> 00:02:19 for Thea around here. So, what happened
00:02:19 --> 00:02:22 to Thea after the collision? The
00:02:22 --> 00:02:26 theories prior to this revelation said
00:02:26 --> 00:02:29 Thea had enough kinetic energy to leave
00:02:29 --> 00:02:31 the solar system altogether. But if the
00:02:31 --> 00:02:33 orbits were so close, that doesn't seem
00:02:33 --> 00:02:37 likely. So, it seems to me there's three
00:02:37 --> 00:02:38 possibilities
00:02:38 --> 00:02:42 that Thea fell into the sun, which would
00:02:42 --> 00:02:47 be another amazing feat to get that uh
00:02:47 --> 00:02:49 sort of precision after the collision.
00:02:49 --> 00:02:52 Sea picked up a little slingshot energy
00:02:52 --> 00:02:57 and moved out further and became Mars.
00:02:57 --> 00:03:01 Now, Mars is a Mars size object after
00:03:01 --> 00:03:03 all. And the third possibility I can
00:03:03 --> 00:03:06 think of is that it picked up an
00:03:06 --> 00:03:10 unlikely amount of kinetic energy and
00:03:10 --> 00:03:11 became
00:03:11 --> 00:03:17 planet 9. So, if it did become planet 9,
00:03:17 --> 00:03:20 it would have a highly eccentric orbit
00:03:20 --> 00:03:22 because it's too far away for us to
00:03:22 --> 00:03:26 actually see at the moment. But would
00:03:26 --> 00:03:30 this orbit then at some stage bring it
00:03:30 --> 00:03:34 back uh to the inner solar system of its
00:03:34 --> 00:03:35 origin?
00:03:35 --> 00:03:38 >> That's it. Hope you guys are well.
00:03:38 --> 00:03:39 Cheers.
00:03:39 --> 00:03:41 >> Thanks, Rusty. Hope you're well, too. Uh
00:03:41 --> 00:03:44 over there in WA. Um what happened to
00:03:44 --> 00:03:45 Thea? He's come up with some interesting
00:03:45 --> 00:03:48 theories. Uh quite a few ideas. I I'm
00:03:48 --> 00:03:52 guessing they can't all be true.
00:03:52 --> 00:03:54 Um, I think that's right. There's
00:03:54 --> 00:03:57 there's actually a fourth possibility
00:03:57 --> 00:04:01 >> uh added to the three that uh that Rusty
00:04:01 --> 00:04:03 has
00:04:03 --> 00:04:05 proposed. Uh, and I think that's the one
00:04:05 --> 00:04:07 that's usually accepted and there's kind
00:04:07 --> 00:04:10 of evidence for that. Uh, the fourth
00:04:10 --> 00:04:14 possibility is that the basically was
00:04:14 --> 00:04:16 absorbed into the earth. the remnants of
00:04:16 --> 00:04:21 the air uh are actually in the earth's
00:04:21 --> 00:04:26 mantle. And in fact uh there's something
00:04:26 --> 00:04:29 called and there are two of these uh a
00:04:29 --> 00:04:33 large low sheer velocity province in the
00:04:33 --> 00:04:37 earth's lower mantle and the hypothesis
00:04:37 --> 00:04:40 is that that is the remnants of the
00:04:40 --> 00:04:42 year. uh so that we still see the
00:04:42 --> 00:04:45 evidence of that collision by anomalies
00:04:45 --> 00:04:49 basically in the earth's mantle which we
00:04:49 --> 00:04:51 investigate seis you know with
00:04:51 --> 00:04:53 seismology that's how we know about
00:04:53 --> 00:04:55 what's going on in the mantle of the
00:04:55 --> 00:04:57 earth it's how we know about large low
00:04:57 --> 00:05:00 sheer velocity provinces um uh I'm kind
00:05:00 --> 00:05:03 of just using the words here because I'm
00:05:03 --> 00:05:05 not somebody who knows about the inside
00:05:05 --> 00:05:07 of the planet uh other than the the the
00:05:07 --> 00:05:10 you know the sketchiest outline uh of a
00:05:10 --> 00:05:13 core, a mantle and uh and a crust. But
00:05:13 --> 00:05:16 uh the mantle we know has significant
00:05:16 --> 00:05:18 structure. Uh and in fact um Manny and I
00:05:18 --> 00:05:23 have a a good friend um who Nick Pford
00:05:23 --> 00:05:26 who is a volcanologist and he's somebody
00:05:26 --> 00:05:29 who looks at these velocity structures
00:05:29 --> 00:05:32 in the uh in the mantle of the earth uh
00:05:32 --> 00:05:35 and you know the the upwelling of
00:05:35 --> 00:05:37 material to form volcanoes and things
00:05:37 --> 00:05:39 like that. Uh next time we see Nick I
00:05:39 --> 00:05:42 will ask him about these large scale low
00:05:42 --> 00:05:46 velocity shear areas uh and uh their
00:05:46 --> 00:05:48 relationship to the but I think that's
00:05:48 --> 00:05:51 the consensus uh Rusty that uh the
00:05:51 --> 00:05:55 impact basically uh resulted in an
00:05:55 --> 00:05:59 explosion uh which shed uh something
00:05:59 --> 00:06:02 like um I think one of the suggestions
00:06:02 --> 00:06:05 is about 70 70%
00:06:05 --> 00:06:10 uh of the mass of the moon uh may have
00:06:10 --> 00:06:14 come from thea. I'm actually um um I
00:06:14 --> 00:06:17 think that might
00:06:17 --> 00:06:19 let's let's put it this way. Thea is
00:06:19 --> 00:06:23 responsible for 70 to 90% of the total
00:06:23 --> 00:06:25 mass of the moon under the classic giant
00:06:25 --> 00:06:28 impact scenario
00:06:28 --> 00:06:30 where thea is considerably smaller than
00:06:30 --> 00:06:32 a proto earth which it would have been.
00:06:32 --> 00:06:35 Uh the earth was still kind of earthish
00:06:35 --> 00:06:39 sized. Thea was Marsish sized. Uh but
00:06:39 --> 00:06:40 the earth would have probably grown a
00:06:40 --> 00:06:44 bit by absorbing uh the debris from the
00:06:44 --> 00:06:45 uh remember that the the mass of the
00:06:46 --> 00:06:48 moon is about 180th of the mass of the
00:06:48 --> 00:06:49 earth.
00:06:49 --> 00:06:51 >> Uh so it's a significantly large body
00:06:51 --> 00:06:53 compared with the other moons in the
00:06:53 --> 00:06:56 solar system. Uh but uh it's it's
00:06:56 --> 00:06:58 clearly smaller than uh you know it's
00:06:58 --> 00:07:02 not Mars sized. And so Rusty's right in
00:07:02 --> 00:07:05 that that, you know, the remnants of the
00:07:05 --> 00:07:07 had to do something, but the current
00:07:07 --> 00:07:09 theory is that they were absorbed by the
00:07:09 --> 00:07:11 proto Earth and we can still see
00:07:11 --> 00:07:12 evidence for them.
00:07:12 --> 00:07:15 >> Yeah. Um
00:07:15 --> 00:07:18 Okay. So yeah, definitely not likely to
00:07:18 --> 00:07:22 be P9. That would be a very
00:07:22 --> 00:07:25 odd kind of occurrence, wouldn't it?
00:07:25 --> 00:07:28 >> Yeah. Well, yes. Um I I think the
00:07:28 --> 00:07:31 kinematics don't work. you you you know
00:07:31 --> 00:07:33 you you you can't give it enough
00:07:33 --> 00:07:35 velocity and you need you need a lot of
00:07:36 --> 00:07:37 velocity for it to fall back into the
00:07:37 --> 00:07:39 sun as well too too much energy that's
00:07:40 --> 00:07:43 quite an energetic process is is getting
00:07:43 --> 00:07:45 rid of the orbital velocity of a body to
00:07:45 --> 00:07:47 make it fall into the sun it's you know
00:07:47 --> 00:07:49 you need as much energy as you do to get
00:07:49 --> 00:07:52 it pushed out uh to the outer planet so
00:07:52 --> 00:07:55 >> yeah um didn't we talk about it once
00:07:55 --> 00:07:57 before and suggest that remnants of it
00:07:57 --> 00:07:59 just probably speared off into case
00:07:59 --> 00:08:00 never to be seen again. I
00:08:00 --> 00:08:02 >> I'm sure there would have been an
00:08:02 --> 00:08:04 element of that. Yes. And you know that
00:08:04 --> 00:08:06 that debris cloud that eventually formed
00:08:06 --> 00:08:08 the moon probably lost some of its some
00:08:08 --> 00:08:12 of its uh material content. Uh and it
00:08:12 --> 00:08:14 there may even be stuff wandering around
00:08:14 --> 00:08:16 uh in the form of nearear asteroids now
00:08:16 --> 00:08:18 that are bits and pieces that are left
00:08:18 --> 00:08:20 over from that. But remember this was
00:08:20 --> 00:08:23 you know this was within the first
00:08:23 --> 00:08:24 couple hundred million years of the
00:08:24 --> 00:08:27 history of the solar system. So, you're
00:08:27 --> 00:08:28 talking about things that happened a
00:08:28 --> 00:08:30 very long time ago.
00:08:30 --> 00:08:33 >> Yeah, indeed. Um, I'm I'm wondering,
00:08:33 --> 00:08:36 Fred, why we've just got this sudden
00:08:36 --> 00:08:39 influx of people asking questions in
00:08:39 --> 00:08:44 poem. This is I'm blaming uh Martin for
00:08:44 --> 00:08:46 that. Martin Burman Gorvine, you started
00:08:46 --> 00:08:48 this and now it's taking
00:08:48 --> 00:08:51 >> I actually think um I I I really liked
00:08:51 --> 00:08:53 Russ Rusty's one there about the I
00:08:53 --> 00:08:54 thought that was very nice.
00:08:54 --> 00:08:55 >> Yeah. I don't know. I think he pushed it
00:08:55 --> 00:08:57 a bit on one of those one of those
00:08:57 --> 00:09:00 rhymes. Yeah. Um although there there
00:09:00 --> 00:09:01 was a regular guest and I'm sure you
00:09:01 --> 00:09:03 know who I'm talking about. Cole Wilson
00:09:03 --> 00:09:04 who used to join us on the radio once a
00:09:04 --> 00:09:07 week to do um bush poetry.
00:09:07 --> 00:09:09 >> She blew the sheer and he often got
00:09:09 --> 00:09:11 asked to do shearing demonstrations and
00:09:11 --> 00:09:12 he had to tell them look I'm not a
00:09:12 --> 00:09:15 sheer. I can't shear a sheep to save my
00:09:15 --> 00:09:18 life. It's just my show name. But he he
00:09:18 --> 00:09:22 used to actually invent words to create
00:09:22 --> 00:09:24 rhymes.
00:09:24 --> 00:09:27 It was one of his wonderful traits and
00:09:27 --> 00:09:29 um yeah uh I used to spend a lot of time
00:09:29 --> 00:09:32 with Cole. He's a terrific bloke. Um I
00:09:32 --> 00:09:35 think we've dealt with Rusty's uh
00:09:35 --> 00:09:38 theories and they were all wrong.
00:09:38 --> 00:09:39 >> Thanks Rusty.
00:09:39 --> 00:09:43 >> Thanks Rusty. Great to hear from you.
00:09:43 --> 00:09:44 Let's take a break from the show to tell
00:09:44 --> 00:09:47 you about our sponsor incogn. Now, if
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00:10:52 --> 00:10:55 And here's the kicker. 60% off if you
00:10:55 --> 00:10:58 use the code word spacenuts. That's
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00:11:05 --> 00:11:08 nuts. Enjoy a peaceful online existence
00:11:08 --> 00:11:11 without digital disturbance.
00:11:11 --> 00:11:13 >> Swift
00:11:13 --> 00:11:16 base here. The angle has landed.
00:11:16 --> 00:11:17 >> Space nets.
00:11:17 --> 00:11:19 >> Let's move on to our next question and
00:11:19 --> 00:11:22 this one I've lost. Uh here it is. Uh
00:11:22 --> 00:11:24 this comes from Lena. I am a new
00:11:24 --> 00:11:27 listener and not as hardcore a space nut
00:11:27 --> 00:11:30 as most of your audience. Uh it's
00:11:30 --> 00:11:32 probably a good thing. Uh but I saw an
00:11:32 --> 00:11:34 article today talking about merging
00:11:34 --> 00:11:36 spiral galaxies. If the universe is
00:11:36 --> 00:11:38 expanding, how does something as large
00:11:38 --> 00:11:42 as a galaxy move toward and merge with
00:11:42 --> 00:11:44 another galaxy? It seems they should be
00:11:44 --> 00:11:46 moving further away from each other. Uh
00:11:46 --> 00:11:48 that comes from Molina in British
00:11:48 --> 00:11:53 Columbia in Canada. Uh I think we've had
00:11:53 --> 00:11:55 questions of this ilk before, but it's
00:11:55 --> 00:11:57 always good to go over it again because
00:11:57 --> 00:11:59 there's a lot more going on in the
00:11:59 --> 00:12:01 universe than just, you know, spreading
00:12:01 --> 00:12:04 out like school children playing what's
00:12:04 --> 00:12:06 that game where you don't, you know, I
00:12:06 --> 00:12:08 don't know what you call it. Um
00:12:08 --> 00:12:09 something you throw a ball and try and
00:12:09 --> 00:12:12 hit someone in the head. Anyway, go on.
00:12:12 --> 00:12:14 That's cricket, isn't it?
00:12:14 --> 00:12:18 >> No. No. Dodgeball. Dodgeball. And And
00:12:18 --> 00:12:20 there's a whole bunch of games like
00:12:20 --> 00:12:22 that. Like, uh, Red Rover Crossover. Did
00:12:22 --> 00:12:23 you ever play that?
00:12:23 --> 00:12:26 >> Uh, we Oh, no. We used to have a lot of
00:12:26 --> 00:12:28 fun with that.
00:12:28 --> 00:12:31 >> Um, anyway, uh, look, Lena's question is
00:12:31 --> 00:12:34 a great one. And I I guess the the
00:12:34 --> 00:12:36 simplest answer here is that yes,
00:12:36 --> 00:12:39 galaxies are big, but they're tiny
00:12:39 --> 00:12:43 compared with the universe. And so the
00:12:43 --> 00:12:44 expansion of the universe is something
00:12:44 --> 00:12:48 that we look at on very large scales.
00:12:48 --> 00:12:50 You know, you're looking out billions of
00:12:50 --> 00:12:53 light years uh and seeing this
00:12:53 --> 00:12:56 expansion. It's actually with today's
00:12:56 --> 00:12:57 technology, it's one of the easiest
00:12:57 --> 00:13:00 observations that you can make uh that
00:13:00 --> 00:13:02 the universe is expanding. Discovered um
00:13:02 --> 00:13:06 back in 1929 by Edwin Hubble. Uh so uh
00:13:06 --> 00:13:08 yes so if the universe is expanding, if
00:13:08 --> 00:13:11 space is getting bigger and naturally
00:13:11 --> 00:13:12 carrying things further and further
00:13:12 --> 00:13:14 apart, why are some galaxies coming
00:13:14 --> 00:13:16 towards each other? And it's because on
00:13:16 --> 00:13:19 the scale of a galaxy, the expansion of
00:13:19 --> 00:13:23 the universe is minuscule. Uh and the by
00:13:23 --> 00:13:26 far the dominant um the dominant process
00:13:26 --> 00:13:30 is gravity. Uh so um galaxies which yes
00:13:30 --> 00:13:34 are being carried uh gradually apart by
00:13:34 --> 00:13:36 the by the expansion of the universe
00:13:36 --> 00:13:38 when you put them close together their
00:13:38 --> 00:13:40 own gravity gives them a force that
00:13:40 --> 00:13:43 pulls them together that's much greater
00:13:43 --> 00:13:46 uh than the expansion. Um and we
00:13:46 --> 00:13:48 actually give that a name. We call this
00:13:48 --> 00:13:51 the peculiar velocities of galaxies
00:13:51 --> 00:13:52 because it's a velocity peculiar to an
00:13:52 --> 00:13:55 individual galaxy. And the usual way
00:13:55 --> 00:13:57 that we describe it and I think we've
00:13:57 --> 00:13:59 talked about this before on space nuts
00:13:59 --> 00:14:04 is um if you imagine a river flowing uh
00:14:04 --> 00:14:06 which represents the kind of expansion
00:14:06 --> 00:14:08 of the universe and then somebody in a
00:14:08 --> 00:14:10 boat is moving around on the river.
00:14:10 --> 00:14:12 They're being carried downstream by the
00:14:12 --> 00:14:14 river's movement but they've got their
00:14:14 --> 00:14:16 own movement provided by the boat on the
00:14:16 --> 00:14:19 water. Uh and it's a bit like that with
00:14:19 --> 00:14:21 galaxies. They're being carried along by
00:14:21 --> 00:14:23 the expansion of the universe. But a far
00:14:23 --> 00:14:25 bigger effect is the way gravity pulls
00:14:25 --> 00:14:28 them together. So that's what's pulling
00:14:28 --> 00:14:30 our galaxy and the Andromeda galaxy
00:14:30 --> 00:14:32 together. Uh it's the gravitational
00:14:32 --> 00:14:35 force between them. Uh and on the scale
00:14:35 --> 00:14:38 of the distance between uh Andromeda and
00:14:38 --> 00:14:39 our own galaxy, which is about two and a
00:14:39 --> 00:14:41 half million light years. Uh the
00:14:41 --> 00:14:43 expansion of the universe makes
00:14:43 --> 00:14:45 virtually no difference. Uh you only
00:14:45 --> 00:14:47 start really noticing it when you get to
00:14:47 --> 00:14:49 much bigger bigger scales. Yeah, but
00:14:49 --> 00:14:52 there will come a point in time where
00:14:52 --> 00:14:55 all these galaxy merges will finish.
00:14:55 --> 00:14:57 They'll be done and dusted and the
00:14:57 --> 00:14:59 universe will keep expanding and
00:14:59 --> 00:15:02 eventually there'll just be darkness.
00:15:02 --> 00:15:03 There'll be nothing.
00:15:04 --> 00:15:07 >> Yeah. If that's assuming dark energy,
00:15:07 --> 00:15:08 >> a big crunch. Oh, right.
00:15:08 --> 00:15:10 >> Yeah. I mean, dark energy, we're now
00:15:10 --> 00:15:12 just starting to see the first signs
00:15:12 --> 00:15:14 that maybe over the last few billion
00:15:14 --> 00:15:17 years it's decreased. uh and so the
00:15:17 --> 00:15:19 acceleration of the universe it's still
00:15:19 --> 00:15:21 accelerating the expansion is still
00:15:21 --> 00:15:24 getting faster but it's getting faster
00:15:24 --> 00:15:27 at a slower rate if I put it that way.
00:15:27 --> 00:15:29 So the acceleration itself looks as
00:15:29 --> 00:15:31 though it's declining and that's why
00:15:31 --> 00:15:33 some people are still talking about the
00:15:33 --> 00:15:36 big crunch or the gab gib again. Um it's
00:15:36 --> 00:15:38 uh it's because if it if the
00:15:38 --> 00:15:40 acceleration eventually goes away and
00:15:40 --> 00:15:42 becomes a deceleration then yeah you're
00:15:42 --> 00:15:44 going to get a big crunch.
00:15:44 --> 00:15:46 >> Yeah. Yeah. It's, you know, could go
00:15:46 --> 00:15:48 either way at this stage. The way that
00:15:48 --> 00:15:52 they're talking, we we have witnessed um
00:15:52 --> 00:15:54 some galaxy merges, haven't we? Doesn't
00:15:54 --> 00:15:56 our own galaxy actually contain a couple
00:15:56 --> 00:15:59 of other galaxies that have been sucked
00:15:59 --> 00:16:00 into our void.
00:16:00 --> 00:16:02 >> Yeah. Two quite big ones actually. What
00:16:02 --> 00:16:04 the things we call the large and small
00:16:04 --> 00:16:08 melanic clouds. Uh they are satellite
00:16:08 --> 00:16:09 galaxies of our own and they're being
00:16:09 --> 00:16:12 stripped of their stars by uh our own
00:16:12 --> 00:16:15 galaxy. its gravitational pool uh and
00:16:15 --> 00:16:17 will eventually be part of the halo of
00:16:17 --> 00:16:21 our own galaxy. But we see we also see
00:16:21 --> 00:16:24 examples in deep space of big galaxies
00:16:24 --> 00:16:26 actually merging. The most famous is the
00:16:26 --> 00:16:29 the antenna galaxies, two galaxies which
00:16:29 --> 00:16:32 are merging and pulling off spiral arms
00:16:32 --> 00:16:35 off each other quite a fashion.
00:16:35 --> 00:16:37 >> Yeah, it all happens in slow motion
00:16:37 --> 00:16:39 though, doesn't it? and um and and and
00:16:40 --> 00:16:41 when people talk, you know, think about
00:16:41 --> 00:16:43 galaxy merger merges, they're thinking
00:16:43 --> 00:16:46 all this um drama and collisions and but
00:16:46 --> 00:16:48 it it generally doesn't turn out that
00:16:48 --> 00:16:50 way. Well, you're talking about
00:16:50 --> 00:16:52 processes that take millions of years
00:16:52 --> 00:16:54 and uh
00:16:54 --> 00:16:56 >> yeah, and um you know, it's and and in
00:16:56 --> 00:16:59 fact galaxies probably when they
00:16:59 --> 00:17:01 collide, you don't get stars actually
00:17:01 --> 00:17:02 colliding because there's so much space
00:17:02 --> 00:17:04 between the stars, but what you get is
00:17:04 --> 00:17:07 the effect of clouds of gas colliding
00:17:07 --> 00:17:10 and that spawns new star formation. So,
00:17:10 --> 00:17:12 uh you might get lots of hot young stars
00:17:12 --> 00:17:14 being born in a in a galaxy collision.
00:17:14 --> 00:17:17 >> All right, here's my horrible attempt at
00:17:17 --> 00:17:18 poetry. It's more of a dance than a
00:17:18 --> 00:17:20 glance. Boom.
00:17:20 --> 00:17:21 >> Oh, I like that.
00:17:21 --> 00:17:21 >> Yeah.
00:17:22 --> 00:17:23 >> Yeah, it is actually. That's exactly
00:17:24 --> 00:17:25 what it is. Yeah.
00:17:25 --> 00:17:27 >> There. There we go. All right. Hope that
00:17:27 --> 00:17:29 answered your question, Lena. Thanks for
00:17:29 --> 00:17:31 sending it in and um thanks for
00:17:31 --> 00:17:33 listening to Space Nuts, which is what
00:17:33 --> 00:17:34 you're doing right now with Andrew
00:17:34 --> 00:17:38 Dunley and Professor Fret Watson.
00:17:38 --> 00:17:41 >> We choose to go to the moon in this
00:17:41 --> 00:17:43 decade and do the other things, not
00:17:43 --> 00:17:45 because they are easy, but because they
00:17:45 --> 00:17:48 are hard. these nuts.
00:17:48 --> 00:17:52 >> And now our next question comes from
00:17:52 --> 00:17:54 Kevin and he said, "I've been listening
00:17:54 --> 00:17:57 with much learning and enjoyment to all
00:17:57 --> 00:17:59 the previous podcasts. I'm about halfway
00:17:59 --> 00:18:01 through them." So he's at around 200
00:18:01 --> 00:18:04 nearly 300, I imagine. So let's just
00:18:04 --> 00:18:08 wait for him to catch up.
00:18:08 --> 00:18:10 He says, "Uh, your your discussions of
00:18:10 --> 00:18:13 Mars and its lack of atmosphere made me
00:18:13 --> 00:18:16 wonder if perhaps what must have been an
00:18:16 --> 00:18:18 enormous eruption of Olympus Olympus
00:18:18 --> 00:18:21 Mons is what might have killed the
00:18:21 --> 00:18:23 planet or at least its atmosphere." That
00:18:23 --> 00:18:28 comes from Kevin. Uh so yeah, I I um I
00:18:28 --> 00:18:30 I'm very impressed by Olympus Mons
00:18:30 --> 00:18:32 because it is the biggest volcano in the
00:18:32 --> 00:18:37 solar system and uh it it's staggeringly
00:18:37 --> 00:18:41 huge. But uh could could a uh an Olympus
00:18:41 --> 00:18:43 Mons eruption have have stripped the
00:18:43 --> 00:18:46 atmosphere of Mars?
00:18:46 --> 00:18:51 >> Um probably not. Uh the I mean the the
00:18:51 --> 00:18:53 the eruptions of Olympus Mons would
00:18:53 --> 00:18:57 certainly have sent a lot of gas into
00:18:57 --> 00:19:01 the atmosphere. Um it it Olympus Mons
00:19:01 --> 00:19:03 has probably taken a long long time to
00:19:03 --> 00:19:07 grow. Uh it's you know it would have had
00:19:07 --> 00:19:09 uh eruptions kind of like some of the
00:19:09 --> 00:19:12 bigger volcanoes on Earth. Uh and they
00:19:12 --> 00:19:15 took a long long time. So it's not like
00:19:15 --> 00:19:18 one big explosion. Um, and that's why
00:19:18 --> 00:19:20 Olympus Mons is so high. It's because
00:19:20 --> 00:19:23 it's over a hot spot in Mars's mantle.
00:19:23 --> 00:19:26 Uh, that just keeps on pushing out
00:19:26 --> 00:19:27 material or did for a long period of
00:19:28 --> 00:19:29 time. Uh, and without the plate
00:19:30 --> 00:19:32 tectonics that carry this the surface
00:19:32 --> 00:19:34 crust over the hot spot and results in a
00:19:34 --> 00:19:36 chain of volcanoes like we see in
00:19:36 --> 00:19:39 Hawaii, uh, it all built this one big
00:19:39 --> 00:19:42 volcano. So, it's a process that took a
00:19:42 --> 00:19:45 long time and maybe it did play a role
00:19:45 --> 00:19:49 in the the changes in Mars's atmosphere.
00:19:49 --> 00:19:52 But we think the main reason why Mars
00:19:52 --> 00:19:55 lost its atmosphere is because it is a
00:19:55 --> 00:19:58 world that is too small to sustain plate
00:19:58 --> 00:20:00 tectonics. It doesn't have a magnetic
00:20:00 --> 00:20:03 field. So, the subatomic particles from
00:20:03 --> 00:20:04 the sun bombard the atmosphere
00:20:04 --> 00:20:06 continuously. And we think that's one of
00:20:06 --> 00:20:09 the main reasons why uh why it
00:20:09 --> 00:20:11 eventually lost lost its atmosphere. I
00:20:11 --> 00:20:12 mean it's not lost altogether. It's
00:20:12 --> 00:20:15 still got 6 of a percent of the earth's
00:20:15 --> 00:20:16 atmospheric pressure at the surface.
00:20:16 --> 00:20:19 That's enough for winds to blow uh and
00:20:19 --> 00:20:21 um you know to to sort of blow dust
00:20:21 --> 00:20:23 clouds onto solar panels of spacecraft
00:20:23 --> 00:20:26 and things of that sort. But it's
00:20:26 --> 00:20:27 certainly not an atmosphere that we
00:20:28 --> 00:20:30 would recognize as being similar to
00:20:30 --> 00:20:32 Earth's. So um I think I think it's a
00:20:32 --> 00:20:34 good question actually. Um, I think
00:20:34 --> 00:20:37 Olympus Mons and the neighboring
00:20:37 --> 00:20:39 volcanoes, there's there's more than one
00:20:39 --> 00:20:41 big volcano there. Olympus Mons is the
00:20:41 --> 00:20:43 biggest. They probably would have
00:20:43 --> 00:20:45 affected the atmosphere of Mars, but
00:20:45 --> 00:20:46 they're probably not the root cause
00:20:46 --> 00:20:48 while why the atmosphere drifted into
00:20:48 --> 00:20:49 space.
00:20:49 --> 00:20:53 >> Yeah, it's more likely it was because
00:20:53 --> 00:20:55 Mars just couldn't hold itself together,
00:20:55 --> 00:20:59 basically. Um, it it didn't have the uh
00:20:59 --> 00:21:01 the gravity. Um
00:21:01 --> 00:21:04 >> it's yeah it it it doesn't have the
00:21:04 --> 00:21:08 gravity uh to keep it hot enough to
00:21:08 --> 00:21:11 sustain plate tectonics or a magnetic
00:21:11 --> 00:21:13 dynamo basically which gives it a
00:21:13 --> 00:21:14 magnetic field.
00:21:14 --> 00:21:17 >> Yeah. But Olympus Mons is fascinating
00:21:17 --> 00:21:19 for a few reasons. I correct me if I'm
00:21:19 --> 00:21:22 wrong but I think right now as Mars is
00:21:22 --> 00:21:26 uh Olympus Mons summit actually peaks
00:21:26 --> 00:21:28 out of the atmosphere. Is that right?
00:21:28 --> 00:21:30 It's sticking up that high. Uh yeah, no
00:21:30 --> 00:21:33 it's certainly I mean the atmosphere is
00:21:33 --> 00:21:35 like Earth's atmosphere. It gradually
00:21:35 --> 00:21:38 disappears as you go higher. Uh but
00:21:38 --> 00:21:40 yeah, I mean effectively the summit is
00:21:40 --> 00:21:42 the pressure will be considerably lower
00:21:42 --> 00:21:44 there than it is down at the what you
00:21:44 --> 00:21:46 might call the surface of Mars.
00:21:46 --> 00:21:49 >> This is one honking big shield volcano
00:21:49 --> 00:21:52 though, isn't it? Like 21
00:21:52 --> 00:21:56 kilometers in height. Uh 13.2 2 milesi
00:21:56 --> 00:21:59 or 69
00:21:59 --> 00:22:01 ft.
00:22:01 --> 00:22:02 Uh, someone's going to climb that one
00:22:02 --> 00:22:05 day and um, stick a flag in it. Uh, it's
00:22:05 --> 00:22:07 2 and a half times the elevation of
00:22:07 --> 00:22:09 Mount Everest. And and this is something
00:22:09 --> 00:22:11 about Mars that astounds me. It's a
00:22:11 --> 00:22:13 smaller planet, but all its features
00:22:14 --> 00:22:16 geographically just make ours look like
00:22:16 --> 00:22:20 tiddlywinks. Um, and it's its span is
00:22:20 --> 00:22:22 600 kilometers.
00:22:22 --> 00:22:24 >> 600 kilometers wide.
00:22:24 --> 00:22:26 >> Yep. That's that's extra. I just can't
00:22:26 --> 00:22:28 imagine it. I' I'd love to be able to
00:22:28 --> 00:22:30 stand there and have a look in my last
00:22:30 --> 00:22:32 five seconds of life because I didn't
00:22:32 --> 00:22:35 take my breathing apparatus. But um it
00:22:35 --> 00:22:38 it is it is an amazing world.
00:22:38 --> 00:22:40 >> It's got um cliffs as well around its
00:22:40 --> 00:22:42 base which are pretty spectacular. I
00:22:42 --> 00:22:45 think they're kilometers high as well.
00:22:45 --> 00:22:48 So, you know, it's Yes. Quite quite
00:22:48 --> 00:22:51 quite a an extraordinary world.
00:22:51 --> 00:22:53 >> Yeah. Well, the caldera itself is 50
00:22:54 --> 00:22:55 miles across
00:22:55 --> 00:22:57 >> and you compare that to Kilaweo which is
00:22:57 --> 00:23:01 like a couple of miles across. It's it's
00:23:01 --> 00:23:04 amazing. Um, no, I love that question
00:23:04 --> 00:23:06 and um, yeah, good thinking, but uh,
00:23:06 --> 00:23:07 probably not. And it it it sort of
00:23:07 --> 00:23:10 brings back the same argument on Earth
00:23:10 --> 00:23:11 that people say our global warming is
00:23:12 --> 00:23:14 caused by volcanoes and cows. It's got
00:23:14 --> 00:23:15 nothing to do with, you know, the
00:23:15 --> 00:23:17 billions of cars that we're driving
00:23:17 --> 00:23:19 around every day. But, uh, I think
00:23:19 --> 00:23:23 they've proven that's just not the case
00:23:23 --> 00:23:26 as far as I'm aware. Um, thanks for your
00:23:26 --> 00:23:28 question, Kevin. Lovely to hear from
00:23:28 --> 00:23:32 you. Our final question comes from Yuki.
00:23:32 --> 00:23:35 Hi, I'm Yuki. I am 5 years old and I
00:23:35 --> 00:23:37 live in Canra. Uh, we listen to your
00:23:38 --> 00:23:39 podcast nearly every day. My question
00:23:39 --> 00:23:43 is, why is hydrogen the only element
00:23:43 --> 00:23:45 that isn't made in stars? Why was
00:23:46 --> 00:23:48 hydrogen the only element around just
00:23:48 --> 00:23:52 after the big bang and not others?
00:23:52 --> 00:23:56 >> Yeah, that's a great question. Uh and uh
00:23:56 --> 00:23:59 congratulations to Yuki on being able to
00:23:59 --> 00:24:01 even think of a question like that at
00:24:01 --> 00:24:02 the age of five because I certainly
00:24:02 --> 00:24:03 wouldn't have been able.
00:24:03 --> 00:24:05 >> No, I wouldn't either. I was still
00:24:05 --> 00:24:08 trying to fix the wheel on my Tonka toy.
00:24:08 --> 00:24:11 >> Yes, that's right. think I was at that
00:24:11 --> 00:24:15 level. And the look the the bottom line
00:24:15 --> 00:24:17 is that hydrogen
00:24:17 --> 00:24:20 uh it was created in the aftermath of
00:24:20 --> 00:24:22 the big bang. I think sort of 3 minutes
00:24:22 --> 00:24:25 after the big bang, the temperature had
00:24:25 --> 00:24:27 cooled enough that you could start to
00:24:27 --> 00:24:29 form atoms.
00:24:29 --> 00:24:33 >> Um and the the atom that was was
00:24:34 --> 00:24:35 produced was the simplest. It's one
00:24:35 --> 00:24:38 proton. uh it's the simplest atomic
00:24:38 --> 00:24:43 nucleus. And so uh that was what
00:24:43 --> 00:24:47 basically condensed out of the uh of the
00:24:47 --> 00:24:50 of the aftermath of the big bang as as
00:24:50 --> 00:24:54 energy became matter. You got protons
00:24:54 --> 00:24:58 forming and hydrogen is protons. Uh in
00:24:58 --> 00:25:03 fact in that same period uh you also got
00:25:03 --> 00:25:05 the start of the process that does
00:25:05 --> 00:25:08 produce other elements in stars what we
00:25:08 --> 00:25:12 call nucleioynthesis where the nuclei of
00:25:12 --> 00:25:14 atoms the centers of the atoms stick
00:25:14 --> 00:25:17 together um and it did that process did
00:25:17 --> 00:25:19 start so I think I can't remember the
00:25:19 --> 00:25:21 percentage it's something like 20% I
00:25:21 --> 00:25:23 think of the aftermath of the big bang
00:25:23 --> 00:25:27 is helium which is the next most complex
00:25:27 --> 00:25:31 at atomic nucleus um and formed by
00:25:31 --> 00:25:34 hydrogen atoms coming together. But then
00:25:34 --> 00:25:36 uh the temperature dropped far enough
00:25:36 --> 00:25:40 that you didn't get the extension of
00:25:40 --> 00:25:44 that process into the formation of other
00:25:44 --> 00:25:49 atoms. Um, so it basically had to wait
00:25:49 --> 00:25:53 until stars started to form because of
00:25:53 --> 00:25:55 the gravitational pull of these clouds
00:25:55 --> 00:25:58 of hydrogen together. Uh, that raised
00:25:58 --> 00:26:01 the temperature again enough to start
00:26:01 --> 00:26:05 forming other elements. Um, and so that
00:26:05 --> 00:26:07 that's basically what it's all about.
00:26:07 --> 00:26:09 It's just the simplest of atoms is the
00:26:09 --> 00:26:11 hydrogen atom. That is why that was
00:26:11 --> 00:26:14 created. uh and and you know we nearly
00:26:14 --> 00:26:17 got more more uh elements being created
00:26:17 --> 00:26:21 in the big bang uh but only uh helium
00:26:21 --> 00:26:23 actually there's a bit of lithium and
00:26:23 --> 00:26:27 other stuff as well tiny amounts uh of
00:26:27 --> 00:26:31 of other nuclei but um it it it's true
00:26:31 --> 00:26:33 to say that the star formation star
00:26:34 --> 00:26:37 formation and the interiors of stars is
00:26:37 --> 00:26:39 what led to the huge array of elements
00:26:40 --> 00:26:41 that we see now all the elements of the
00:26:41 --> 00:26:43 periodic table.
00:26:43 --> 00:26:44 >> Thanks Ricky. That's a fantastic
00:26:44 --> 00:26:45 question.
00:26:45 --> 00:26:45 >> It is.
00:26:46 --> 00:26:47 >> When when you look at the the the list
00:26:47 --> 00:26:51 of the top 10 gases in the universe by
00:26:51 --> 00:26:53 order of concentration,
00:26:53 --> 00:26:55 hydrogen is far and away the most
00:26:55 --> 00:26:59 dominant with um 74 to 75% of what they
00:27:00 --> 00:27:02 describe as barionic mass.
00:27:02 --> 00:27:06 >> Helium at 24 to 25%. Which leaves almost
00:27:06 --> 00:27:08 no room for anything else. Oxygen is
00:27:08 --> 00:27:10 less than 1%, carbon less than half a
00:27:10 --> 00:27:14 percent, neon less than 0.1. Um, and
00:27:14 --> 00:27:17 then it just dwindles away. At number
00:27:17 --> 00:27:21 10, you got sulfur at 0.00 uh 044%
00:27:21 --> 00:27:23 concentration.
00:27:23 --> 00:27:24 Um,
00:27:24 --> 00:27:27 it it it's staggering numbers when you
00:27:27 --> 00:27:28 really
00:27:28 --> 00:27:30 >> Yeah. So,
00:27:30 --> 00:27:31 >> go down the list.
00:27:31 --> 00:27:33 >> The bottom line is that the the big bang
00:27:33 --> 00:27:36 hydrogen is still around. In fact, it it
00:27:36 --> 00:27:39 makes up quite a large percentage of the
00:27:39 --> 00:27:41 atoms in your body as well.
00:27:41 --> 00:27:44 >> Yeah. Yeah. I um Well, it's everywhere,
00:27:44 --> 00:27:47 isn't it? Um and
00:27:47 --> 00:27:49 >> that that's the bottom line. And and the
00:27:49 --> 00:27:51 the way the Big Bang happened and
00:27:51 --> 00:27:54 everything that went on afterwards, um
00:27:54 --> 00:27:56 you know, if one smidgy little thing
00:27:56 --> 00:27:57 didn't happen, we probably wouldn't be
00:27:58 --> 00:27:58 here.
00:27:58 --> 00:27:59 >> Yeah,
00:27:59 --> 00:28:02 >> that's right. H it's a scary thought but
00:28:02 --> 00:28:04 then again uh there's so much we don't
00:28:04 --> 00:28:05 know.
00:28:06 --> 00:28:08 >> People believe in believe in multiverses
00:28:08 --> 00:28:11 because um they say you know the
00:28:11 --> 00:28:14 conditions are exactly right for life to
00:28:14 --> 00:28:16 form in our universe and they might not
00:28:16 --> 00:28:17 have be.
00:28:17 --> 00:28:17 >> Yeah.
00:28:17 --> 00:28:18 >> So maybe there are lots of other
00:28:18 --> 00:28:22 universes where life didn't form.
00:28:22 --> 00:28:24 >> Well yeah that the the mathematics
00:28:24 --> 00:28:26 supports the theory, doesn't it?
00:28:26 --> 00:28:28 >> Yeah.
00:28:28 --> 00:28:31 >> Oh gosh. It's the brain hurting part of
00:28:31 --> 00:28:33 the show just happened. So anyway, um
00:28:33 --> 00:28:34 yeah,
00:28:34 --> 00:28:36 it it just keeps us thinking and it
00:28:36 --> 00:28:38 keeps us looking for answers and that's
00:28:38 --> 00:28:40 what it's all about. Yuki, great to hear
00:28:40 --> 00:28:43 from you and hope all is well in Canra.
00:28:43 --> 00:28:45 And a reminder, if you would like to
00:28:45 --> 00:28:47 send us questions, uh we welcome them
00:28:47 --> 00:28:49 with open arms. You can send them
00:28:49 --> 00:28:52 through our website spacenuts.io
00:28:52 --> 00:28:54 and just click on the ask me anything
00:28:54 --> 00:28:58 link at the top. it says AMA and we will
00:28:58 --> 00:29:00 do our best. Don't forget to tell us who
00:29:00 --> 00:29:03 you are and where you're from and we
00:29:03 --> 00:29:05 will um put your question on if we
00:29:05 --> 00:29:07 haven't had it before. And even if we
00:29:07 --> 00:29:09 have, we might uh revisit them. We do
00:29:10 --> 00:29:12 that from time to time. Uh keep them
00:29:12 --> 00:29:14 coming. And if you haven't asked a
00:29:14 --> 00:29:15 question before and you've always wanted
00:29:15 --> 00:29:17 to, please send it in. We we'd love to
00:29:18 --> 00:29:20 hear from you. And um we're just about
00:29:20 --> 00:29:23 done. Fred, thank you very much.
00:29:23 --> 00:29:25 >> Uh great pleasure, Andrew. always good
00:29:25 --> 00:29:28 and uh hopefully we'll chat again soon.
00:29:28 --> 00:29:30 >> I hope so. That'll be good. Professor
00:29:30 --> 00:29:32 Fred Watson, astronomer at large and
00:29:32 --> 00:29:34 thanks to Hugh in the studio who didn't
00:29:34 --> 00:29:35 have a hydrogen problem, but he did have
00:29:36 --> 00:29:38 a methane problem, but he'll be out of
00:29:38 --> 00:29:39 emergency surgery very, very soon,
00:29:40 --> 00:29:41 hopefully for next week's episode. And
00:29:41 --> 00:29:42 for me, Andrew Dunley, thanks for your
00:29:42 --> 00:29:44 company. Catch you on the next episode
00:29:44 --> 00:29:47 of Space Nuts. Bye-bye.
00:29:47 --> 00:29:49 >> Space Nuts. You'll be listening to the
00:29:49 --> 00:29:52 Space Nuts podcast
00:29:52 --> 00:29:55 >> available at Apple Podcasts, Spotify,
00:29:55 --> 00:29:58 iHeart Radio, or your favorite podcast
00:29:58 --> 00:30:00 player. You can also stream on demand at
00:30:00 --> 00:30:03 byes.com. This has been another quality
00:30:03 --> 00:30:07 podcast production from byes.com.